Hops, hops, hops

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prcbrewer

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Hey everyone,

So I have a ton of summit, cascade, vanguard, horizon, galaxy, and citra hops. I am having some trouble as to what to do with these varieties... More the summit, vanguard, and horizon. I am not too familiar with them and their usages, but I got my hands on quite a bit of them for free. Any suggestions will be much appreciated!
 

bobbrews

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Brew a big double IPA with all those hops!!

Horizon is a very clean bittering hop for IPAs. Similar to Magnum hops, but better IMO. It has decent aroma, but not as much as Summit, Cascade, Galaxy, or Citra; use these hops anywhere from 15-10-5-0-Dryhop.

The only one I haven't used that you listed is Vanguard. After reading up on it, it appears to be more of a Noble European hop in character. Try making a Pilsner or a Kolsch with it.
 

Juno_Malone

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Totally agree with bobbrews. When life gives you hops...make hopenade! AKA a double IPA. Here's how I would use the varieties you listed:

Summit - Bittering, 60min addition. Look for 40-80 IBUs depending on your OG.

Cascade - Use in a trio as your aroma hops. 0.5oz @ 15 min, 0.5oz @ 5 min, 0.5oz @ 0 min.
Vanguard - Use in a trio as your aroma hops. 0.5oz @ 15 min, 0.5oz @ 5 min, 0.5oz @ 0 min.
Horizon - Use in a trio as your aroma hops. 0.5oz @ 15 min, 0.5oz @ 5 min, 0.5oz @ 0 min.

Galaxy - Never used as a dry hop before, but I'd pair it with the Citra. The "citrus, peach and passion fruit flavors" should create a glorious fruitbomb along with the Citra. 1-2oz per 5gal, 7-10 days before bottling.
Citra - One of my favorite dry hops. 1-2oz per 5gal, 7-10 days before bottling.

If you want to simplify things, leave out the Vanguard, and either leave out the Horizon or use it to replace Summit as your bittering hop. That'd leave you with Cascade as your aroma hop, at 15 min, 5 min, and 0 min. You could also use Citra or Galaxy for aroma along with the Cascade.
 
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prcbrewer

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Totally agree with bobbrews. When life gives you hops...make hopenade! AKA a double IPA. Here's how I would use the varieties you listed:

Summit - Bittering, 60min addition. Look for 40-80 IBUs depending on your OG.

Cascade - Use in a trio as your aroma hops. 0.5oz @ 15 min, 0.5oz @ 5 min, 0.5oz @ 0 min.
Vanguard - Use in a trio as your aroma hops. 0.5oz @ 15 min, 0.5oz @ 5 min, 0.5oz @ 0 min.
Horizon - Use in a trio as your aroma hops. 0.5oz @ 15 min, 0.5oz @ 5 min, 0.5oz @ 0 min.

Galaxy - Never used as a dry hop before, but I'd pair it with the Citra. The "citrus, peach and passion fruit flavors" should create a glorious fruitbomb along with the Citra. 1-2oz per 5gal, 7-10 days before bottling.
Citra - One of my favorite dry hops. 1-2oz per 5gal, 7-10 days before bottling.

If you want to simplify things, leave out the Vanguard, and either leave out the Horizon or use it to replace Summit as your bittering hop. That'd leave you with Cascade as your aroma hop, at 15 min, 5 min, and 0 min. You could also use Citra or Galaxy for aroma along with the Cascade.
Brew a big double IPA with all those hops!!

Horizon is a very clean bittering hop for IPAs. Similar to Magnum hops, but better IMO. It has decent aroma, but not as much as Summit, Cascade, Galaxy, or Citra; use these hops anywhere from 15-10-5-0-Dryhop.

The only one I haven't used that you listed is Vanguard. After reading up on it, it appears to be more of a Noble European hop in character. Try making a Pilsner or a Kolsch with it.


Thanks for the replies guys! I was thinking some sort of IIPA or something of the sort. The thing is, the Alphas on the summit are 20.4% and the horizons are 10.5%. I have used the summit in an IPA before (and only about a 1/4-1/2 oz) and they were almost overpowering with not much flavor/aroma but a ton of almost harsh bitterness. I would love to use them as bittering hops in a IIPA but I just dont want them to kill the beer. I also have ahtanum, some willamette, about 2 oz. columbus, and 1 oz. of equinox. If these will make a killer IIPA just let me know which ones I should use. Havent brewed many IIPA's so I am not sure about all of the specifics about them. Although I did brew the pliny clone this weekend and it smells AWESOME!

