How long do you drain your sac

[Jtvann]

So I have my grain absorption value and pre boil volume off. I've started using a wilser bag. My last session I was worried that I was going to be too low on my pre boil. After mash was finished I lifted the bag and let it hang while bringing up to a boil.

I did finally reach my preboil volume before the boil started. I took my bag and set it on a bucket for the rest of the day. I was lazy and didnt clean until the next morning. To my surprise, there was at least a half gallon of liquid in the bucket.

I would just let it drip for the duration of the boil, but I'm indoors using a steam condenser ... lid on the pot. I guess I could squeeze harder, but I was just lazy and let it drip. Maybe I could just set the temp to 180 or so and not go straight into a boil? I'm not in a rush to have faster brew days, but also dont want to waste time just for the sake of another cup.

 

[fun4stuff]

So I have my grain absorption value and pre boil volume off. I've started using a wilser bag. My last session I was worried that I was going to be too low on my pre boil. After mash was finished I lifted the bag and let it hang while bringing up to a boil.

I did finally reach my preboil volume before the boil started. I took my bag and set it on a bucket for the rest of the day. I was lazy and didnt clean until the next morning. To my surprise, there was at least a half gallon of liquid in the bucket.

I would just let it drip for the duration of the boil, but I'm indoors using a steam condenser ... lid on the pot. I guess I could squeeze harder, but I was just lazy and let it drip. Maybe I could just set the temp to 180 or so and not go straight into a boil? I'm not in a rush to have faster brew days, but also dont want to waste time just for the sake of another cup.

Make a bag press from 3 nested 5 gallon buckets. Drill bunch of holes in the middle bucket's bottom and sides. Grain bag goes into middle buckets. Then push wort out of bag with top bucket by sitting on or standing in it. Wort flows through holes into bottom bucket. I get 0.5-0.75 gal of wort this way. Takes about 5 mins.

 

[Jtvann]

Make a bag press from 3 nested 5 gallon buckets. Drill bunch of holes in the middle bucket's bottom and sides. Grain bag goes into middle buckets. Then push wort out of bag with top bucket by sitting on or standing in it. Wort flows through holes into bottom bucket. I get 0.5-0.75 gal of wort this way. Takes about 5 mins.

I like it. Never heard of folks doing that. Unfortunately I'm doing 10g batches with sometimes over 30lbs of grain.

I'll think about it though, that's a cool idea.

 

[fun4stuff]

I like it. Never heard of folks doing that. Unfortunately I'm doing 10g batches with sometimes over 30lbs of grain.

I'll think about it though, that's a cool idea.

Yeah, you'd need bigger buckets!

 

[SKBugs]

Make a bag press from 3 nested 5 gallon buckets. Drill bunch of holes in the middle bucket's bottom and sides. Grain bag goes into middle buckets. Then push wort out of bag with top bucket by sitting on or standing in it. Wort flows through holes into bottom bucket. I get 0.5-0.75 gal of wort this way. Takes about 5 mins.

I love this idea.

 

[SKBugs]

There’s a post on here where a fella basically uses 2 pieces of ply and a couple of clamps/vices to squeeze the bag. A bit of controversy about the whole bag squeezing thing tho.
For that amount of grain would a batch sparge be better maybe? Certainly take less time

 

[fun4stuff]

There’s a post on here where a fella basically uses 2 pieces of ply and a couple of clamps/vices to squeeze the bag. A bit of controversy about the whole bag squeezing thing tho.
For that amount of grain would a batch sparge be better maybe? Certainly take less time

I’ve been squeezing my bag using this method for years. There’s no harm in squeezing your bag as long as your at mash temps (or less than 170 deg F) and your pH is in normal mash range (pH < 6). http://brulosophy.com/2017/05/22/br...ag-has-on-beer-character-exbeeriment-results/

https://imgur.com/gallery/ft26Gtn
There’s a pic of how that guy uses wood panels to squeeze his bag. I briefly thought about switching to this method, but i think those wood panels would be pretty heavy and it would be a pain to lift them up and get them positioned on my own- at least harder than lowering the bag into a bucket. I also wasn’t too keen on using wood, although it’s preboil so probably would be just fine.

Ive been meaning to use clamps on my buckets so i can apply pressure to my bucket press system while i do other things. I get around 0.04-0.05 gal/lbs absorption with my method.

 

[wilserbrewer]

Bag press is just more unnecessary gingerbread imho.

If unable or you don’t want to use a pulley hoist to let the bag drain....
Set your bag in a bucket or tub or large cooler with an inverted mixing bowl in the bottom to let the bag drain and not sit in a puddle of wort.
After 20-30 minutes add your last final runnings from the bucket to the kettle.

Imo, squeezing is more work and just produces the last runnings the wort faster, and doesn’t create more wort overall.
Let gravity work for free....very reliable [emoji4]

I wish someone would accurately gather data on this....

