Are there other examples of successful breweries that run on The Alchemist model of high demand/low output. The last time I was up there The Alchemist was on a schedule where they would can on Mondays and sell out by the weekend. Are their breweries in other parts of the country that can regularly sell out without frustrating their customers?
High Demand/Low Supply Breweries
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NHatcbrewer
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Treehouse does a pretty good job. They can 3-4 days a week and sell out within 1-2 days of canning. They only sell their product at the brewery though. As long as you are willing to drive to the brewery you can always get your hands on what you want.
howamidriving
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Hill Farmstead comes to mind. Aside from the fact that you apparently need a Sherpa to find the place their beers are very highly regarded.
Oh Treehouse. Nice. I've read posts about cloning Julius and the like but don't know much about them. Thanks!
Hill Farmstead is definitely out there. When we passed through a couple years back we had to bail on plans to visit because we weren't sure the kids would endure the extra trip into the mountains.
Any others?
Hill Farmstead is definitely out there. When we passed through a couple years back we had to bail on plans to visit because we weren't sure the kids would endure the extra trip into the mountains.
Any others?
Auger
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NEBCO is another one, lines around the block when they announce releases of G-Bot and FBD.
Aristotelian
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Isn't that basically the business model for all the Belgian monasteries?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westvleteren_Brewery
Make limited quantities of good product, don't grow, just do it exactly the same and keep turning a profit.
Currently, the beer is priced at €32.00 (Blonde), €37.00 (8°) and €42.00 (12°) per 24-bottle crate (excluding bottle/crate deposit). Deposit for empty bottles and crate: €12 (€9.60 for the crate plus €0.10 per bottle). Glasses specifically designed to drink the beer can be purchased at the abbey in packs of 4 for €16.
Buyers were originally limited to ten 24-bottle crates of the beer per car, but as the beer increased in popularity, this was first reduced to five, then to three and now to two or one crates. For the Westvleteren 12 in 2009, it was limited to one case. When making an order now, the type and quantity of beer available for sale are revealed. Sales are limited to one order every 60 days per person per license plate and phone number. Also, the beer must be reserved on their "beerphone" beforehand.[6] The monks do not sell beer to individuals who drive up to the abbey hoping to purchase beer. The reason for this is to eliminate commercial reselling, and hence give all visitors a chance to purchase the product.
The current production is 4750 hl (60,000 cases) per year, and has remained the same since 1946.[6]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westvleteren_Brewery
Make limited quantities of good product, don't grow, just do it exactly the same and keep turning a profit.
Currently, the beer is priced at €32.00 (Blonde), €37.00 (8°) and €42.00 (12°) per 24-bottle crate (excluding bottle/crate deposit). Deposit for empty bottles and crate: €12 (€9.60 for the crate plus €0.10 per bottle). Glasses specifically designed to drink the beer can be purchased at the abbey in packs of 4 for €16.
Buyers were originally limited to ten 24-bottle crates of the beer per car, but as the beer increased in popularity, this was first reduced to five, then to three and now to two or one crates. For the Westvleteren 12 in 2009, it was limited to one case. When making an order now, the type and quantity of beer available for sale are revealed. Sales are limited to one order every 60 days per person per license plate and phone number. Also, the beer must be reserved on their "beerphone" beforehand.[6] The monks do not sell beer to individuals who drive up to the abbey hoping to purchase beer. The reason for this is to eliminate commercial reselling, and hence give all visitors a chance to purchase the product.
The current production is 4750 hl (60,000 cases) per year, and has remained the same since 1946.[6]
3 Floyd's. The Zombie Dust sells out quickly, even at the brewery. All their other brews are readily available... obviously except seasonals and special limited releases.
3 Floyd's really is limited by Indiana law though. It's my understanding there's a production cap imposed.
3 Floyd's really is limited by Indiana law though. It's my understanding there's a production cap imposed.
JoshuaW
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Zombie Dust isnt in the same realm, I dont think. Granted, I live in Indiana, but its certainly possible to walk into a restaurant and find Zombie Dust on tap with no prior knowledge.
