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Is this bad (or is this brett)

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Seabee John

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I've made a few batches of Apfelwein here and there. My brother Dave, on the other hand made his first batch at my place back in October of 07 (4 Months ago) In Nov, he tasted my first batch which was about 4 months old at that point, and decided he wasn't really keen on Apfelwein.

So his batch just sat....getting better and smoother and... wait... WTF?... what is that growing on the top?

So I took some pics to show you. I have some questions: Is it bad or is it Brett? I pulled the stopper & airlock and it definitely smells sour (like bad milk)

What other "nasties" could this be?

The Apfelwein is nice & clear and there is no sediment at the bottom (it's been racked twice - that's where I think I picked up whatever nasty is in there) I'm all for just dumping it, but the little guy inside my head keeps on saying...go ahead, keg it, drink it... it might be good.

Some of you maybe have been down this road and can shed a little light on it.

here are the pics





 

Iordz

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I really don't think it would be Brettanomyces. It might be Acetobacter or Lactobacillus, which will make the cider sour, a good indicator is the rotten milk smell (lactic acid). It could end up being the yeast you used, so don't dump yet, let it sit and taste it after a month or two.
 
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Seabee John

Seabee John

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As recommended, I let her sit for another two months, still has the infection... anyway, had an idea.

Question: If I killed everything off with some Camden Tablets (crushed) and added a few cans of apple cider concentrate, would it be drinkable? anyone ever do this? ideas, suggestions, warnings? I've gotta try something here... you know, just for the sake of experimentation...

:confused:
 

AnotherFinch

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IMHO, the best that can happen is you get drunk off a sour/smelly drink. The worst is that you get some bacterial disease in your stomach or intestines.

To me... that says: "Spend another $20 on some more juice and just try it again."
 

scox80

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try a sip...if it taste like...something undesirable...throw it out.....but you gotta try it.
 

Brakeman_Brewing

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Where is Landhoney when you need him? I bet hes got an idea or two up his sleeve!

That does look pretty gnarly though John, see if it tastes like vinegar and bottle a bit of it up for cleaning and or cooking.
 

Wade E

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Maybe you can gently rack into a smaller container without transferring over that stuff and then add k-meta . Looks like it has had way to much head space in there and all that 02 is also a problem due to that. 4 months with that much head space and low S02 will let any micro-organisms come to life.
 
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Wade E said:
Maybe you can gently rack into a smaller container without transferring over that stuff and then add k-meta . Looks like it has had way to much head space in there and all that 02 is also a problem due to that. 4 months with that much head space and low S02 will let any micro-organisms come to life.
and this brings up the question of WHY?
Ed says noting about racking...except to not to. (He's from Texas..>They talk like that)
And I cant' see any good reason why you should ever rack Apfelwein: I think you have a good example of why you should NOT rack it.
 

z987k

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AnotherFinch said:
The worst is that you get some bacterial disease in your stomach or intestines.
Nope, nope nope. Nothing can grow in there that's going to make you sick.
 
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Seabee John

Seabee John

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I talked to Yoop in the chat and she gave me some good advise. I'm going to try this and see how it works out. I'll keep you all posted.

<Yooper> I'd do about 7-8 campden tablets in a 1/4 cup boiling water and smash it all up.
<SeabeeJohn> k
<Yooper> then rack the applewein into it.
<Yooper> Let that sit for about 2-3 weeks. To make sure there is no further infection.
<Yooper> Then, if it's ok,
<Yooper> splash rack.
<Yooper> To dissapate all the extra campden/sulfite.
<SeabeeJohn> ahh
<Yooper> THEN add whatever you need to taste.
<Yooper> But, if you're not carbonating, I'd sorbate at that point to ensure no further fermentation.
<SeabeeJohn> I'm not so bent of saving this as I am on experimenting with it.
<SeabeeJohn> I was going to keg and force carb it
<Yooper> Well, lacto is a bugger.
<Yooper> No pun intented.
<Yooper> Oh, then I'd sorbate when I campden
<SeabeeJohn> what will the sorbate do?
<Yooper> Just so you dont' get any refermentation.
<Yooper> sorbate inhibits yeast reproduciton.
<SeabeeJohn> ahh I thought that's what campden does
<Yooper> Very small dose- like 2/3 tsp for 5 gallon.
<Yooper> no, campden doesn't actualy.
<Yooper> That's what alot of people say, but that's not it.
<Yooper> Campden = potasssium metabisulfite.
<Yooper> So,you need both to ensure fermentation will not restart.
 
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