Brewing a Munich Helles today with Bootleg Biology’s Andechs German Lager Yeast, the trouble began when I added PBW to the mash instead of pH 5.2. I tried to skim off the top layer of the mash and salvage it, but I kept getting wafts of weird chemicals during the Hochkurz mash, so I dumped the mash. Ugh….,putting the remaining PBW in a different container. Wife asked me a question and I got distracted and didn’t pay attention, that’s what I get. Try again on Tuesday with fresh malt. Anyone else do something that stupid??
How to really screw up your brew day
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My last brewday I forgot to put the false bottom together before dumping the grains and hot liquor into the mash tun. I had to dump more than half of it to fix the problem.
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I have a small homebrew store worth of stock. Didn't have at least one ingredient for the first couple beers on my priority list. Spent the day doing inventory, planning a summer of brewing around vacation, and ordering stock.
One way to avoid that mistake in the future is not using that terrible product. Don't add anything to the water if you don't already know what's in it. Once you know what's in it, you can add exactly what salts/acids you need for good mash pH.
Anyone know if Charlie Talley still owns Five Star Chemicals?
The company really should provide the background for 5.2 pH Stabilizer - that it was produced for a specific company's water adjustment needs and is unlikely to be broadly useful. Of course that would totally kill sales...
Cheers!
The company really should provide the background for 5.2 pH Stabilizer - that it was produced for a specific company's water adjustment needs and is unlikely to be broadly useful. Of course that would totally kill sales...
Cheers!
madscientist451
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I married one too...sh*t happens....
I respect all you guys with PH meters and the will to add chemicals to change the ph.
But I'm a lazy-ass brewer, never measure mash PH and the beer always come out fine.
Maybe I've just been lucky or my taste buds are just too un-refined to notice any issues.
Yeah, I could likely get more efficiency and reportedly better flavor if I monitored and adjusted the mash PH,
but I like my homebrew better than most commercial beers I buy, so I suppose in my situation I'm doing something right.
Your results will likely be different.....
I realize I should "get with the program", get a PH meter and change my lazy brewer ways....maybe someday.
I've heard that the 5.2 ph stabilizer isn't really needed, but I've never used it and there must be some reason they make it.
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Thanks. I either missed that or forgot about it...
Cheers!
Cheers!
There was - for a specific company's needs.
They decided to broadly market a solution that doesn't actually work for most situations...
Cheers!
My last brew day was great. I did something REALLY bad about a week later when I was trying to drain the trub from the bottom of my ferminator. I bought it used so this was the first time I had used a conical and the first time I had worked with tri clamps/tri clamp ball valves. I inadvertently undid the tri clamp ball valve instead of the tri clamp just below it. I dumped 4 gallons of my beer before I was able to get the ball valve back together again! The beer turned out pretty decent, all things considered. It was also the first time I did pressure fermentation and closed transfers after fermentation.
Forgetting to put the bag in before full volume mash-in.
I did something similar many years ago. I intended to add Polyclar to the beer to help it clear and added a cleaner instead. I quickly realized what I had done and dumped the beer.
There are enough ways to gain the benefits of "in range" mash pH without owning a pH meter. The first step is to either get a water test done or start with RO. In the first case, you or someone less lazy around here, can tell you the range of beer color that automatically puts you in the safe range for your water source. If you want to brew a lighter beer than is on that list, you just add a small amount of acid. It really can't get much easier.
You wouldn't believe how many people bring me bottles of beer and tell me that they keep getting dinged in competitions for having astringency issues. They claim they can't taste anything wrong with it. Nevertheless, we come up with some loose rule of thumb regarding acid additions and they report immediate improvement. If I had a nickel for every time I thought my own beer was great and couldn't get any better, and was dead wrong....
Sadly the mistakes can happen after many years. Last brew I did not change the scale from ounces back to grams to measure my hops. I did not put an entire pound in for my bittering addition but an "undetermined quantity" was added and is now in cold crash. We will see how much of a bitter beer face this IPA brings about. I went and put a 2nd postal scale we have around right on top of the grain bin which will stay in ounces...
Something similar to this happened to me a few weeks ago. I lost 2 gallons of beer.
I screwed up today. I was making a Cilantro Lime wheat beer. I was supposed to add lime juice and zest with 5 minutes left to go in the boil and forgot. I was chilling and down to about 100 when I realized it. So I removed the hops (in a spider), reheated the wort to 185 and added the juice and zest and let it steep for 5 minute. Probably it will be fine, but a huge waste of time and water (fortunately water is fairly inexpensive around here).
BandonBrewingCo
Well-Known Member
I respect that 100%. I'm a very lazy brewer.Yeah, I married one too...sh*t happens....
I respect all you guys with PH meters and the will to add chemicals to change the ph.
But I'm a lazy-ass brewer, never measure mash PH and the beer always come out fine.