Just because a gravity drained bag produces some wort w squeezing, doesn’t mean squeezing the bag initially produces more wort overall.

 

[Bigarcherynut]

There’s a pic of how that guy uses wood panels to squeeze his bag. I briefly thought about switching to this method, but i think those wood panels would be pretty heavy and it would be a pain to lift them up and get them positioned on my own- at least harder than lowering the bag into a bucket. I also wasn’t too keen on using wood, although it’s preboil so probably would be just fine.

Ive been meaning to use clamps on my buckets so i can apply pressure to my bucket press system while i do other things. I get around 0.04-0.05 gal/lbs absorption with my method.[/QUOTE]

fun4stuff,
Thanks for mentioning my method. At the time I made it, I was using my hands and didn't care for getting hot hands and it was messy. The boards are maple and are only 12"x19" so not heavy at all. The boards actually clean up nicely and rinsed with sanitizer then heat dried. Not hard to put on and work quickly so works well on my oval E-kettle. If I would have read about the bucket press back when I was thinking of an idea I would have gone that route and still might. I've gotten my absorption rate to .03 Gal/Lb.

 

[higginsg]

I know you are talking about pressing - but awhile back someone recommended this setup which I was able to get going with minimal investment (I had the rope, pully, carabiner laying around and someone gave me the metal poles - all I had to buy was the tripod). I was going to go down the pressing route, but this setup allows me to wrap my kettle on the floor with an old army blanket for an hour and then drain - all the while doing other things to clean-up/get ready for the next step (as supposed to the extra equipment of pressing). I also "sparge" at 170 with 2 gallons of water in a brew bucket (I steep it like tea and pick it up and put it down a few times - as pictured) and then dump the 2 gallons of sparge back into my kettle which is already at full power getting ready for the boil (so pressing at this point wouldn't add a whole lot of value, for me). It changed my brewday (see pic of setup).

 

[soccerdad]

I'm with Wilser on this. Just let it drain. But if you are worried, do the Zap Pap thing that fun4stuff mentions. You've already got a hundred buckets .. Just drill holes in one.

 

[jveruin]

I too am doing 10 gallon BIAB batches. I bought a replacement round grill grate and put that on top of my kettle. I lower the bag back on top and I get a surprising amount of wort out. My grain absorption went from .085 to .048. Squeezing a bag with 30-40 lbs of grain felt pretty unproductive.

 

[doug293cz]

...
Thanks for mentioning my method. At the time I made it, I was using my hands and didn't care for getting hot hands and it was messy. The boards are maple and are only 12"x19" so not heavy at all. The boards actually clean up nicely and rinsed with sanitizer then heat dried. Not hard to put on and work quickly so works well on my oval E-kettle. If I would have read about the bucket press back when I was thinking of an idea I would have gone that route and still might. I've gotten my absorption rate to .03 Gal/Lb.

0.03 gal/lb is excellent. This is the lowest rate I remember seeing.

I too am doing 10 gallon BIAB batches. I bought a replacement round grill grate and put that on top of my kettle. I lower the bag back on top and I get a surprising amount of wort out. My grain absorption went from .085 to .048. Squeezing a bag with 30-40 lbs of grain felt pretty unproductive.

0.05 gal/lb is amazing for a no-squeeze drain.

Brew on

 

[Bigarcherynut]

Here's a picture of my squeeze boards. Made from maple and not much work at all for me to put around the bag. I've done this with a total grain weight of 22 pounds and could go larger. When done I just rinse, wash, sanitize then dry. Always look clean and never get moldy because they are well dried before storing. For me it's not much work to get all the wort I can. Necessary, maybe not but not much effort or cost involved. I'll keep squeezing.

 

[Sebastian Weetabix]

I am not an authority of this subject by any means, but EVERYTHING I have read on the subject of whether or not to squeeze the grain bag has been pretty unequivocal on the subject.
DON'T. The reason given is that squeezing the grain bag also releases bitter tannins from the grain hulls that can screw with the flavor of the wort.
Since I am usually brewing small batches, the extra cup or so of wort is not worth the possibility of messing up my brew.

JMTCW YMMV

 

[fun4stuff]

I am not an authority of this subject by any means, but EVERYTHING I have read on the subject of whether or not to squeeze the grain bag has been pretty unequivocal on the subject.
DON'T. The reason given is that squeezing the grain bag also releases bitter tannins from the grain hulls that can screw with the flavor of the wort.
Since I am usually brewing small batches, the extra cup or so of wort is not worth the possibility of messing up my brew.

JMTCW YMMV

Then you need to read something else. No tannins released at mash pH or temps.

‘Squeezing the bag like it owes you money’ is one of the major tenants of BIAB technique.

 

[NitrogenWidget]

Then you need to read something else. No tannins released at mash pH or temps.

