IIPA recipe assistance

[donovanmaxwell]

Folks, I'm hoping I might be able to get some advice from you more experienced brewers. I'm preparing to do my first all grain and want to do an IIPA. Here is what I have worked out so far in BrewToad. What are your thoughts on the recipe? I thought adding a little rye flakes might make an interesting twist. The hops are what I'm mostly unsure of. I patterned them off a few other recipes I found, but would appreciate some input.

5.5gal batch
75% efficiency (unsure what actual efficiency will be since first all grain brew)
Mash at 153 for 60 mins
OG - 1.072
FG - 1.010
8% ABV
67 IBU (Not enough IBUs?)

Safale US-05

2-Row (US) - 11lbs - 76%
Flaked Rye - 1.5lbs - 10%
Munich - Light 10L (US) - 1lb - 7%
Caramel/Crystal 60L (US) - 1lb - 7%

Magnum - 1 oz - 60 mins
Crystal - 1 oz - 60 mins
Magnum - .5 oz - 20 mins
Crystal - .5 oz - 20 mins
Magnum - .5 oz - 5 mins
Crystal - .5 oz - 5 mins
Magnum - 1oz - dry hop day 14 when racking into secondary, 1 wk
Crystal - 1oz - dry hop day 14 when racking into secondary, 1 wk
Citra - 1 oz - dry hop day 14 when racking into secondary, 1 wk

Any input is appreciated!

 

[ddicker60]

What type of double ipa do you want to make? You definitely want around 80 ibu's at least, I would say near 100. Maybe take out some two row for dextrose to dry it out. I would also double the dry hops. I made a pale last week and I'm going to dry hop it with 3oz.

 

[donovanmaxwell]

I'm not necessarily trying to replicate a particular brew. That being said, Victory Hop Devil, Dogfish Head 90 min and Sierra Nevada Torpedo are some of my favorites. I'm more looking to keep some of their qualities in mind and brew something a little different. I like the idea of the spice of the rye working with the fruits and citrus.

How much are you thinking of swapping? 1 lb for 1 lb? More?

I thought it might need more hops.

I'll play with the numbers when I get home here later and see what I come up with.

I would like it a little more on the crisp and clean side.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

 

[Glynn]

I would add 1 to 1.5 lb of dextrose, its been my personal exp the mash eff is lower the higher my og gets just useing malt

 

[DrKeiser]

What type of double ipa do you want to make? You definitely want around 80 ibu's at least, I would say near 100. Maybe take out some two row for dextrose to dry it out. I would also double the dry hops. I made a pale last week and I'm going to dry hop it with 3oz.

+1 for upping the IBUs. I have no experience with brewtoad but I am sure that there is a read out that lists the IBU to SG ratio. You need more IBUs. I recently brewed an IPA with a similar SG and with around 65 IBUs and it did not taste that hoppy at all.

 

[Adaman05]

I would err on the side of expecting a lower efficiency than 75 for your first go. As mentioned, IBUs should be upped. And I would add way more finishing hops... Hopstand/whirlpool and more dry hops. A double dry hop of 2 oz each would be good.

 

[RonPopeil]

I would add 1 to 1.5 lb of dextrose, its been my personal exp the mash eff is lower the higher my og gets just useing malt

i agree with the dextrose. i'm not a fan of the hops being used here but we can argue that stuff all day.

only thing i would say is mantras. mash lower. keep specialty grains to a minimum. for this style i would say bitter it to 0.7 BU:GU with your 60 minute addition and then add 2-3 ounces at 15-10 minute range and then bomb it with aromatic NW varieties at flame out

 

[ddicker60]

I'm not necessarily trying to replicate a particular brew. That being said, Victory Hop Devil, Dogfish Head 90 min and Sierra Nevada Torpedo are some of my favorites. I'm more looking to keep some of their qualities in mind and brew something a little different. I like the idea of the spice of the rye working with the fruits and citrus.

How much are you thinking of swapping? 1 lb for 1 lb? More?

I thought it might need more hops.

I'll play with the numbers when I get home here later and see what I come up with.

I would like it a little more on the crisp and clean side.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

I am not sure how much grain to take out but an even swap sounds about right.

 

[donovanmaxwell]

Thanks for the advice folks. I'm trying to take it all into consideration and make appropriate changes. I like the idea of drying it out a bit, and leaving it more clean and crisp. Good call! I've swapped 2 lbs of 2 row for 2 lbs of dextrose.

BrewToad, while quick and convenient, does not seem to be as accurate as BeerSmith as I can't really alter the equipment profile in BrewToad. I'll be using a 10gal Rubbermaid cooler for the mash tun. Still need to acquire a larger brew kettle. (Considering this, I'm in no hurry on the recipe)

After reading a couple articles and Ron's comments, I've decided to try and stick to Cascade, Columbus, and Centennial hops. Figure I better start out with the basics. I mainly selected the other hops after seeing a few recipes with those.