As far as the production caps, yeah, if you go over a certain amount of barrels you lose your micro privileges (such as the ability to self distribute, have lower taxes, etc). That was increased in 2015 to 90,000bbl, so 3 Floyd's and others should be able to ramp up over the next couple of years.
I was there a few months back. I couldn't find a drop of ZD anywhere except the brewery. I probably hit 20 shops. I had no problem finding everything else.
zam216
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Tired Hands right outside of Philly for sure.
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Each brewery has it's own path to that business model.
The Alchemist has a sad story if you've never heard it. They used to be a brewpub in waterbury and offered more than just Heady Topper. Within a month of opening their canning facility Hurricane Irene ripped through VT and destroyed the pub. Since then they've been slowly building back up. In 2013 they had to close the brewery to the public due to some zoning issues I believe. Last I heard they were looking for a new location to allow them to have an open brewery again.
I often wonder how much the "limited quantities" model amplifies the perceived quality of the beer. If you could get Tree House anywhere in New England would they have the same "they can do no wrong" reverence? Would Heady Topper be held in such high regard if it hadn't had years of being so hard to buy? They're great beers and I enjoy the hunt to find them as much as anyone else, i'm just not sure how much that hunt is adding to people's reaction to the beer.
The Alchemist has a sad story if you've never heard it. They used to be a brewpub in waterbury and offered more than just Heady Topper. Within a month of opening their canning facility Hurricane Irene ripped through VT and destroyed the pub. Since then they've been slowly building back up. In 2013 they had to close the brewery to the public due to some zoning issues I believe. Last I heard they were looking for a new location to allow them to have an open brewery again.
I often wonder how much the "limited quantities" model amplifies the perceived quality of the beer. If you could get Tree House anywhere in New England would they have the same "they can do no wrong" reverence? Would Heady Topper be held in such high regard if it hadn't had years of being so hard to buy? They're great beers and I enjoy the hunt to find them as much as anyone else, i'm just not sure how much that hunt is adding to people's reaction to the beer.
grizzly2378
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It certainly plays a part. The nearly impossible to get aspect of some beers drives the hype train a bit. I live in South Dakota and have managed to try both Heady Topper and Pliney The Elder and they're both great beers that I'm glad I got to try, but honestly I'm just as happy drinking Fresh Squeezed IPA, which I can buy any day from any of the local liquor stores.
I agree. For example, I don't think Dark Lord is that great. I've had it several time. It's way too sweet for my taste. I've gotten the same reaction from others as well. Still, I'll probably go to DLD again and buy a few bottles.
BrewCityBaller
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New Glarus in Wisconsin operates on a similar principal. They do not distribute outside of Wisconsin and refuse to do so. That sends lots of people from Illinois and Minnesota over the border for their products. Totally, universally available in Wisconsin, but impossible to find outside.
Baja_Brewer
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Lawson's Finest Liquids. Their small batch stuff? Damn near unobtanium, even in VT at the brewery.
Sure, they're contracting Sip of Sunshine and Super Session #2 at Two Roads, but thats STILL hard to track down.
Sure, they're contracting Sip of Sunshine and Super Session #2 at Two Roads, but thats STILL hard to track down.
BlkWater_brewer
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Hill Farmstead does indeed have great Brews and Heddy isn't even in the same league by a mile. But after you hire your local guide to get you there there is no guarantee you'll be able to get what you want. I drew the line with the advent of their lottery system for special releases. arrgh! As for Heddy, over hopped, over hyped cloudy brews do nothing for me.
In an odd twist the old Alchemist location first changed to a restaurant and then added the ability to brew which wasn't supposed to be possible after the flood hit them. Haven't tried the beer but the food was awesome.
Bissel Brothers in Portland Maine has an IPA that sells out. I tried a sample and was very underwhelmed. Not sure how the hype works for them.
