Hop Substitution for Ayinger Oktober Fest-Marzen

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jahdrummin

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Hey everyone... new to the fourm! I got a recipie for an Ayinger Oktober Fest Marzen and i am wondering about a hop substitution... It asks for the use of Tettnanger as the bittering (1.4 OZ) and the use of a German Hollertou Hersbrucker as the flavoring hop (only 1/4 OZ)....

I have an OZ of Cascade and an OZ of Willamette Hops on hand and noticed that the AA % is close for a substatution? am i in dream land or will the hops i have work for what the recipe is asking for? if you wanna mail me directly [email protected] that would be cool, otherwise i will keep on checking back till one of you brew jedi can help out!

thanks much
 

EinGutesBier

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First, for future reference, refer to this hop substitution chart:

http://www.brew365.com/hop_substitution_chart.php

If that one doesn't work for you, I can tell you that there are plenty of other charts out there.

According to the chart, and others I'd assume, your Cascade and Willamette hops don't quite do the trick. However, in my personal experience, both as a brewer and a beer drinker, I feel that those hops would suit the style well. Many purists who think you need x-hops and y-malts for a beer style aren't always necessarily right because part of brewing is innovation. If that's what you've got on hand, don't get bent of shape, just use those hops and make your beer as best you can.

Long story short, I don't see why you couldn't use them.
 

srm775

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EinGutesBier said:
First, for future reference, refer to this hop substitution chart:

http://www.brew365.com/hop_substitution_chart.php

If that one doesn't work for you, I can tell you that there are plenty of other charts out there.

According to the chart, and others I'd assume, your Cascade and Willamette hops don't quite do the trick. However, in my personal experience, both as a brewer and a beer drinker, I feel that those hops would suit the style well. Many purists who think you need x-hops and y-malts for a beer style aren't always necessarily right because part of brewing is innovation. If that's what you've got on hand, don't get bent of shape, just use those hops and make your beer as best you can.

Long story short, I don't see why you couldn't use them.
I really don't think the Cascades would fit that style at all. The Willmette will be fine and you could probably get away with just that, but the citrusy, grape-fruit flavors would be really off putting for a Marzen. If you did use the cascades, use only a 1/4 of what you need to match and use the willmette for the rest. I.e. use willmette 1-to-1 for the first hops sub, then use a bit of cascades mixed with willmette for the other.
 

mrkristofo

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I agree that Cascades would be a poor choice.

I'd sub Willamettes for the Tettnang, and Mt Hood for the Hersbruckers. Or go all Willamette, but definitely a no on the Cascades.
 
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jahdrummin

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so i am still new to the whole substituting thing and also have a bit of warrior and a bunch of Nugget hops as well ... would either of those work?
 

EinGutesBier

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srm775 said:
I really don't think the Cascades would fit that style at all. The Willmette will be fine and you could probably get away with just that, but the citrusy, grape-fruit flavors would be really off putting for a Marzen. If you did use the cascades, use only a 1/4 of what you need to match and use the willmette for the rest. I.e. use willmette 1-to-1 for the first hops sub, then use a bit of cascades mixed with willmette for the other.
In regard to style, you're pretty much right about the Cascades. I guess it depends on whether our friend wants to brew the style or his own version of it. Some of the best known beers were created spontaneously or out of necessity.
 

srm775

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EinGutesBier said:
In regard to style, you're pretty much right about the Cascades. I guess it depends on whether our friend wants to brew the style or his own version of it. Some of the best known beers were created spontaneously or out of necessity.
That's true ... I'm all for experimenting. I just don't think the flavor profiles of a typical Marzen/Oktoberfest would blend very well with the flavor profiles of cascades. Regardless of style, the clean malty flavor you get with a properly brewed marzen would really conflict with the citrus/grape-fruit flavors of cascades.
 

Biermann

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Liberty is a good substitution for Hallertau varieties, as it is a North American Hallertau variant. Willamette would be acceptable, although a little off from Tettnang.
 

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