Thanks again!
 

bobbrews

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Using either Summit, Columbus, or Horizon for the bittering addition would all work out for you. However, relying on the highest alpha aa% hop would actually make the most sense.

Try a 90 minute boil with your first hop addition added at 60 minutes. That should cut down on the harsh bitterness due to the fact that you will have an excellent hot break and the harsh polyphenols will be more easily attracted to the larger wort proteins. After the boil, these harsh tannins will be caught in the trub, which you will rack off of when it comes time to transfer to the primary.

Ahtanum (earthy, spicy, orange), Willamette (woodsy, spicy, earthy), Columbus (piney, citrusy, dankness).

Had to look this one up... Equinox: Extremely high total oil content. A pronounced aroma profile with citrus, tropical fruit, floral and herbal characteristics. Specific descriptors include lemon, lime, papaya, apple, and green pepper.


If I had all of the hops you had, I would use Summit, Columbus, Cascade, Equinox, and Galaxy for my IIPA. Follow this up with an APA featuring Horizon, Ahtanum, and Citra. Save the Vanguard and Willamette for a Pilsner or a Kolsch.
 
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prcbrewer

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Using either Summit, Columbus, or Horizon for the bittering addition would all work out for you. However, relying on the highest alpha aa% hop would actually make the most sense.

Try a 90 minute boil with your first hop addition added at 60 minutes. That should cut down on the harsh bitterness due to the fact that you will have an excellent hot break and the harsh polyphenols will be more easily attracted to the larger wort proteins. After the boil, these harsh tannins will be caught in the trub, which you will rack off of when it comes time to transfer to the primary.

Ahtanum (earthy, spicy, orange), Willamette (woodsy, spicy, earthy), Columbus (piney, citrusy, dankness).

Had to look this one up... Equinox: Extremely high total oil content. A pronounced aroma profile with citrus, tropical fruit, floral and herbal characteristics. Specific descriptors include lemon, lime, papaya, apple, and green pepper.


If I had all of the hops you had, I would use Summit, Columbus, Cascade, Equinox, and Galaxy for my IIPA. Follow this up with an APA featuring Horizon, Ahtanum, and Citra. Save the Vanguard and Willamette for a Pilsner or a Kolsch.

Thanks for the great suggestions! Sounds like a good plan to me. For the IIPA with a 90 min boil, do you think this hop schedule would be good:

1.0 oz horizon @ 90
1.0 oz summit @ 60
1.0 oz horizon @ 60
1.0 oz columbus @ 45
1.0 oz cascade @ 30
1.0 oz galaxy @ 15
1.0 oz galaxy, cascade, and equinox each @ 1 min

I suppose I could do some sort of dry hop as well, but since there is a lot of late additions of flavor/aroma hops at the end of the boil, dry hopping may not be necessary.

Its a lot of hops, but they are getting a little old now and I want to use them up. I did vacuum seal them shortly after I brought them home though so they should be pretty much alright.

Any further suggestions would be great! I just have a lot of hops and not a lot of ideas as to what to do with them.
 

brdb

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Thanks for the great suggestions! Sounds like a good plan to me. For the IIPA with a 90 min boil, do you think this hop schedule would be good:

1.0 oz horizon @ 90
1.0 oz summit @ 60
1.0 oz horizon @ 60
1.0 oz columbus @ 45
1.0 oz cascade @ 30
1.0 oz galaxy @ 15
1.0 oz galaxy, cascade, and equinox each @ 1 min
In my experience, the 30min+ additions are not going to contribute much more than just bitterness so I would use the 90min addition to achieve an IBU level slightly below my desired IBU level, and then all other additions would take place with 15min or less (this is the time where you'll get noticeable hop flavor/aroma contribution). For my IPAs, I personally only use a bittering addition (first wort or beginning of boil) and everything else is added with 5min or less, or whirlpooled (it is during these times that hop flavor/aroma are maximized).
 

bobbrews

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Thanks for the great suggestions! Sounds like a good plan to me. For the IIPA with a 90 min boil, do you think this hop schedule would be good:

1.0 oz horizon @ 90
1.0 oz summit @ 60
1.0 oz horizon @ 60
1.0 oz columbus @ 45
1.0 oz cascade @ 30
1.0 oz galaxy @ 15
1.0 oz galaxy, cascade, and equinox each @ 1 min

I suppose I could do some sort of dry hop as well, but since there is a lot of late additions of flavor/aroma hops at the end of the boil, dry hopping may not be necessary.

