Ice to chill wort?

[Brother Dun]

I just read that it is bad to chill your wort using ice. I normally add a little bit of water to get my AG batch to the right volume, but I thought ice would be a good idea instead, since it would cool the wort as well. Could someone tell me why I shouldn't use ice?

Thanks!

 

[Revvy]

I'm not a big fan of putting ice in my fermenter unless I made it myself in a sanitized container (like a gallon milk jug); there is no gaurantee that the ice bags bought at the store are sanitized...the ice might be, but who knows about the plastic bags, and some of those bags get torn loading and un loading in those machines, so who knows whose grubby hands went in and out of there.

 

[malkore]

as long as you pre-boiled that water, and froze it in a way that kept it sanitary, then its fine.

anything short of the above steps is increasing the risk for infection.

 

[Skins_Brew]

If you used a gallon milk jug, how would you get the ice out of it? Cut away the plastic? I was thinking sanitizing some 1 gallon glad bags and then freezing those might work, or maybe some large tupperware (like a big cube).

 

[Revvy]

If you used a gallon milk jug, how would you get the ice out of it? Cut away the plastic? I was thinking sanitizing some 1 gallon glad bags and then freezing those might work, or maybe some large tupperware (like a big cube).

Yes, cut away the plastic. I've frozen 1 gallon zippies for other things, they work fine as well.

 

[Orfy]

It's a gamble,

People add straight tap water to the fermenter to top off and all is well, but if you have bad water you'll have bad beer.

 

[monty73741]

I'm not a big fan of putting ice in my fermenter unless I made it myself in a sanitized container (like a gallon milk jug); there is no gaurantee that the ice bags bought at the store are sanitized...the ice might be, but who knows about the plastic bags, and some of those bags get torn loading and un loading in those machines, so who knows whose grubby hands went in and out of there.

I dont think there would be bacteria contamination. Mainly because that ice is so cold that it is not in the temperature dangerzone. I say try it. I know in many a resturants i worked in we used a paddle like device that we would freeze to shock cold soups. it was washed but never sanitized.

 

[FireBrewer]

Freezing won't kill bacteria. Anything that touches wort post-boil should be as sanitary as possible.

 

[Revvy]

Freezing won't kill bacteria. Anything that touches wort post-boil should be as sanitary as possible.

YUP!!!!

(darn ten letters)

 

[Bobby_M]

Back in my extract days I'd preboil a gallon of water and sanitize any old throw away tupperware like chinese food soup containers, cool whip, etc as long as it was tapered from top to bottom. Fill them, freeze, then pop it out into the wort. When I finally got my fermentation fridge, I'd skip all that and simply chill down the entire volume of topoff water to about 40F.

 

[sirsloop]

pre boil water, cool, add to a ziplock bag, freeze. When its time to cool... use your chiller to get it as far down as possible then drop in the ice. Voila!

Oh... be real careful using milk jugs for your brew. If you don't clean it out REAL good you're almost guaranteed to have a lactobacillus infection.

 

[ajwillys]

Back in my extract days I'd preboil a gallon of water and sanitize any old throw away tupperware like chinese food soup containers, cool whip, etc as long as it was tapered from top to bottom. Fill them, freeze, then pop it out into the wort. When I finally got my fermentation fridge, I'd skip all that and simply chill down the entire volume of topoff water to about 40F.

I still do this exact process. I use the disposable ziploc containers. They are a good size, are tapered, and you can get lots of them for cheap. Plus, the plastic is soft enough that its still really easy to get the ice out after its expanded. Something that is not true for all tupperware.

 

[chiud]

if you buy bottle water, can't you just put it in the freezer until near frozen, or do the same thing with sanitized water bottles? You can probably just stick it in the freezer for about 4-5 hours and then pour it into the wort. I think may be easier than trying to cut the bottle? I suppose one bottle may not be enough to lower the temperature and may be the only draw back.

 

[monty73741]

Bacteria contamination comes from the temperatur dangerzone. So boiling water & then cooling it you can still get bacteria. Plus boiling doesnt kill bacteria. It only weakens it. In most states the health department & probally the FDA regulates companies that make ICE. I would say that is safer then the old zip lock in your freezer, Unless you go from boiling water to rapid FREEZing. I say use common sense. I mean when goto the local brewpub. these guys arent wearing tyvax suits like when u goto a pig farm or chicken farm.

 

[Icewalker]

if you buy bottle water, can't you just put it in the freezer until near frozen, or do the same thing with sanitized water bottles? You can probably just stick it in the freezer for about 4-5 hours and then pour it into the wort. I think may be easier than trying to cut the bottle? I suppose one bottle may not be enough to lower the temperature and may be the only draw back.

Zombie thread resurrection warning

I did this very thing the other month with my saison .... but instead of one gallon of spring water ... I used 3 gallons straight into the kettle while it was sitting in an icewater bath (freezer packs in tap water). Seemed to bring the temp down to pitching very quick. I'd say at least as quick if not quicker than a counterflow

 

[sudbuster]

Zombie thread resurrection warning

I did this very thing the other month with my saison .... but instead of one gallon of spring water ... I used 3 gallons straight into the kettle while it was sitting in an icewater bath (freezer packs in tap water). Seemed to bring the temp down to pitching very quick. I'd say at least as quick if not quicker than a counterflow

anyone ever heard of latent heat of fusion of ice??