‘Squeezing the bag like it owes you money’ is one of the major tenants of BIAB technique.

This.
Mostly because grain for a 10 gallon batch can hold a gallon or more of wort and I want that back.

No idea what i'll do when I move up to 15 & 20 gallon batches though.

 

[bleme]

I squeeze, then batch sparge in a bucket with cool water so I can squeeze it again harder. Then I usually pour another gallon of water over that and let it set until near the end of my boil, just in case I need a little more to make my volume. My last brew, those '3rd runnings' were 1.010 and since I didn't need them, I froze them on a whim. I'll probably toss it in a couple months but I might need to step up a starter sometime. Who knows?

 

[LittleRiver]

...‘Squeezing the bag like it owes you money’ is one of the major tenants of BIAB technique.

Only for those who like extra work and extra cleaning. If you let gravity fully drain it, by the end of the boil there won't be enough liquid left to make squeezing worth the sticky mess that it is.

...grain for a 10 gallon batch can hold a gallon or more of wort and I want that back.

A bag that has been allowed to fully drain by gravity will not have a gallon of wort in it. Not even close.

 

[enkamania]

I have a grill I put over the kettle and put my basket on top. I go inside, take my ph and hydrometer readings (pet the dog). I come back, it's been draining for 10-15 minutes. I have a pot lid that I push down on the grain with and I'm done.

 

[odie]

My bag hangs over the kettle for the entire boil. I'll squeeze it a few times during the boil as well.

 

[fun4stuff]

Only for those who like extra work and extra cleaning. If you let gravity fully drain it, by the end of the boil there won't be enough liquid left to make squeezing worth the sticky mess that it is.



A bag that has been allowed to fully drain by gravity will not have a gallon of wort in it. Not even close.

I really want to test this out. It’s just so easy for my to squeeze it with my buckets though...

 

[LittleRiver]

... It’s just so easy for my to squeeze it with my buckets though...

It'll be even easier when you don't squeeze, and don't have to clean up your squeezing buckets.

In the end there is no "right" or "wrong" way. If you're having fun, you're doing it right. This is a hobby after all.

I have the option of adding steps like squeezing and sparging, and adding gear such as a mash re-circulation pump. But without any of those things I'm getting BH efficiency in the low 80's, producing clear great tasting beer. Adding unnecessary steps, hardware, and cleaning would be downgrades.

 

[fun4stuff]

It'll be even easier when you don't squeeze, and don't have to clean up your squeezing buckets.

In the end there is no "right" or "wrong" way. If you're having fun, you're doing it right. This is a hobby after all.

I have the option of adding steps like squeezing and sparging, and adding gear such as a mash re-circulation pump. But without any of those things I'm getting BH efficiency in the low 80's, producing clear great tasting beer. Adding unnecessary steps, hardware, and cleaning would be downgrades.

Totally agree! There’s no reason for a mash pump with BIAB if you’re milling grain fine enough. I’m all for cutting out unnecessary steps. I’ll let the bag drain by gravity next brew and see what happens.

 

[Carolina_Matt]

I have a big colander that fits over a bucket. I put the wilser bag on the colander, press down with a stainless steel mash paddle, then pour it into the kettle. Then I let it sit on the colander for a while, untouched, until I'm nearing a boil.

When I get over 200 degrees, I push down with the mash paddle one more time, then pour the remaining wort into the kettle. Then I get rid of the grains and clean the bag.

It doesn't take much effort, it's easy to clean (everything is pre-boil, so I just rinse it off rather than giving it an oxiclean soak).

I'm on a 120V, 1500W system so I keep a lid on the kettle while it's getting to a boil. If I hang the bag over the kettle and let it drain, that means I'll need to take the lid off, which would take longer to get to a boil. It would also increase the boil-off amount, meaning I'd need to start with more water, which would also take longer. So I save time by doing it this way.

I do like the idea of using 3 buckets though. One on the bottom, one with holes drilled in, then another at the top to press down with.

 

[balrog]

I'm with @wilserbrewer and @soccerdad and lit it drip but only during bring-up-to-boil time which for me is only about 12m. My absorb number is 0.077875 (rounding, he says sarcastically) and it's a reliably repeatable value I can plan on getting. Overall brewhouse efficiency is somewhere around mid 70s, again repeatable so I can plan accordingly and have no issues. It's just easier.

 

[fun4stuff]

I do like the idea of using 3 buckets though. One on the bottom, one with holes drilled in, then another at the top to press down with.

It is super easy and very fast/efficient, especially if you’re 200 lbs like me. Most people have an extra bucket laying around to drill holes in too. As noted it is an extra bucket to clean though (I’m usually already using The 2 other buckets and would be cleaning them anyhow). I just spray them down with very hot water in my large utility sink since it is all pre-boil. Takes 2-3 mins and usually do it while I’m waiting for water to reach boiling. Never had any visible mold grow on them. Isn’t any need for detergent if you clean them before the sugary mash solution dries on them.