Its a lot of hops, but they are getting a little old now and I want to use them up. I did vacuum seal them shortly after I brought them home though so they should be pretty much alright.

Any further suggestions would be great! I just have a lot of hops and not a lot of ideas as to what to do with them.
Remove the 90 minute addition and DO NOT fwh.

25-40% total recipe hops by weight at whirlpool/hopstand.... 40-50% total recipe hops by weight for the dryhop.

No hops added between 55-1 minutes.
10 oz. Minimum total recipe hops.

Use the remainder of your % at 60 or 75 minutes as the bittering charge.
 
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prcbrewer

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Remove the 90 minute addition and DO NOT fwh.

25-40% total recipe hops by weight at whirlpool/hopstand.... 40-50% total recipe hops by weight for the dryhop.

No hops added between 55-1 minutes.
10 oz. Minimum total recipe hops.

Use the remainder of your % at 60 or 75 minutes as the bittering charge.
OK, so I think I have formulated a pretty decent recipe.
Grain Bill:
12 # 2-Row
2 # munich
0.75 # Carapils
0.5 # C-60
0.75 # Dextrose

Hop Bill:

1 oz horizon and 1 oz summit @ 60 mins
1 oz columbus @ 30 mins
1 oz horizon 1 oz cascade 1 oz summit @ 5 mins
1 oz galaxy 0.5 oz equinox @ 1 min

Dry Hop:
0.5 oz Equinox for 7 days
1 oz Galaxy for 7 days
2 oz Cascade for 7 days

I know the hop schedule is a little against your suggestion, but I feel like it kind of makes sense within the parameters of other IIPA/IPA's that I have made. How do these additions look? I have never used summit as anything other than bittering, and I know they are a bittering hop, but the profile on them has some interesting descriptors that may work as a late addition. Some descriptors are spicy, earthy, onion, citrus (orange, tangerine & grapefruit) which makes it seem as though they may be decent for late additions. How am I looking?
 

bobbrews

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Early hop additions 90-60 minutes harness optimal bittering potential with extremely low flavor and aroma potential, if any.

Middle hop additions between 45-20 minutes offers lesser bittering power than 90-60 minutes, and lesser flavor and aroma potential than late boil/hopstand/dryhop additions. I personally see no point of ever adding hops during these times when you can get the best of both worlds by focusing on the other addition slots.

Late hop additions between 15-0 minutes (flameout) offers soft bitterness and slightly different flavor and aroma compared to hopstand and dryhop additions, since some of the delicate aromatic and flavorful hop compounds persist during a short boil, while others are destroyed.

Post-boil, sub 165 F additions and dryhop additions offer the most potent aroma and flavor from the hops, but no bitterness. The dryhop is the most important addition for an American IPA in my opinion, and where I suggest using 40-50% of your total recipe hops by weight. This is about the amount of dryhops by total recipe % that is used in many top examples, including: Pliny, Heady, Head Hunter, Tricerahops, Stone IPA, Kern Citra, Firestone Union and Double Jack.


It's all personal opinion from there really...

-For my tastes, Munich would be absent completely or 6% tops. I don't like those very malty, rich, deep toasty, nutty flavors in a crisp, clean, hop forward American IIPA.

-With 16# of malt and 13% Munich, you might want to look into bumping up your hopstand (3.0 - 4.5 oz) and dryhop (4.0 - 5.5 oz for 4-5 days, perhaps in two split additions). 7.5 total oz. is pretty weak for a Double IIPA, especially if 2 oz. is used earlier on.
 

