I need some help here I have no idea how this happened

[olotti]

So I've been brewing all grain for about a year and a half and today's batch just perplexes me, just when I think I've got this down. So anyway I adjusted my profile in beersmith since I've missed my last few og points on beers from not boiling off enough so even though 7.5 gal was working before it's not working now idk why. So today hit my 7 gal and my refractometer broke so I take a sample and cool the wort to take a pre boil gravity reading, it's 1.050-1.052 switch is about spot on. So now my post boil volume Per beersmith is 5.75 gal with a og of 1.066. I boiled off even more down to 5.5 gal post boil so I figure my og is going to come in a couple points higher even losing some to chill shrinikeage I can top off a little and still hit my numbers. So I chill then take my og sample it reads 1.058 this is with my hydrometer at 68 deg! Wtf! How do I boil off more and come in 8 points low on my og? And this was at 5.25 gal so I still had to top off .25 gal to get to my 5.5 batch size, so now the og is even less. I'm at a loss. Any ideas here?

And to double check per Brewers friend boil off/dilution calculator if my pbg was 1.050 at 7 gal then at 5.5 gal post boil my og should've been at least 1.064. #perplexed

 

[max384]

I'm a bit confused. You mentioned both 7 gallons and 7.5 gallons. If you only had 7 gallons preboil, but planned for 7.5, that could explain your low gravity readings post boil.

 

[olotti]

I'm a bit confused. You mentioned both 7 gallons and 7.5 gallons. If you only had 7 gallons preboil, but planned for 7.5, that could explain your low gravity readings post boil.

I had my equipment profile in beersmith as 7.5 gal pre boil volume up until this batch, I changed my equipment profile in beersmith. Why? Because the last 3-4 beers my post boil volume was high and I'd have to do an extended boil to get down to my target og and volume and I was boiling pretty vigorously. So I figured I'd lower my preboil volume and changed it in my equipment profile and tailored this recipe to the new profile. So all the numbers matched up to the new adjusted pre boil volume and post boil volumes.

 

[olotti]

I'm a bit confused. You mentioned both 7 gallons and 7.5 gallons. If you only had 7 gallons preboil, but planned for 7.5, that could explain your low gravity readings post boil.

I also think something changed in my efficiency especially my mash efficiency. I get my grains milled at my lhbs and for awhile I had my beersmith profile set at 68% and was hitting all my numbers with sometimes better. But again maybe their crunsh changed but the last few batches I've come in low on mash efficiency and I've done thick mashes, thin mashes, single sparge, double sparge doesn't matter so my pbg is low and I realize I wasn't boilin off enough to compensate. So seeing as how this is ill prob move my efficiency back to 68% for my next beer and see if that doesn't help.

 

[max384]

It sounds to me like a measuring error. That's the only thing I can think of if your preboil gravity was right on after being properly cooled down.

 

[olotti]

It sounds to me like a measuring error. That's the only thing I can think of if your preboil gravity was right on after being properly cooled down.

Very well could be. My stick with my gal markings on it, which is just permanent marker was all faded after the ris is did so I measured out my five gallon mash in water and then just figured well the next line is 5.5 then 6 gal etc so yeah I need to remark that again.

 

[max384]

I also think something changed in my efficiency especially my mash efficiency. I get my grains milled at my lhbs and for awhile I had my beersmith profile set at 68% and was hitting all my numbers with sometimes better. But again maybe their crunsh changed but the last few batches I've come in low on mash efficiency and I've done thick mashes, thin mashes, single sparge, double sparge doesn't matter so my pbg is low and I realize I wasn't boilin off enough to compensate. So seeing as how this is ill prob move my efficiency back to 68% for my next beer and see if that doesn't help.

You'll never truly nail down your efficiency until you crush your own.

 

[olotti]

You'll never truly nail down your efficiency until you crush your own.

Agreed it's either a mill or a fermentation chamber are my next pieces. I'm not looking for 90% efficiency I just want it to be consistent so I know I'll hit my numbers batch to batch and this is where it's frustrating, I can't get consistency. The beers still come out real good but I want consistency dang it.

 

[olotti]

Any other ideas here? It's just not making sense to me. I mean at the least shouldn't my og be 1.064 per that Brewers friend calculator. My preboil Gravity wasn't that far off for my og to come in so low.

