I want to make a Sweet Ale - Any suggestions?

[Squad1Guy]

I am looking to make a sweet ale...about 9% ABV with low carbonation (like just enough carbonation to say it's carbonated).

What is the best way to achieve this? I am looking to mash at 155-156 F to help with residual sweetness and I plan on doing a kettle carmelization step to also increase the sweetness.

I know this is a weird concept (since I haven't been able to find any recipes for "Sweet Ale"). Windsor was going to be my yeast of choice.

People are always trying to eke out that last FG point, but I want to keep mine on the high end. SG of 1.088 or so and FG of 1.020 or so.

Thanks for your help in advance. Can't wait for the deluge of great ideas and suggestions

 

[Homercidal]

Not sure if serious, but....


Ok, first, use extra low lovibond crystal. if you don't want crystal malt flavors, then skip that and just mash really high. Like about 160F. Don't let the mash fully convert.

Use milk sugar.

Use a low attenuating yeast.

I'm still not sure what the point of this is. There are plenty of recipes out there that give a very sweet beer. Anything much more than that is going to be syrupy...

 

[bransona]

Windsor might not attenuate that .088 all the way to .020, but it will definitely leave you with sweet, fruity flavor. Lactose to backsweeten. Use light crystal malts, honey malt, super low bittering additions, and maybe a noble hop hopstand. Otherwise I don't know if you'll be able to identify this as beer. High mash temp is fine, but Windsor really isn't a high attenuator. I would mash 154*.

 

[Ruckusz28]

I was at the Perrin Brewery in Michigan over the fall and they had a Caramel Nitro ale on tap that was AMAZING. It had huge aroma of butterscotch, caramel. The flavor was like eating caramel popcorn. Big thick mouthfeel. Poured a hazy brown.

At first I was skeptical about it, but was it ever tasty.

I talked to the staff and they said it had loads of honey malt, biscuit, cara, and a hefty caramel addition (go figure). It weighed in around 4%abv if memory serves correct. IBU of 30.

Hope it helps.

 

[eman_resu]

This is just speculation, but I'm thinking: OG 1.088 + high mash temp + low bittering (10 IBU?) + low attenuating yeast + low carbonation = overly sweet beer for my tastes, even with 100% pale base malt. But it depends on what you want of course...

 

[chickypad]

If you're serious about searching for "sweet ale" no wonder you're having trouble. I assume it's as fruitful as looking for "dry ale". Do you have an actual style or commercial beer in mind that might help give an idea what you're aiming for? Like Homercidal and others pointed out there are certainly ways to contribute to sweetness in the finished beer but without a base recipe or style it's kind of hard to give specific advice. Maybe something like a strong scotch ale (wee heavy)? Or a sweet stout?

 

[BrauKnabe]

Yeah, this sounds like you're going for a wee heavy. Take a look online at some wee heavy recipes (or a clone of Skull Splitter!) - that might be what you want. Scotch Ales generally have some degree of kettle carmelizaiton.

 

[Squad1Guy]

The beer I am looking to make is Great Lakes Rackhouse ale.

It's only available in the Pub, and only for about 2 weeks out of the year.

@eman_resu...that is exactly what I am looking for. The beer is aged in bourbon barrels, which really compliments the sweet/low hops (it's 12 IBU actually, using one 60 min addition of Hallertau) flavor. They only use 2-row and a little roasted barley (for color). Everyone I know who has tasted it absolutely loves it.

I know it's not a hop tactical nuke, so very likely most homebrewers would hate it.

 

[JKaranka]

You could kill the yeast when you reach an attenuation of 50-55%. Lots of old Scottish beers had attenuations around 55% (and were made entirely of pale malt, or pale malt + some simple sugar). Yeah, so they did indeed have beers with OG around 1.090 but ticking at 6.5%.

 

[normonster]

Not sure if serious, but....




Use milk sugar.

...

The thing about the high mash is the huge mouthfeel you'll get, isn't it? I'm with homer on the lactose (and a slightly lower mash to avoid the syrup possibility).

 

[Squad1Guy]

I definitely want to stick with the parameters I laid out. No lactose. Lots of sweetness.
Again, this is not a typical beer...which is why I want to brew my own. I have never had a bottled version of this beer as it is only available on tap at Great Lakes Brewing Company in Cleveland.