CarbonTom

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OK, so I think I have formulated a pretty decent recipe.
Grain Bill:
12 # 2-Row
2 # munich
0.75 # Carapils
0.5 # C-60
0.75 # Dextrose

Hop Bill:

1 oz horizon and 1 oz summit @ 60 mins
1 oz columbus @ 30 mins
1 oz horizon 1 oz cascade 1 oz summit @ 5 mins
1 oz galaxy 0.5 oz equinox @ 1 min

Dry Hop:
0.5 oz Equinox for 7 days
1 oz Galaxy for 7 days
2 oz Cascade for 7 days

I know the hop schedule is a little against your suggestion, but I feel like it kind of makes sense within the parameters of other IIPA/IPA's that I have made. How do these additions look? I have never used summit as anything other than bittering, and I know they are a bittering hop, but the profile on them has some interesting descriptors that may work as a late addition. Some descriptors are spicy, earthy, onion, citrus (orange, tangerine & grapefruit) which makes it seem as though they may be decent for late additions. How am I looking?

FWIW I made a 100% summit pale ale and it was a juicy tangerine aroma and taste, it was amazing. I have heard of getting the onion and garlic, but I haven't found it in this beer. I had additions for bittering, 15, 10, flameout, and dry hop with it too. On the other hand, a friend used it in an ipa and got the savory characteristics and dumped the batch. It might take on that characteristic in high concentrations.

I'd say your recipe looks great.
 
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prcbrewer

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Early hop additions 90-60 minutes harness optimal bittering potential with extremely low flavor and aroma potential, if any.

Middle hop additions between 45-20 minutes offers lesser bittering power than 90-60 minutes, and lesser flavor and aroma potential than late boil/hopstand/dryhop additions. I personally see no point of ever adding hops during these times when you can get the best of both worlds by focusing on the other addition slots.

Late hop additions between 15-0 minutes (flameout) offers soft bitterness and slightly different flavor and aroma compared to hopstand and dryhop additions, since some of the delicate aromatic and flavorful hop compounds persist during a short boil, while others are destroyed.

Post-boil, sub 165 F additions and dryhop additions offer the most potent aroma and flavor from the hops, but no bitterness. The dryhop is the most important addition for an American IPA in my opinion, and where I suggest using 40-50% of your total recipe hops by weight. This is about the amount of dryhops by total recipe % that is used in many top examples, including: Pliny, Heady, Head Hunter, Tricerahops, Stone IPA, Kern Citra, Firestone Union and Double Jack.


It's all personal opinion from there really...

-For my tastes, Munich would be absent completely or 6% tops. I don't like those very malty, rich, deep toasty, nutty flavors in a crisp, clean, hop forward American IIPA.

-With 16# of malt and 13% Munich, you might want to look into bumping up your hopstand (3.0 - 4.5 oz) and dryhop (4.0 - 5.5 oz for 4-5 days, perhaps in two split additions). 7.5 total oz. is pretty weak for a Double IIPA, especially if 2 oz. is used earlier on.
Alright, so I have re-formulated the recipe, and I think its looking a lot better now.

Grain Bill:
14# 2-Row
0.75# C-60
0.75# Carapils
0.75# Dextrose

Boil Additions:
@ 60 mins:
2.5 oz horizon
1.5 oz summit

@ 15 mins:
1 oz columbus
1 oz horizon
1 oz cascade

@ Flame-out:
1 oz galaxy
1.5 oz horizon
1.5 oz cascade
0.5 oz Equinox

Dry Hop Additions:
DH #1 for 4 days:
1.5 oz horizon
1.5 oz cascade

DH #2 for 3 days after DH #1:
1 oz galaxy
0.5 oz equinox


I am also thinking about doing a mash hop with about an ounce of horizon and ounce of cascade. I did this as per the pliny clone recipe, so maybe I could use up some more hops and get some more complexity doing this step as well...

This brings the total hops to over one pound. How is it lookin' now? Also, if there are any other places that you think summit could go, I want to use as much of those as possible because I have a ton of them!