Maybe I've just been lucky or my taste buds are just too un-refined to notice any issues.
Yeah, I could likely get more efficiency and reportedly better flavor if I monitored and adjusted the mash PH,
but I like my homebrew better than most commercial beers I buy, so I suppose in my situation I'm doing something right.
Your results will likely be different.....
I realize I should "get with the program", get a PH meter and change my lazy brewer ways....maybe someday.
I've heard that the 5.2 ph stabilizer isn't really needed, but I've never used it and there must be some reason they make it.
I did however try to brew a stout with very light water and ended up with alcoholic licorice.
So then I though, ok just use some easy lactic acid and everything was better.
Trying to understand salt additions was a mare till I realised I don't have to understand them, just understand how to use them.
So my first proper water additioned beers are fermenting. Will report back on whether it was worth it.
Did a pour-over sparge with a gallon and a half of Starsan. Now I have the jugs clearly and conspicuously labeled.
schmurf
Well-Known Member
A mistake I make over and over is to switch on the pump on my keg washer before I hook up the keg. Fortunately I do it in a rather water proof area but a change of clothes is common.
madscientist451
Well-Known Member
So in addition to being a lazy brewer, I'm also somewhat cheap, although when I tell my G/F this, she say's I'm a "good value", which I suppose is a better way of looking at things....So for me, a R/O system just isn't happening. My municipal water source switches from a reservoir to a river intake several times a year so I'm thinking getting a water test done is going to be pointless?
After hunting around on different brewing blogs and discussion pages it appears that the need to worry or not worry about mash PH really starts with alkalinity level of the water. Am I on the right track with this? Perhaps I'm just lucky and have "good water" to brew with?
I'm not saying my beer is great, and can't get better, I'm saying its good enough for me for for the amount of time, effort and money I can spare to put into it and I'm just questioning the need to expend any effort for minimal or no gain.
One of the big reasons I don't want to get a PH meter is the need to keep the probes maintained. I take long breaks from brewing and figure I would mess this up and it would be costly to keep replacing the tips. Has anything changed with brewing PH meters?
I understand being "thrifty"... that's a nicer way to say it. An RO system is about $100 all in. If you need anymore motivation, you can use RO water for a lot of other purposes such as in car radiators, humidifiers, irons, and anywhere else where water is intentionally evaporated. It won't leave the lime scale behind. We also use it in coffee makers, keurig, and drinking water.
I wouldn't have the confidence to say that you will ABSOLUTELY notice a difference in the beer but I also wouldn't sell your palate short and say that you won't. It is true that maybe 50-100% of the beers you often brew are already in the right mash pH range. The problem with mash pH is always high, and it's almost always with yellow to deep gold colored beers depending on how alkaline the water is. The absolute bottom end way to see if this is the case is to rebrew something light colored that you've brewed in the past and do it again with 4 mL of lactic acid in the strike water. If the beer is better than you remembered, you have SOME very limited evidence that your water needs help for light colored beers.
The thing is, I would 100% rather spend $100 on an RO system than the same $100 on a pH meter. I agree, replacing the probes on a meter is a necessary and frustrating aspect of ownership.
Good point Bobby. Getting the right water can really influence flavor and there are ways to 'educated guess' your pH and be more than close enough. I run my house water through a carbon filter and swap in a few gallons of distilled for lighter colored beers. At some point when I get my low oxygen process down (very close) I will try a 100% RO brew and see if I notice a difference.
Water can be found pretty cheap in some places. Maybe knocking out the need for an RO filter setup. It might take quite a few batches of buying to get to $100+ along with the convenience.
Water can be found pretty cheap in some places. Maybe knocking out the need for an RO filter setup. It might take quite a few batches of buying to get to $100+ along with the convenience.
Cameronl
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I almost did that very same thing, but on a 30 barrel fermenter at a brewery I was interning at. Caught myself just in time.
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If it makes you feel any better I have done this at least three times myself! Usually because I hooked up the posts but didn't flip the keg onto the sprayer.
If one decides to purchase RO water they would be well advised to spend $8 on a TDS meter as commercial RO systems are often neglected wrt maintenance and may not be even close to RO...
Cheers!
Cheers!
madscientist451
Well-Known Member
Thanks, I guess I was thinking you absolutely had to have a PH meter to make mash adjustments, but I suppose that's not true.
I was also thinking that water manipulation was really only necessary/desirable when making hoppy beers or if your tap water was really off the charts, but now I realize that's not true either.
I'm going to start off with distilled water w/additions, brew some back to back batches of the same beer and see if I can detect any difference vs my regular tap water with nothing added.