I am having trouble massaging the numbers to get the IBU's between 80-100 while keeping the ratio near .7 Ron, were you suggesting use .7 at the starting point and add from there? Is the bitterness ratio very critical to fuss over or should I focus more on IBUs?

Thanks for the help folks! It is appreciated. Sometimes a little assistance is needed to reach the end goal, especially when starting out.

 

[RonPopeil]

if you want a big IIPA then you know you want bitter and that you want hop flavor. so really this is a style that you can't really over hop. just be strategic about when you make your additions.

up until T-30 minutes all you gain from hops is bitterness. flavor and aroma additions are best made T-20 and later in the boil. there's charts and data to support this if you care to look. so the strategy I put forward was to add hops at very specific times to get the desired result. the most common IPA hop schedule is 60/15/10/5. those are the times you would add your additions.

i mentioned BU:GU. this is a measurement some people use to gauge where they stand with bitterness. I use it in recipe creation but there's no real rules to it. just gives a basis to work off of. the calculation itself is IBU divided by the last two numbers in your original gravity. so a 1.050 wort with 50 ibus = 1.0 BU/GU. 1.050 wort with 25 ibu is 0.5 BU/GU. i said to get .7 bu/gu from your 60 minute addition. that means about 50 IBU from the 60 minute addition alone for a 1.070 wort. after that i stop calculating IBU's in hoppy beers because my opinion is that late hop additions add little to your perception of bitterness. instead i measure flavor additions in ounces. sounds odd but it gets me where i'm going better than sticking to the rules.

you mentioned columbus, cascade and centennial. all go well together and all super common in IPA's so you're in a good way. columbus is a great bittering hop so i would use that at the 60 minute addition. you can use it late too and it would probably work with those other two hop varieties but it's not necessary.

since you're new to brewing try making IPA's with only one hop for the 15/10/5 additions. that way you can know for sure what hop you're tasting. my initial IPA's were 1.070 worts bittered to around 50 IBU total. pretty common numbers for the style.

 

[donovanmaxwell]

Ron, thanks for clarifying the ratio calculation and the addition of hops. I was already somewhat familiar with how hops affect the beer at the various times in the boil, however I didn't quite understand what you were saying about calculating the 0.7 and then proceeding with the flavor and aroma hops. This makes more sense.

Here is what I have come up with:

5.5gal batch
70% efficiency (hopefully this is a little closer to what I can expect)
Mash at 151 for 60 mins
OG - 1.081
FG - 1.009
9.5% ABV

GRAINS:
2-Row (US) - 9lbs - 56.3%
Flaked Rye - 2.75lbs - 17.2%
Munich - Light 10L (US) - 1lb - 6.3%
Caramel/Crystal 60L (US) - 1.25lb - 7.8%
Dextrose - 2lbs - 12.5%

HOPS:
Columbus - 1.25oz - First Wort
Columbus - 1oz - 60 min
Columbus - .75oz 15 min
Cascade - 1oz - 15 min
Cascade - 1oz - 10 min
Cascade - 1oz - 5 min
Cascade - 2oz - Dry hop for 7 days in secondary
Centennial - 2oz - Dry hop for 7 days in secondary

2 packages Safale US-05

Let me know what you think. I'm hoping for a big, complex, hoppy beer. Thanks again for all the input!

 

[Yooper]

That's a lot of rye. No problem for me- as I love up to about 20% in a rye IPA, but you may have lautering troubles if you're not doing BIAB. Rice hulls will help if you're doing a tradtional mash and sparge.

Nearly 8% caramel is a bit too much for me, but if you love it, that's fine. I usually stick with 5-7% in a beer like this but more can be ok since you're mashing low and using rye. It is weird to have 12% dextrose along with it, as it's at counterpurposes. I'd probably cut both- the dextrose to 1 pound and the crystal/caramel to no more than a pound.

You have a lot of columbus with the FWH and 60 minutes. That should give you a ton of bitterness. I'd probably leave one of those out. 1 ounce at 60 minutes, or FWH, should be enough. And then put more at 15 minutes. Big flavor at 15/10/0/dryhop would be the way to go for a beer that I'd love.

If you want the "dank" depth, columbus in the later additions will give that to you. Cascade is "bright" and hoppy, while columbus is dank. Centennial/cascade/columbus is a good mix. I'd probably change up the hopping to something like this:
Columbus - 1.25oz - First Wort
Columbus - 1oz 15 min
Cascade - 1oz - 15 min
Centennial 1 oz 5 min
Cascade - 1oz - 5 min
Columbus/cascade/centennial- whirlpool hops
Cascade - 1oz - Dry hop
Columbus- 1 oz dryhop
Centennial - 1oz - Dry hop