The Portsmouth Brewery in NH used to sell out of Kate the Great in a day before the head brewer took the recipe with him. I was lucky to get a bottle before that and it was really good.
I think you need a really good beer first. Then doing small batches just makes it more special and a bit fun.
Pliny is a good example. It's not hard to find, but many liquor stores I've visited in So Cal limit how many bottles you can buy.
In Minnesota, Surly has created pretty good cachet around Darkness. Stores sell out their annual allocation quite quickly.
In Minnesota, Surly has created pretty good cachet around Darkness. Stores sell out their annual allocation quite quickly.
Auger
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orangehero
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Wow Westy 12 is $1.94 per bottle?!
Most of these VT breweries that were mentioned are just small by nature, and the intent isn't to under-produce. Naturally, of course comes the fever to get something that isn't available all the time.
Lawson's is Sean brewing on his property in a small maple shack he built. He had to use Two Roads to at least up the production of SOS and SS2. Plus, Sean has a second job.
Alchemist is really an interesting story like someone said above, and if it weren't for the canning facility opening just before the hurricane John said they would've been done.
Hill Farmstead just expanded, and Shaun always said this is probably it for growth. He wants to keep the quality top notch, and it shows. He basically brews everything himself, and just recently had Ryan come on board from Siren Craft to help out. Not every brewer has aspirations of pumping out a million bbls a year. There's something to be said for moderation. If you could have filet mignon and lobster everyday you'd probably get tired of it. These breweries are at the top, and it's a treat to get these once in a while.
Lawson's is Sean brewing on his property in a small maple shack he built. He had to use Two Roads to at least up the production of SOS and SS2. Plus, Sean has a second job.
Alchemist is really an interesting story like someone said above, and if it weren't for the canning facility opening just before the hurricane John said they would've been done.
Hill Farmstead just expanded, and Shaun always said this is probably it for growth. He wants to keep the quality top notch, and it shows. He basically brews everything himself, and just recently had Ryan come on board from Siren Craft to help out. Not every brewer has aspirations of pumping out a million bbls a year. There's something to be said for moderation. If you could have filet mignon and lobster everyday you'd probably get tired of it. These breweries are at the top, and it's a treat to get these once in a while.
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One word: Pliny
Sure, it's a pretty good beer; but if I gave it to you without you know what it is, you wouldn't cream your pants like most people seem to do when they first find it....
Yup.
I think the scarcity factor is kind of fun. It was an adventure tracking through VT in search of heady and Lawson's. I think it adds to the experience of drinking the beer. Are they that much better, maybe and maybe not. That's why I'm interested in the strategy. The alchemist structure does remind me of westy.
Jester King used to be that way in Texas. They've gotten easier to find, but for a while when they took off you'd be lucky to find more than a few bottles at the best bottle shops. Now you can find cases most of the time. Most of their fruit beers are brewery only still though.
BlkWater_brewer
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Yet you're talking up HF??
HF beers are in a different league but there again, I don't like playing games with beer, if you have to jump through hoops to get or find it - it's not worth the trouble. Especially HT!
Absolutely! I had my first (and later second) Pliny tonight, and was underwhelmed. Overhyped is an understatement. I can't believe the money people spend for an above average beer. Is it good? Yeah! Is it unbelievable? No, not by a long shot.
I'm from Chicago, so my veiw might be a little skewed. The Midwest has some of the most hidden gems in the beer market. Brands that do not get the hype they deserve. Take Revolution for example. They have basically an entire lineup that is stellar, yet most "beer aficionados" either have never given them a shot, or snub their nose at them. IMO, they're a world class brewery. Hell! They distribute to Tokyo now! Fantastic all around stuff, while still having one guy bottle all their bombers! Lol!
Don't believe me? Check out their Deep Woods Series. Holy hell is it amazing!
The nice thing about all this is that I fall over Revolution products when I go into a liquor store. It's everywhere, and I'm grateful! The world is missing out while they pine over Pliny... or Heady, which is not as good as Pliny.
To top it all off, Founder's is 10x's better than Bell's. That's right. I said it.
