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Hop Flavor Help in IPA

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Breck09

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So I have been brewing off and on for quite a while and starting to get back into it more here recently. I brewed a Two Heated Ale clone from the Bell's website on 02/29/20 and kegged it 2 weeks ago and have had a couple of pints off of it the last couple of days. I used quite a bit of hops and the hop flavor that I was expecting just isn't there. Below is the recipe. Any thoughts of why it might be lacking flavor and aroma? My thoughts are that maybe using bottled water from Kroger (local grocery store) might be the issue or that when cold crashing I am getting oxygen suck back that could cause staling. Although with it being still fairly young I don't know if oxidation would be the issue. Thanks.

10lb Two Row
3lb Pale Ale Malt
.5lb Caramel 40
1.25oz at 45 min
1.25oz at 30 min
3.5oz Dry Hop
WLP001 Cal Ale Yeast
 

Jag75

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Could be getting oxidized . I've heard some people say oxidation muddles hop flavor. How is the color of the beer? Is the water regular drinking water or is it RO ? It should be mid 50s to low 60 in ibu so the hop presence should be there. Did you dry hop 3-5 days before you kegged?
 
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Breck09

Breck09

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Could be getting oxidized . I've heard some people say oxidation muddles hop flavor. How is the color of the beer? Is the water regular drinking water or is it RO ? It should be mid 50s to low 60 in ibu so the hop presence should be there. Did you dry hop 3-5 days before you kegged?
It is their "Drinking Water" that I use. I actually dry hopped for a couple more days than that due to getting busy and not being able to keg right away. Maybe a little over a week.
 

Jag75

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I'm taking it you've never done this clone before so you have nothing to compare it to . Have you brewed a different IPA before that turned out the way you wanted? The water I'm not sure . I use RO water and build using Bru N Water . The drinking water you used has some minerals but dont know how much.

I dont cold crash , I've always been afraid of suck back and oxidation . I have the proper set up to do it and still dont . Maybe some day. Are you doing closed transfers to a purged keg? Hoppy beers are touchy and you might be experiencing the beginning of oxidation.
 
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Breck09

Breck09

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No I have never done the clone before and assumed it wouldn't be a like for like but thought it would be sorta close. Like I said in the original post I haven't brewed consistently lately due to family but I have brewed and IPA before and some Pale Ales and they have always seemed to have lacked the hop "punch" that I think they should have. I am not doing closed transfers so it could be picking up oxygen that way as well. Maybe I will try RO water next time around and build up, that is until I can get my home water sent in for a test. I need to do that.

/edit Thinking about it, RO water wouldn't be possible for me since I don't have a system. I was thinking of something else.
 

Dgallo

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If you’re not preventing suckback during cold crashing than you are 100% experiencing oxidation. The air in the headspace will contract rapidly and pull 02 in within an hour and then as temp drop further more and more gets pulled in. So o2 has been in contact with your beer for practically the entire coldcrash time.
 

Rob2010SS

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No I have never done the clone before and assumed it wouldn't be a like for like but thought it would be sorta close. Like I said in the original post I haven't brewed consistently lately due to family but I have brewed and IPA before and some Pale Ales and they have always seemed to have lacked the hop "punch" that I think they should have. I am not doing closed transfers so it could be picking up oxygen that way as well. Maybe I will try RO water next time around and build up, that is until I can get my home water sent in for a test. I need to do that.

/edit Thinking about it, RO water wouldn't be possible for me since I don't have a system. I was thinking of something else.
If you're buying water at the grocery store anyway, you could go with distilled and do as stated by @Jag75 and build your water from there. Distilled and RO are fairly interchangeable.

Also as stated, hoppy beers are very susceptible to oxygen. As @Dgallo just stated, cold crashing without avoiding suckback is for sure at least PART of the issue. People who brew a lot of NEIPA (granted, different style) go to extensive lengths to avoid any and all oxygen for that reason.
 

Rob2010SS

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And yes, closed transfers make a huge difference as well. Doesn't take much but a few little pieces of hardware to be able to do closed transfers. Would highly recommend that.
 
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Breck09

Breck09

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Awesome guys, thanks for all the feedback. I have recently rigged something to help with cold crash suck back (mylar balloons) and plan on eventually getting the Cold Crash Guardian from BrewHardware to help with that. I have a water filter built but haven't had the water coming out of it tested so I could build the water from there. Wondering if distilled water and building up from there might just be easier for the time being.
 

Dgallo

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I have a water filter built but haven't had the water coming out of it tested so I could build the water from there. Wondering if distilled water and building up from there might just be easier for the time being.
They both will be just as easily but without knowing the current water make up from your tap you won’t be able to target any specific water profiles or ppm. I would suggest building from distilled water for now so you can accurately adjust your water and ph
 

Jag75

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Well it sounds like the issue has always been there , likely due to cold crashing so like Dgallo said its oxidation. As far as water profiles, I cant express enough how easy it is using programs and adding salts and acids . I tried using tap water and adjusting with minerals and even diluting with RO but eventually just went 100% RO as its much easier . If you brew another before you get your set up try not cold crashing . You keg so it will cold crash there .
 

InspectorJon

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My water utility company has a water report that is updated each year on their website. If you get water from a public utility and not your own well you may be able to get a water profile from them
 
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Breck09

Breck09

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My water utility company has a water report that is updated each year on their website. If you get water from a public utility and not your own well you may be able to get a water profile from them
I got one from them a long time ago and it didn't have everything I needed to plug into the software I was using. Maybe I will try again and see what they have.
 

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