Thanks for all of the help!
 

bobbrews

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Typing this on my phone... maybe something more like this with 13 oz. hops:

90 minute boil

@ 60 mins:
1 oz horizon
1 oz summit

@ 5 mins:
1 oz columbus
1 oz cascade

@ Post-boil 160F Hopstand:
1 oz summit
1 oz cascade
1 oz columbus

DH #1 for 4 days (after 4 days, pull them out and discard):
1 oz galaxy
1 oz summit
1 oz cascade

DH #2 for 4 days (after 4 days, pull them out and bottle):
1 oz galaxy
1 oz equinox
1 oz cascade
 
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prcbrewer

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Typing this on my phone... maybe something more like this with 13 oz. hops:

90 minute boil

@ 60 mins:
1 oz horizon
1 oz summit

@ 5 mins:
1 oz columbus
1 oz cascade

@ Post-boil 160F Hopstand:
1 oz summit
1 oz cascade
1 oz columbus

DH #1 for 4 days (after 4 days, pull them out and discard):
1 oz galaxy
1 oz summit
1 oz cascade

DH #2 for 4 days (after 4 days, pull them out and bottle):
1 oz galaxy
1 oz equinox
1 oz cascade
Sounds great. You don't think the late addition and dry hop of the summit will impart any onion/garlic flavors though do you?
 

bobbrews

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Sounds great. You don't think the late addition and dry hop of the summit will impart any onion/garlic flavors though do you?
I've never gotten that from Summit, personally, though I only use it post boil and dryhop. It is noticeable In Founders Devil Dancer though. The battering charge should be rather undectable as far as flavor goes.

Late additions are more like tangerine and grapefruit with some dankness.
 
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prcbrewer

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I've never gotten that from Summit, personally, though I only use it post boil and dryhop. It is noticeable In Founders Devil Dancer though. The battering charge should be rather undectable as far as flavor goes.

Late additions are more like tangerine and grapefruit with some dankness.

Gotchya. I have just been reading a lot of posts lately that say people who use them late don't get much tangerine but rather the onion/garlic/savory aromas and flavors.
 
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prcbrewer

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I've never gotten that from Summit, personally, though I only use it post boil and dryhop. It is noticeable In Founders Devil Dancer though. The battering charge should be rather undectable as far as flavor goes.

Late additions are more like tangerine and grapefruit with some dankness.

Gotchya. I have just been reading a lot of posts lately that say people who use them late don't get much tangerine but rather the onion/garlic/savory aromas and flavors.
 

bobbrews

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Gotchya. I have just been reading a lot of posts lately that say people who use them late don't get much tangerine but rather the onion/garlic/savory aromas and flavors.
In my experience, the onion notes are more prevalent in the recipes where people use hops with those traits in the boil. There is also huge variation of flavor from crop to crop, grower to grower.

The allium character is not always undesirable. Combine this with other fruity, tropical, piney, citrusy hops and The final flavor totally changes and you're left with something rather complex.
 
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prcbrewer

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In my experience, the onion notes are more prevalent in the recipes where people use hops with those traits in the boil. There is also huge variation of flavor from crop to crop, grower to grower.

The allium character is not always undesirable. Combine this with other fruity, tropical, piney, citrusy hops and The final flavor totally changes and you're left with something rather complex.
That makes a lot of sense. I guess it would just be like dry hopping with columbus along with the other hops in say the pliny clone. I will throw some summit in at the end like you say.
 

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Alright, so I have re-formulated the recipe, and I think its looking a lot better now.

Grain Bill:
14# 2-Row
0.75# C-60
0.75# Carapils
0.75# Dextrose

Boil Additions:
@ 60 mins:
2.5 oz horizon
1.5 oz summit

@ 15 mins:
1 oz columbus
1 oz horizon
1 oz cascade

@ Flame-out:
1 oz galaxy
1.5 oz horizon
1.5 oz cascade
0.5 oz Equinox

Dry Hop Additions:
DH #1 for 4 days:
1.5 oz horizon
1.5 oz cascade

DH #2 for 3 days after DH #1:
1 oz galaxy
0.5 oz equinox
4 oz of super high AA hops at 60 mins is going to give you really harsh bitterness I would think. I would cut those additions down and do almost everything towards the end. Also, a hop stand will give you waaay more flavor and aroma than simply adding hops at flameout. Do some reasearch and you'll find some good info on hop stands but the basic idea is cool the wort down to 180F, add the hops at that point, let it sit without cooling for 25min or so, then you chill your wort to pitching temp.

I tried it one time and have never went back.
 

beowulf

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This is addressing more your initial post, but couldn't resist since I never hear anything about Vanguard hops. I ended up with a pound once and had to get creative with it....and I still have some left. Anyway, I've had great luck with that hop in a Saison as well as a German Altbier. I have also added it in late with other hops for an IPA and it worked out great.
 
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