In terms of the scarcity/low total production of beer (and not just limited releases) Ale Apothecary near Bend, Oregon fits the bill. Great beers, typically $30ish for a 750ml bottle made by one person, all barrel aged. All great beers.
I felt this way about heady topper. It was a great beer, greatest? It didn't blow me away but did it really make me pine for it.
Invertalon
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I have had the pleasure of enjoying Heady 8 different times from various batches and freshness levels... Since they don't date the cans, it really is a gamble on how old the beer is (although you would expect fresh). Some of those cans were easily some of the best DIPA I have had... My last one I legit drain poured half of it because me and my girlfriend just found it "meh" and wanted to move onto other, better beers and not waste the calories... I assume it was quite old based on how different it tasted.
I definitely think that's a factor for hoppy beers. The scarcity ensures that it's drunk fresh, bursting with flavor.
Aristotelian
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That's the thing...the major companies have figured out they can mass produce good beers. Like Two Buck Chuck in the wine industry, if it's just about taste, you can get really good beers for $10 a six pack at a decent grocery store.
True microbreweries have to sell more than taste. Uniqueness, freshness, seasonality, once-in-a-lifetime small batches. Those are the only things worth paying a premium.
BlkWater_brewer
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Yet you're talking up HF??
Why yes I am. They do have some excellent beers and at least once you get to HF you will end up with something to show for it. As opposed to an over hyped and over rated beer of questionable taste. IMO
moreb33rplz
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Why don't these breweries sell more beer? If you sell out the day you release, every day, for a few years, one would think they could afford some new digs.
Oh and my .02 is that heady, HF, trillium et al really are that much better. thats what beer should be
Oh and my .02 is that heady, HF, trillium et al really are that much better. thats what beer should be
bobeer
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I think, given the market atm, if you brew something good that everyone likes, and can replicate it from batch to batch, you will make as much as you can make off of small batch beer.
I don't play games with beer either and I like the way you put that, BlkWater. My buddy lives in NorCal and he mailed me some Pliny, Blind Pig, and a couple sours. They were good beers but I wouldn't wait in line for it. I'd still like to try Younger but I'd rather spend that time brewing than waiting in line!
Aristotelian
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Maybe they are happy with the money they are making and don't need or want to grow if it means changing their product? Maybe the value of their brand is worth more than they could make by increasing their volume?
EcuPirate07
Beer is a food group
The ol supply and demand trick from marketing 101. If I have a widget that is just as good as other widgets but I limit production and make it seem superior to others wether it's by others spreading the word or my own company slapping the prestige label on it by pricing it higher, people will throw money at it left and right. That has always fascinated me.
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Some are, some don't care. Tree House is building a new brewery. Lawson's is building a new brewery. The Alchemist is building a new brewery. But Kimmich put it best in a talk a couple years ago when he said something along the lines of "if you enjoy what you're doing, and you don't have to worry about your next paycheck, why expand to the point that it ceases to be fun?"
While that is a real and interesting phenomena, that's not 100% what's going on here. The beers are good (at least the new england hype train beers). I was in Waterbury on Saturday with some friends. One guy, who's only been in the country a couple years, and isn't really a beer fanatic got heady topper based on recommendation. He loved it, not because of the hype, because it was good. he admitted he dislikes IPAs, but loved that beer. Sure the limited availability is propelling the hype train, but it's backed by the beer being good.
EcuPirate07
Beer is a food group
I understand what you are saying, my point still holds true though. While yes those are great beers, there are definitely other breweries that have just as good beers but don't get as much hype. My example is wicked weeds pernicious IPA, no one really talks about it but I hold that IPA up against most others (and I've had heady). There have been many people who have done blind taste test and picked the non heady brew many times, couple on here that I have seen. My point is there may be 2 oranges picked from the same tree but one of those oranges is mass marketed as being limited, so person A will pay more for that orange just because it was marketed that way. But in the end both those oranges are great oranges. That's all I was trying to say.
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