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Selloum

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Hi,

Does anyone know how long it should take to carbonate flavored soda? I heard it can take a while due to the amount of sugar dissolved in the liquid.
I've been carbonating since Saturday at about 45 PSI between 0ºC to 2ºC. There are some faint bubbles but not enough to make it a good drink. I've also applied force carbonation tricks you see on the internet (i.e. shake, etc). I've also read people carbonating water before adding the syrup to the keg. Has anyone tried carbonating flavored soda in 2L bottles and then adding it to the keg instead? I can carbonate in 2L bottles in a matter of mins to hours and figured I could add that to the keg and carbonate maybe for another day or so, and then bottle them. The reason I'm doing this is so I can bottle them with a counter pressure filler. Any opinions?
 
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Deadalus

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Is the keg really full? Maybe you don't have enough headspace. If so, you could take 2l out carbonate that separate but also keep checking the pressure in the keg for a day or two to see if it helped any.
 
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Selloum

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The keg is half-full. Wanted to cut time in half but seems like it's taking the same amount of time as a full keg.
 

Mtrhdltd

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I follow the set and forget method and give mine 2 weeks.
Now for some questions to try and help.
Did you purge the headspace in the keg? If so how? Without proper removal of air the concentration of co2 will not be enough to carbonate.
How hard and long did you shake the keg? It could take several hours.
How are you dispensing? Is it possible you are loosing carbonation there?
 
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Selloum

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I follow the set and forget method and give mine 2 weeks.
Now for some questions to try and help.
Did you purge the headspace in the keg? If so how? Without proper removal of air the concentration of co2 will not be enough to carbonate.
How hard and long did you shake the keg? It could take several hours.
How are you dispensing? Is it possible you are loosing carbonation there?
I purged the headspace using the release valve to remove air and let CO2 in.
Almost 20 mins, and until I could not hear anymore CO2 going into the keg. Several hours of shaking?
I am dispensing using a counter pressure filter. I read that there should be a minimal lost (systems are never perfect) of carbonation using a counter pressure filler.

Since it's got so much headspace, it could take longer.............
How so?
 
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Selloum

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Is it possible that when I'm transferring my soda to the bottle that I would be losing carbonation when I bleed the keg?
Example: before filling a bottle, I have read that you need to bleed your keg of the CO2 present in the headscape before reconnecting it to a lower PSI value, anywhere from 1 to 15 PSI, to slowly push the liquid out of the keg and into the bottle. Considering I have a considerable amount of headspace, would it be possible that my soda would lose CO2 to the headspace of the keg now that the pressure has been dropped from 45 to 15 (for example) and not have enough CO2 present in the bottle when filling?
 

Deadalus

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Is it possible that when I'm transferring my soda to the bottle that I would be losing carbonation when I bleed the keg?
Example: before filling a bottle, I have read that you need to bleed your keg of the CO2 present in the headscape before reconnecting it to a lower PSI value, anywhere from 1 to 15 PSI, to slowly push the liquid out of the keg and into the bottle. Considering I have a considerable amount of headspace, would it be possible that my soda would lose CO2 to the headspace of the keg now that the pressure has been dropped from 45 to 15 (for example) and not have enough CO2 present in the bottle when filling?
No, what you lose and the short amount of time before bottling would not create a significant loss at all from the soda. I use CO2 to condition the beer in my kegs. This is either done at a high level of force carbonation over a shorter period of time or at the recommended PSI for the CO2 volumes I want based on the keezer temperature. Either method uses higher PSI than serving PSI and the beer holds it's carbonation. I suppose I could turn off the CO2 at the manifold to keep the keg where it should be but I typically don't. The carbonation will slowly drop off to where I might need to hit the keg with about 15-20 psi but that's over days to weeks I'd say. This is not your issue IMHO.
 

Mtrhdltd

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I purged the headspace using the release valve to remove air and let CO2 in.
Almost 20 mins, and until I could not hear anymore CO2 going into the keg. Several hours of shaking?
I am dispensing using a counter pressure filter. I read that there should be a minimal lost (systems are never perfect) of carbonation using a counter pressure filler.
How many times did you pull the prv? With a half full keg I am guessing you need to purge at least a dozen times, maybe more. I purge at least 6 times with a full keg, if I forget the keg will never carbonate. 20 minutes of shaking will not carbonate soda at serving pressure, maybe if you could put 100 psi in it might. Others might have better info about the shake method. I can say from experience bottling carbonated beer that you will lose about 15% of your carbonation while bottling.
 