That is a good approach. Firsthand knowledge is best! pH is pretty known at this point. For my water and brewing a 5 gallon batch, 1ml of lactic acid is not far off of a .1 pH drop. That is general, but it could get you in a ballpark.
redrocker652002
Well-Known Member
I am right there with you. When I first looked into this, Northern Brewer said, if you water tastes good, it is good to use (or something like that, LOL). So, with that said, I use my tap water and while it may not be perfect, most of my beers have been pretty good. So, I am with you on this one. Rock On!!!!!!!!!Yeah, I married one too...sh*t happens....
I respect all you guys with PH meters and the will to add chemicals to change the ph.
But I'm a lazy-ass brewer, never measure mash PH and the beer always come out fine.
Maybe I've just been lucky or my taste buds are just too un-refined to notice any issues.
Yeah, I could likely get more efficiency and reportedly better flavor if I monitored and adjusted the mash PH,
but I like my homebrew better than most commercial beers I buy, so I suppose in my situation I'm doing something right.
Your results will likely be different.....
I realize I should "get with the program", get a PH meter and change my lazy brewer ways....maybe someday.
I've heard that the 5.2 ph stabilizer isn't really needed, but I've never used it and there must be some reason they make it.
That persistent adage is definitely very high on my pet peeve list. On one hand, as a proprietor of a homebrew shop for 10 years, I get the purpose. These types of sayings are meant to not overwhelm newcomers to the hobby. We want to make people believe that homebrewing is extremely forgiving. I mean, if you stretch your idea of what good beer is, it can be as true as you want it to be. If you want your beer to be world class, where it could go toe to toe with the mammoths in the commercial space in a blind comparison, it's a little more complicated than that. However snobby that may read, I believe that beer should be whatever the brewer wants it to be and I don't intend any shade towards those who take a more relaxed approach.
redrocker652002
Well-Known Member
I would agree whole heartily with this. And one day, due to obtaining a PH Meter, I might dive into the world of water chemistry. For now, fermenting temps and consistent brew processes are what I am dealing with. But, as I said, I agree that water chemistry and all other parts make the whole a better product. No way I could go toe to toe with the big guys, or even most of you folks here. You are heads and shoulder above me, but I am learning each time and that is what makes it fun. Good post and great point. Rock On!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks... really good info! I hadn't realized they were so cheap. Roughly how much are the filters? And how often do they require replacement?
I've been meaning to improve my water and starting with RO would make that so much easier.
fwiw, with RO systems, "time is money", and brew day needs matter. A $100 RO system will likely be rated for 50 gallons per day or less. Add another $75-100 to get to a 100 gpd solution to fill your brew day needs twice as fast...
Cheers!
Cheers!
RO systems are just not "on demand" at these price points but they don't have to be. My 200GPD RO unit is running on a 125psi booster pump and I can make about 8 gallons per hour, but it really doesn't matter either. The output goes to a float valve clamped to my kettle and stops filling at the volume I select. If it took 10 hours to make the amount I needed, I'd just set it up the night before. For those who can't route a 1/4" OD PE line from the RO to their kettle, or people who have to drag their gear out to the driveway, you can set up the same float system in a bucket or two.
Didn't it look like an overly huge pile of hops, 28 times larger than usual?
How about milling 2 batches, and then not knowing which bucket contains which recipe?
I can do "better" actually:
Having milled 2 batches and didn't get to brew the second one. A month later I'm now puzzled which recipe it actually contains.
It is scary how one has to idiot proof yourself - as we age.
I did not notice until the 2nd addition was due. But the amount I added was not overly large as I use a little round plastic butter dish container which would not hold even close to a pound of hops. So who knows what number I was looking at and deciding when to stop at! Tried the beer upon transfer last night and has a lot of hop flavor. Surprised the bitterness was not life ending. I will see after it ages a while.
I did not notice until the 2nd addition was due. But the amount I added was not overly large as I use a little round plastic butter dish container which would not hold even close to a pound of hops. So who knows what number I was looking at and deciding when to stop at! Tried the beer upon transfer last night and has a lot of hop flavor. Surprised the bitterness was not life ending. I will see after it ages a while.
A few years ago, at one of our local breweries, someone actually did that. There was no stopping it, whatever they tried. The whole fermenter emptied, 50+ (?) barrels down the floor drain.
The biggest problem was the void in distribution of their flagship beer...
Two carbon filter cartridges from Walmart $10 and one sediment for about $4. If you only use the water for brewing, you can do it annually. The RO membrane can also last about 5 years with relatively low use.
Surely there's got to be something in between. My friends and family all like my beers. One or two of them have even said that one or two of my beers were as good as any they've had at one of the better local craft breweries (note - I didn't agree). I have no desire to ever enter a competition, much less to go toe to toe with any mammoths. But I'm always trying to make things a little bit better whenever and however I think I can, within reason. And I do own a pH meter.
So hypothetically, if one already had a whole house water filtration system with a sediment filter and two carbon filters, you could run your tap water straight to an RO membrane?
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