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Imperial juice yeast

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Beenym88

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Has anyone ever used imperial juice yeast in a pale ale or use it as a house strain. I’m loving it in my NEIPA and was curious about this since next brew day is a pale ale.
 

day_trippr

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It's the same strain as wy1318 - which I ranch and use extensively. When Juice first came out I did four 10 gallon neipas batches in a row over a few weeks with one carboy running A38 and the other 1318. Nobody ever found any difference between them, so I went with 1318...

Cheers!
 
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Beenym88

Beenym88

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It's the same strain as wy1318 - which I ranch and use extensively. When Juice first came out I did four 10 gallon neipas batches in a row over a few weeks with one carboy running A38 and the other 1318. Nobody ever found any difference between them, so I went with 1318...

Cheers!
So you use this style yeast with beers other than NEIPA?
 

day_trippr

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I have on many English style brews (esbs, porters, warmers) but pretty sure not on a straight-up American Pale Ale. Yet, anyway.
For those (especially West Coast oriented recipes) I typically use a Chico strain, usually 1056 which I also farm, as I'm usually wanting a bit drier finish than 1318/a38 will provide.

That said, I don't think you could go wrong with Juice on an American Pale. It's bound to be tasty :)

Cheers!
 

Dgallo

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As stated before it is imperial’s 1318 strain. I’m a huge fan of imperial yeast in general. And for about $1-3 more than Wyeast, you’ll get double the pitch count.

To answer your question, it really depends how much attenuation you want in your pale. Do you want a juicier NE style American pale ale or do you want a drier more traditional (think Sierra Nevada pale ale) pale ale. If the former, than it will be absolute perfect to use. If the later, use more attentuative strain.
 
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day_trippr

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^Spell-checker^ must be set on "non brewer" mode :)

Cheers!
 

DNuggs

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I've used it a lot over the years for pales and NEIPA styles but have also used it in a robust porter. I tend to save the slurry and re-pitch for subsequent batches but have consistently found a marked increase in attenuation after the 3rd or 4th use. My guess is it mutates enough after that point to bring my attenuation up from 74-75% to 82% because no other factors were really altered. As such, the beer just tasted like hop water. I've gone back to the London III and found that I don't get that issue.
 

Dgallo

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I've used it a lot over the years for pales and NEIPA styles but have also used it in a robust porter. I tend to save the slurry and re-pitch for subsequent batches but have consistently found a marked increase in attenuation after the 3rd or 4th use. My guess is it mutates enough after that point to bring my attenuation up from 74-75% to 82% because no other factors were really altered. As such, the beer just tasted like hop water. I've gone back to the London III and found that I don't get that issue.
Are you certain you are talking about A38-juice and not A24 - dryhop?

Juice should actually result in less attenuation in future generation, not more. However a24 is a blend of two of their strains a04 a barbarian (Conan strain) and a20 - citrus (Saccharomyces cerevisiae var. diastaticus similar to wl644) which contains the STA-1 gene. If you push this blend ito future generations you would see an increase on attenuation because of different flocculation rates and a20 reproduces faster than a04, this would cause each sequential generation to lean more a20 dominate. By g4, there would be very little a04 in the pitch.

I know this because I’ve experienced it and ended up reaching out to imperial through email, which they explained this to me and gave me some pointers on how to minimize shift for future generations.
 

DNuggs

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Are you certain you are talking about A38-juice and not A24 - dryhop?

Juice should actually result in less attenuation in future generation, not more. However a24 is a blend of two of their strains a04 a barbarian (Conan strain) and a20 - citrus (Saccharomyces cerevisiae var. diastaticus similar to wl644) which contains the STA-1 gene. If you push this blend ito future generations you would see an increase on attenuation because of different flocculation rates and a20 reproduces faster than a04, this would cause each sequential generation to lean more a20 dominate. By g4, there would be very little a04 in the pitch.

I know this because I’ve experienced it and ended up reaching out to imperial through email, which they explained this to me and gave me some pointers on how to minimize shift for future generations.
Positive it's been Juice.....this has happened to me 4 times now and it always seems to ramp up on the 4th pitch. Batches 1-3 usually come in around the 75% mark but the 4th always dries out more. You think I would've learned after the 3rd time, right? I also reached out to Imperial and they asked if I was overpitching but I've always re-pitched slurry based off of harvest date and viability percentage numbers that Beersmith spits out. Interestingly, every time this overattenuation happens, I pick up a noticeable "belgian-y" ester in the beer, almost like a saison. I used to get this years ago when I'd harvest yeast from cans of Heady Topper (before Conan was commercially available) and push it for a few generations as well
 
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Beenym88

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Has anybody ever had a crazy fast fermentation with this yeast? I brewed Tuesday morning finished around 2 the fermentation took off by five sanatizer was blowing out of my 1 gallon jug. It slowed significantly last night so I put a regular air lock on it. I just did a gravity reading and it went from 1.065 all the way to 1.016. That’s only like 36 hours. Anyone ever seen this? I’ll mention I made a starter and pitched it into about 5.2 gallons at 70 degrees after it took off I dropped it 1 degree to 69 then 4 hours later another 1 degree to 68.
 

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I haven’t use Juice but I am using Verdant IPA which is a new derivative of 1318 also. I really like this yeast for NEIPA and want to make it my house yeast. I just did an APA with it and everyone loved it. It was a little hazy but family doesn’t take points off for appearance, lol. It ferments like a monster, use a good blow off. Always finishes in less than 2.5 days.
 

Joggin

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I've been using Juice yeast for a while now. It seems to really allow the citrus/fruity hops to shine. I'm really liking it with Zappa.
 

Dgallo

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Has anybody ever had a crazy fast fermentation with this yeast? I brewed Tuesday morning finished around 2 the fermentation took off by five sanatizer was blowing out of my 1 gallon jug. It slowed significantly last night so I put a regular air lock on it. I just did a gravity reading and it went from 1.065 all the way to 1.016. That’s only like 36 hours. Anyone ever seen this? I’ll mention I made a starter and pitched it into about 5.2 gallons at 70 degrees after it took off I dropped it 1 degree to 69 then 4 hours later another 1 degree to 68.
Juice and 1318 are aggressive and always try to climb out of the fermenter. 72 hours I’m usually at fg
 
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Beenym88

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Thanks guys! Do you all do anything to get the yeast to drop from the top or just wait it out?
 
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Beenym88

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New question I took a hydrometer reading today and it’s at 1.012 that’s about 81% attenuation it say max 76 is that normal?
 

Dgallo

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New question I took a hydrometer reading today and it’s at 1.012 that’s about 81% attenuation it say max 76 is that normal?
Did you take it pre or post dryhop? And if post dryhop, how big and at what temp?
 
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Beenym88

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This is post dry hop it’s at 67 I have a way to keep my beer cool with a pump and ice bucket but no way to keep it warm.
 

Dgallo

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This is post dry hop it’s at 67 I have a way to keep my beer cool with a pump and ice bucket but no way to keep it warm.
The Over attenuation is most likely due to hopcreep then. Try dryhoping around 60 or below next time so the yeast will be less active.
 

day_trippr

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One can only wonder how the yeast producing companies come up with their metrics - do they use some equivalent of a "standard" mash such that the fermentability provides a common baseline through their fleet of strains? I have no idea.

In any case, it didn't take long scanning through my Beersmith logs to find neipas that exceeded 80% apparent attenuation using 1318.
Indeed the current batch that I pitched with top-cropped 1318 from a batch from a week prior hit 82% before I hit the crash button this afternoon.
And I agree - it's likely hop creep from the massive dry hopping...

Cheers!
 
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