On a similar note...the Barrel-Aged Blackout Stout release party is on Feb 8, 2016. I already have my tickets The 2015 Rackhouse Ale will also debut. I am stoked!!!

 

[Squad1Guy]

Also, how many volumes of CO2 should I shoot for? I am thinking 2.0 (or less).

 

[JKaranka]

I often carb to 1.5-1.8 or so.

 

[chickypad]

The beer is aged in bourbon barrels, which really compliments the sweet/low hops (it's 12 IBU actually, using one 60 min addition of Hallertau) flavor. They only use 2-row and a little roasted barley (for color). Everyone I know who has tasted it absolutely loves it.

Well there you go then, sounds like you've got a fair amount of info on it to start including the grainbill and hops. I think your plan to mash high with a long boil sounds good. A lower attenuating English yeast also sounds like the right choice (never used Windsor but it sounds appropriate). There are some bourbon oaked recipes in the Smoked and Wood aged section of the database if you want some ideas about aging on oak chips.

Good luck with it!

 

[JKaranka]

The other yeast that really works is MJ Newcastle Dark Ale... wait, second? They seem to have rebranded it to UK Dark Ale

http://mangrovejacks.com/products/uk-dark-ale-yeast

 

[Squad1Guy]

Well there you go then, sounds like you've got a fair amount of info on it to start including the grainbill and hops. I think your plan to mash high with a long boil sounds good. A lower attenuating English yeast also sounds like the right choice (never used Windsor but it sounds appropriate). There are some bourbon oaked recipes in the Smoked and Wood aged section of the database if you want some ideas about aging on oak chips.

Good luck with it!

Thanks!
I appreciate ALL the replies. I will post the results!

 

[bransona]

I would strongly advise against mashing above 154. Windsor is a fine yeast, but not a hard worker. It'll leave all the mouthfeel you need without a high mash. I'm curious how this turns out. Personally, I would make it 80% 2-row, 10% c20, 6% caramunich 60, and 4% c120/special b. Mash 154. Bitter with golding or something like else English to about 15 ibu. Aim for 1.09 og. Let us know what you do!

 

[Squad1Guy]

Just finished bottling this and it seems like a winner!

Here are my observations:

Windsor is definitely a low attenuator. my OG was 1.091 (refractometer) and my FG was 1.038 (hydro) which gives me an attenuation of ~60% which is in line with a lot of the empirical data on HBT regarding Windsor yeast.

Added 0.5 oz whiskey barrel chips soaked in 2.0 oz bourbon (Woodford Reserve) for three days in the primary. The beer has a nice oak and bourbon flavor which is not overwhelming at all.

My color is right and it smells right, so it is mostly a win!

The negatives:

Because of the low attenuation, I only came in at 7% ABV as opposed to the 8.6% I was expecting. Not a deal breaker but not what I had hoped.

Windsor doesn't like to flocc very much, so it will take a while to clear.

Overall, I made a sweet, high(er) ABV beer with a solid oak/bourbon flavor and low bitterness...exactly what I was looking for. (The hydro sample was delicious even warm and flat). For my next iteration I will try adding some table sugar to dry it out and boost the ABV...or maybe I will leave it alone. I will ponder

 

[bransona]

Just finished bottling this and it seems like a winner!

Here are my observations:

Windsor is definitely a low attenuator. my OG was 1.091 (refractometer) and my FG was 1.038 (hydro) which gives me an attenuation of ~60% which is in line with a lot of the empirical data on HBT regarding Windsor yeast.

Added 0.5 oz whiskey barrel chips soaked in 2.0 oz bourbon (Woodford Reserve) for three days in the primary. The beer has a nice oak and bourbon flavor which is not overwhelming at all.

My color is right and it smells right, so it is mostly a win!

The negatives:

Because of the low attenuation, I only came in at 7% ABV as opposed to the 8.6% I was expecting. Not a deal breaker but not what I had hoped.

Windsor doesn't like to flocc very much, so it will take a while to clear.

Overall, I made a sweet, high(er) ABV beer with a solid oak/bourbon flavor and low bitterness...exactly what I was looking for. (The hydro sample was delicious even warm and flat). For my next iteration I will try adding some table sugar to dry it out and boost the ABV...or maybe I will leave it alone. I will ponder

Try s-33. It attenuates pretty well, but still leaves sweetness. It's a very interesting yeast that gets a bad reputation.