 

[Icewalker]

anyone ever heard of latent heat of fusion of ice??

Sorry ... not big into physics ..... dya wanna dumb it down for the likes of me?

 

[tv187u]

bump on the latent heat of fusion of ice

 

[lumpher]

anyone ever heard of latent heat of fusion of ice??

i haven't either, and i scored 138 on the stanford-binet. lack of education on a certain topic is not necessarily a sign of drooling (or being an engineer)

 

[Icewalker]

Is this one of those Kompella or LaSerre things?

 

[electronjunkie]

Sorry ... not big into physics ..... dya wanna dumb it down for the likes of me?

It takes much more energy to go from 0*C to 1*C (frozen to unfrozen) than it does to go from 1*C to 2*C (unfrozen remains unfrozen)

Isn't this taught in HS physics/chem classes BTW?

 

[Icewalker]

It takes much more energy to go from 0*C to 1*C (frozen to unfrozen) than it does to go from 1*C to 2*C (unfrozen remains unfrozen)

Isn't this taught in HS physics/chem classes BTW?

I'm sure it is taught in HS physics. Of course I went to a secondary school in the UK and physics was an elective.


So I'll try to reword the question. What does this have to do with cooling down wort? i.e. Is there a negative effect of using ice and/or icewater directly in the wort?

Thanks

 

[Revvy]

I'm sure it is taught in HS physics. Of course I went to a secondary school in the UK and physics was an elective.


So I'll try to reword the question. What does this have to do with cooling down wort? i.e. Is there a negative effect of using ice and/or icewater directly in the wort?

Thanks

You mean besides infection risk??? I would think that is a big enough drawback.

 

[Icewalker]

You mean besides infection risk??? I would think that is a big enough drawback.

Apart from the risk of infection. If the containers themselves are sanitized and the ice water has been previously boiled in order to mitigate the risk of infection.

Are there any negative effects of essentially flash cooling the wort?

Or am I the only once crazy enough to attempt it?

 

[Revvy]

Apart from the risk of infection. If the containers themselves are sanitized and the ice water has been previously boiled in order to mitigate the risk of infection.

Are there any negative effects of essentially flash cooling the wort?

Or am I the only once crazy enough to attempt it?

You mean other than Alton brown and hundreds of brewers who saw the episode where he did it? Or read about it in early books. You're not breaking any new ground here. It's been done for years, probably up until the brewer gets his first infection, or finds out a wort chiller is more effective.

 

[Icewalker]

You mean other than Alton brown and hundreds of brewers who saw the episode where he did it? Or read about it in early books. You're not breaking any new ground here. It's been done for years, probably up until the brewer gets his first infection, or finds out a wort chiller is more effective.

I didn't think I was breaking any new ground. Sorry mate I didn't see Alton Brown do it ... generally I don't watch TV. It was simply a question.

Calm down ... have a beer and a bacon samwich .... perhaps take the dog for a walk.

 

[Revvy]

I didn't think I was breaking any new ground. Sorry mate I didn't see Alton Brown do it ... generally I don't watch TV. It was simply a question.

Calm down ... have a beer and a bacon samwich .... perhaps take the dog for a walk.

Why do you think I'm not calm...it's just seemed, by what you posted, like you thought you'd be the first to try it. Some folks actually believe that they are inventing something new just because they never heard about something before. And you wouldn't be the first one on here believing about adding ice. Just pointing out some facts to you....

This is what you wrote after all,

Or am I the only once crazy enough to attempt it?

seemed to me like you thought you were some brewing daredevil or something.

Maybe it's you who needs a sandwich.

 

[paraordnance]

I freeze RO water in sanitized plastic Ziploc tupperware containers (which I use just for that) 750 ml at a time, 4 of them. That gives me almost a gallon of frozen ice to help chill my wort. Dont see any problems with that but will be getting wort chiller down the road

 

[Icewalker]

Why do you think I'm not calm...it's just seemed, by what you posted, like you thought you'd be the first to try it. Some folks actually believe that they are inventing something new just because they never heard about something before. And you wouldn't be the first one on here believing about adding ice. Just pointing out some facts to you....

This is what you wrote after all, seemed to me like you thought you were some brewing daredevil or something.

Maybe it's you who needs a sandwich.

Nope .... no daredevil here. Tongue in cheek comments obviously don't translate well.

It was just a question ... no need to involve the spanish inquisition

 

[Icewalker]

I freeze RO water in sanitized plastic Ziploc tupperware containers (which I use just for that) 750 ml at a time, 4 of them. That gives me almost a gallon of frozen ice to help chill my wort. Dont see any problems with that but will be getting wort chiller down the road

Thanks, that's good to know. I'm hoping to get some kind of wort chiller at some point as well as soon as I can convince my mrs that it is essential for our well being that we have one