 

[kh54s10]

It sounds to me that the calibration of either the refractometer or the hydrometer is off. Or both! Or there is a measurement error somewhere. Any of the Preboil gravity, post boil gravity or post boil volume could be off leading to the wrong results.

I have dialed in Beersmith to be pretty close but I don't use the sparge numbers without checking the wort collected. I drain the mash, measure how much was collected, add about half the amount needed for preboil as my 1st sparge. I then measure again and do a second sparge with just a little more water than needed to reach my preboil amount. This leaves very little liquid in the mash tun.

Question? If your OG was low and you were short on volume, why did you top up. I would have just left it at .25 gallons low.

 

[olotti]

It sounds to me that the calibration of either the refractometer or the hydrometer is off. Or both! Or there is a measurement error somewhere. Any of the Preboil gravity, post boil gravity or post boil volume could be off leading to the wrong results.

I have dialed in Beersmith to be pretty close but I don't use the sparge numbers without checking the wort collected. I drain the mash, measure how much was collected, add about half the amount needed for preboil as my 1st sparge. I then measure again and do a second sparge with just a little more water than needed to reach my preboil amount. This leaves very little liquid in the mash tun.

Question? If your OG was low and you were short on volume, why did you top up. I would have just left it at .25 gallons low.

I'm sure it's prob that simple as my measurement stick is off. I do the same as you. I know I'll usually lose two gallons from my mash in due to grain absorption and dead space under my false bottom. So I'll figure out what I need to hit my pre boil volume and either do a single sparge it it'll all fit or I'll split it into two sparges. I'll leave maybe .25-.5 gal in the tun when I'm all done.

I guess I figured I dumped everything into the fermenter so there's a lot of hop debris that I wanted to make sure I had enough volume in the fermenter even if it's another point low on the og to get five gallons to bottle. Prob wasn't necessary but I think I just panicked. Lol.

 

[Homercidal]

I doubt you will ever get BS to hit yoru numbers consistently until you have a consistent system you can brew on.

This means, your own mill and a consistent gap, a consistent process on the same equipment, same mashing process, same water, etc.

BS can do a great job getting close, but it can be off widely if you have some things that can change between batches.

I'd say the first thing that I'd change is your crush. If you are getting low efficiency compared to before, ask your lhbs to double crush your malt. Crush is easily the #1 thing that affects efficiency.

And I don't have an answer for your problem.

 

[Brew_G]

So I've been brewing all grain for about a year and a half and today's batch just perplexes me, just when I think I've got this down. So anyway I adjusted my profile in beersmith since I've missed my last few og points on beers from not boiling off enough so even though 7.5 gal was working before it's not working now idk why. So today hit my 7 gal and my refractometer broke so I take a sample and cool the wort to take a pre boil gravity reading, it's 1.050-1.052 switch is about spot on. So now my post boil volume Per beersmith is 5.75 gal with a og of 1.066. I boiled off even more down to 5.5 gal post boil so I figure my og is going to come in a couple points higher even losing some to chill shrinikeage I can top off a little and still hit my numbers. So I chill then take my og sample it reads 1.058 this is with my hydrometer at 68 deg! Wtf! How do I boil off more and come in 8 points low on my og? And this was at 5.25 gal so I still had to top off .25 gal to get to my 5.5 batch size, so now the og is even less. I'm at a loss. Any ideas here?

And to double check per Brewers friend boil off/dilution calculator if my pbg was 1.050 at 7 gal then at 5.5 gal post boil my og should've been at least 1.064. #perplexed

I don't have an answer, but i wanted to commiserate with you because I've had the same issues since I started measuring my BG a few batches ago. I tend to come in above my estimated BG by about .004, but come in anywhere from .002-.006 lower than expected based on that measured BG.

It's definitely frustrating, but I may bag worrying about BG and just focus on OG if I'm happy with my final product.

 

[xcdarrel17]

I don't have an answer, but i wanted to commiserate with you because I've had the same issues since I started measuring my BG a few batches ago. I tend to come in above my estimated BG by about .004, but come in anywhere from .002-.006 lower than expected based on that measured BG.

It's definitely frustrating, but I may bag worrying about BG and just focus on OG if I'm happy with my final product.

I've been having this same problem in Beersmith. My pre-boil gravity is consistently about 5 points high, but my OG will be spot on. My boil volumes seem to be on, my boil-off is set correctly. I've scoured over the settings several times, but can't seem to figure out why it's happening. I've learned to live with it.