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Selloum

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How many times did you pull the prv? With a half full keg I am guessing you need to purge at least a dozen times, maybe more. I purge at least 6 times with a full keg, if I forget the keg will never carbonate. 20 minutes of shaking will not carbonate soda at serving pressure, maybe if you could put 100 psi in it might. Others might have better info about the shake method. I can say from experience bottling carbonated beer that you will lose about 15% of your carbonation while bottling.
I considered that, and made sure all the air was out. I must of pulled over a dozen times and for several seconds at a time to prevent air from staying inside the keg. The reason I'm shaking is that I've seen videos where beer is carbonated a lot faster. Some do get beers to be carbonated the same day or the next but I'm sure that won't happen with soda due to density. I've also read that if you leave the keg hooked up to the CO2 tank without prior shaking (the set and forget method, like you mentioned) that it could take weeks to carbonate at a proper level, and that is for beer; I can't imagine how long it would take for soda(!).

Btw, looking at a CO2 chart (for beer) you get a relation between temperature/pressure/volume for slow forced carbonation but I would like to know if charts with the time variable exists (or approximations). Example: 1ºC (34ºF), 10 PSI - How much time before I reach a volume of 2.58.
 
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Selloum

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Also, thinking of getting an inline carbonator system. Has anyone used one for craft soda? Could sugar block the pores of the diffuser or am I overthinking it? 😝
 

Mtrhdltd

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@bracconiere could probably blow your mind with quick carbonation info. I have found with my soda that is very light on sugar, after around 3 weeks it seems to be max carbonation without changing pressure or shaking. I can tell when the keg is almost empty because I will have foamy pours. I have been curious about the quick carb from blichman primarily for soda.
 
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Selloum

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@bracconiere could probably blow your mind with quick carbonation info. I have found with my soda that is very light on sugar, after around 3 weeks it seems to be max carbonation without changing pressure or shaking. I can tell when the keg is almost empty because I will have foamy pours. I have been curious about the quick carb from blichman primarily for soda.
What is light on sugar for you in g/100 ml? I usually play around 7 to 10 g per 100ml. If I use less then I find the soda to be dry-ish and lacking in flavor.

I've been looking at the quick carb from blichman too. I'm thinking of buying it. If I do, I'll let you know.
 
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bracconiere

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by weight? what do you mean? 🙃

i put my co2 tank on scale that weigh's by the 1/10th ounce, and up to 110lb's...then secure my gas line to a chair, so it doesn't f'up the reading...and shake baby shake till it takes it all! at first i thought it was quick at 50psi, but no, no...it's PITA! but i do get perfectly carbed kegs, and now that i cold crash, serveable in an hour or two from carbing. naturally fermented kegs have about 1 vol allready so i give them 1.5oz's. but for soda pop, or in my case alco-pop, i give them 2.7oz's...still got some kinks to work in the process though.

but then we'd have to start having me ask if pin lock bev QDs are different then ball lock.
 

Mtrhdltd

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What is light on sugar for you in g/100 ml?
If I have done my conversions right, I'm just over 3. I do add an equal amount by volume of stevia to make up for it.

whoa man, i just started on doing it by weight a couple months ago. still picking brains around here! :mug: :D
Your carbonating and drinking in 24hrs. That's pretty impressive. Beats my 14 days.
 

Toxxyc

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In bottles with priming sugar- not 5 gallon kegs half full.
Not entirely sure how that makes a difference. I bulk prime, so it's not like there's more sugar per volume in the half-filled bottle than the full ones. I'm honestly asking, because I don't know. I'd love to know why.
 

TheBluePhantom

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I do 37F at 25 psi, I get good carb in 2 to 3 weeks, 45 should look decent by now. as stated many times above, purged headspace matters, but also, is the top of the soda clean? If you have any oils or other stuff from the flavoring floating on top it can act as a barrier to the CO2. one thing i usually do is carb from the dip tube, it makes purging a bottom to top flow, and it keeps disturbing the stagnant liquid.
 

bugdry

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I carb my soda at 30psi, 1deg-2deg for about three days. For most of my sodas I then drop it down to 25psi to pour. For my 'heavy' soda like the mocha, i have to drop it to 20psi, or it will be too foamy when pouring. I know it seems simple, but have you sprayed your gas connections? If you have a leak, it wont ever carb for you.
 
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