 

[applescrap]

Haha, for supposedly being easy one kettle brewing, we are talking about cleaning 3 buckets and boards and clamps. What happened to no fuss? At that point and I have questioned this before, batch sparging 2 v brewing seems easier. A batch sparge iiac equals your average squeeze and or out performs until a certain gravity. Doug could weigh in here, but bottom line is drain, fill drain, seems easy enough. I squeeze in collander over bucket, but over time I become increasingly aware that it becomes not so worth it at some point. The cleaning, potential messes, etc..arent worth a pound of grain, but I never add that extra pound and squeeze instead. Gravity is the best option with a gravity squeeze here and there.

 

[dstockwell]

I just let it drain in a colander in the same bucket the grains were in, no patience to clean more items than i need to..

 

[EthanH]

I put it in a colander over my smaller kettle till about 15 minutes before end of boil. Give it a few lackluster presses with a saucepan lid, then dump the drained/pressed wort in there.

Only issue is sometimes if my boil isn't vigorous enough (like if it's 18º outside), it kind of slows things down.

 

[beerisyummy]

Hmmm the three-bucket method sounds interesting. I do a dunk-sparge in a wide pot. I have a large colander that fits over the pot. I put the grain bag in that, put a piece of foil over it so I don't burn my hands, and then mash on that sucker for a few minutes. If I do a good job, there's less than a quart of liquid that seeps out of the grains when I set them aside. However, I do 5 gallon batches. This method would not work for larger amounts of grain, in fact 13-14 lbs is about my limit with this "system" -- more than that, I'm spilling stuff over the side of the colander onto the floor

 

[cubalz]

I let the bag drain for about 15 minutes or until the liquid stops draining out in a constant stream/steady drip.

 

[Ultryx]

I lift the bag and let it drain for a few minutes right above the liquid level in the kettle. Then I set the bag on top of an old pizza plate thing with holes and squeeze the bag into a 5-gallon bucket below it. I think I will make a 3 bucket press system for my next brew. That will make it easier to extract as much liquid as possible. I haven't had any issues hitting target a target SG though. If anything maybe it will improve my efficiency. I could also do a 1-gallon ghetto sparge probably. I don't know how fancy I want to get right now.

 

[fun4stuff]

I tried just letting the bag hang over the pot during my last brew a few days ago (5 gallon batch).

Once pot reach boiling i pressed the bag using the 3 bucket system i posted about above. I still got about 0.5 gallons from the bag. l even after letting the bag hang for 15-20 mins.

Took me maybe an extra minute of effort to squeeze bag with this technique and another min to spray the buckets off when finished.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

I use to squeeze the daylights out of it, until I really started paying attention to how much liquid I was actually getting out of it.,,, not much. It isn't worth all of the trouble. I have Wilser's bag and pulley setup and suspend it over the kettle till it basically stops. I use to pour water over it also, but seeing the color was so light - I figured I was also getting very little out of that also.

 

[cgriffith]

I use the double bucket method. I agree that gravity method is the best; no extra work or equipment to clean. However, for my process, if I wanted to go the pulley route, I would have to spend money on a tripod and pulley. I already had the buckets. Both methods achieve the goal, it just depends on which method works best for you.

 

[Nanuk-O-Dah-Nort]

My first BIAB I squeezed the bag by twisting it to tighten then pressing down also.
I did this for about 5 min til I got no more liquid puddling up.
After setting the bag aside for hours, there was little to no liquid in the container.
I doubt I got 2L from a 4kg grain bill.

I will be trying the buckets next as I don’t have my pulley System rigged yet.

There are some great ideas here.
I will be letting my bag drip out after my next squeeze just to see if I am missing any.

 

[Cyclman]

I both hang and squeeze. I can get my grain out of the way and my bag clean before the boil is ever over.

 

[fun4stuff]

I both hang and squeeze. I can get my grain out of the way and my bag clean before the boil is ever over.View attachment 679956
View attachment 679957

i like it. Much better than using big wood boats.

 

[beerisyummy]

It is super easy and very fast/efficient, especially if you’re 200 lbs like me. Most people have an extra bucket laying around to drill holes in too. As noted it is an extra bucket to clean though (I’m usually already using The 2 other buckets and would be cleaning them anyhow). I just spray them down with very hot water in my large utility sink since it is all pre-boil. Takes 2-3 mins and usually do it while I’m waiting for water to reach boiling. Never had any visible mold grow on them. Isn’t any need for detergent if you clean them before the sugary mash solution dries on them.

Tried the bucket squeeze last week. Really, cleaning the buckets ain't no thang. Just hose 'em off during the boil, when you'd otherwise be sitting on your arse for 60-90 minutes...