Help with Hops

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RICLARK

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Im brewing two batches on saturday Red Lager and I was thinking a Imperial Hefe.

For the Imperial Hefe Im using 10#Wheat Malt and 5# 2 Row but I need some input on some hops to use. I cannot get Tettnang or Hallertaur or Cascade So any others?
 
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RICLARK

RICLARK

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McKBrew said:
Thank you I bookmarked that link...So this is what Im gonna do.

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
10.00 lb Wheat Malt, Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 66.67 %
5.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 33.33 %
1.00 oz Liberty [4.30 %] (60 min) Hops 11.6 IBU
1.00 oz Liberty [4.30 %] (20 min) Hops 7.0 IBU
1.00 oz Liberty [4.30 %] (5 min) Hops 2.3 IBU
1 Pkgs Hefeweizen Ale (White Labs #WLP300) Yeast-Wheat
 

RoaringBrewer

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Looks tasty and should be good brewed as is, but...

Couple thinking points:

Grist: The 66% wheat, 33% barley should be fine (definition of a weizen I believe is > 50% wheat obviously), but I think normally its more a 60/40 or even 55/45 split? I think the style guidelines for normal hefe say you should max around at 70% wheat. So you are near the upper-end of the range...

Hops: IBU range for a normal hefe is 8-16 and is half the strength of your imperial which should end up at 1.095 OG or higher? I see you're about double the minimum side of this calculation, so you are on the low end of IBU for Imperial, but it should be fine. More concerning is 2oz. of later addition hops which are going to play with aroma. Again, I'm no style nazi - i mean heck there isnt even a sanctioned imperial hefe category I don't think - but just something to mull over.

Yeast: Lastly, and I think the biggest concern is, if you get 75% mash efficiency you are looking at a 9-10% ABV beer. I don't know if normal hefe yeast is going to get you there. It may poop out. You could start with the hefe yeast and finish with Safale S-33 which is supposed to be a belgian strain that is tolerant to alcohol if I recall? Even the S-33 says, "works great in beers up to 7.5%, but can ferment to 11.5%..." so its less than ideal, but should work. Not sure how people finish their imperial beers. Not sure what the abbey/trappist strains would do if you finished with them but they are definitely alcohol tolerant...

Hope this turns out well for you! Definitely keep us updated...
 

homebrewer_99

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Well, I am a Hefe Weizen Nazi...:D...since 1975!! :ban:

I make a lot of Weizens. I also use DME. Your 15 lbs of grain equates to 9 lbs of DME.

For my batches I normally use 6 lbs of DME and 3% AA for a 1 hr boil. Keeping with that simple math I would recommend using 4.5% AAs for 60 mins. This would keep the flavor on the sweet side. Your 4.3% would be a little on the lighter side of my 4.5 AAs so you would need to add a bit more.

And HWs usually don't use any other hops than bittering so any additional hops woulld not be necessary.

My only real concern would be that most HWs are supposed to be spritzy and have a light-medium body. I'm not sure I would want to drink a heavy Weizen...a dunkelweizen on the other hand is another matter.;)

Good luck.
 

ohiobrewtus

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RoaringBrewer said:
Yeast: Lastly, and I think the biggest concern is, if you get 75% mash efficiency you are looking at a 9-10% ABV beer. I don't know if normal hefe yeast is going to get you there. It may poop out.
I used WLP300 on an Imperial Hefe last summer and it took me from 1.094 to 1.020 with nothing more than my normal starter.
 
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RICLARK

RICLARK

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RoaringBrewer said:
Looks tasty and should be good brewed as is, but...

Couple thinking points:

Grist: The 66% wheat, 33% barley should be fine (definition of a weizen I believe is > 50% wheat obviously), but I think normally its more a 60/40 or even 55/45 split? I think the style guidelines for normal hefe say you should max around at 70% wheat. So you are near the upper-end of the range...

Hops: IBU range for a normal hefe is 8-16 and is half the strength of your imperial which should end up at 1.095 OG or higher? I see you're about double the minimum side of this calculation, so you are on the low end of IBU for Imperial, but it should be fine. More concerning is 2oz. of later addition hops which are going to play with aroma. Again, I'm no style nazi - i mean heck there isnt even a sanctioned imperial hefe category I don't think - but just something to mull over.

Yeast: Lastly, and I think the biggest concern is, if you get 75% mash efficiency you are looking at a 9-10% ABV beer. I don't know if normal hefe yeast is going to get you there. It may poop out. You could start with the hefe yeast and finish with Safale S-33 which is supposed to be a belgian strain that is tolerant to alcohol if I recall? Even the S-33 says, "works great in beers up to 7.5%, but can ferment to 11.5%..." so its less than ideal, but should work. Not sure how people finish their imperial beers. Not sure what the abbey/trappist strains would do if you finished with them but they are definitely alcohol tolerant...

Hope this turns out well for you! Definitely keep us updated...
Thanks for your input, right now beerSmith has me setting at 1.077 Sg with 75% Eff. and 1.016 final Gravity 7.64 Abv. Which is right about where I wanted 7.5ish I never get 75% eff so im sure I will lose some. I also Chose american Hefe as my style and the Guidelines say Ibu 10.0-30.0 and right now im at 21.0 So I think I might add another addition to get it up there for how big it is like you said.
 
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RICLARK

RICLARK

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homebrewer_99 said:
Well, I am a Hefe Weizen Nazi...:D...since 1975!! :ban:

I make a lot of Weizens. I also use DME. Your 15 lbs of grain equates to 9 lbs of DME.

For my batches I normally use 6 lbs of DME and 3% AA for a 1 hr boil. Keeping with that simple math I would recommend using 4.5% AAs for 60 mins. This would keep the flavor on the sweet side. Your 4.3% would be a little on the lighter side of my 4.5 AAs so you would need to add a bit more.

And HWs usually don't use any other hops than bittering so any additional hops woulld not be necessary.

My only real concern would be that most HWs are supposed to be spritzy and have a light-medium body. I'm not sure I would want to drink a heavy Weizen...a dunkelweizen on the other hand is another matter.;)

Good luck.
I tried an imperial Hefe at the BeerFest last weekend and Im trying to make my own, There's was not heavy at all, it was medium with a nice clove flavor and had a very pronounced Saaz aroma.
 

RoaringBrewer

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RICLARK said:
Thanks for your input, right now beerSmith has me setting at 1.077 Sg with 75% Eff. and 1.016 final Gravity 7.64 Abv. Which is right about where I wanted 7.5ish I never get 75% eff so im sure I will lose some. I also Chose american Hefe as my style and the Guidelines say Ibu 10.0-30.0 and right now im at 21.0 So I think I might add another addition to get it up there for how big it is like you said.
You are right, I actually mis-estimated your OG. I just plugged a tripel recipe into my beersmith with 15lb grain and got 1.097 OG...

I forgot the 2lb+ of Candi sugar in my recipe taking my OG way up... :drunk:
 

RoaringBrewer

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RICLARK said:
What you mentioned about the hop schedule, should I ax the 20 and 5 additions?
If you axe the 20 and 5 hop additions, which I don't think is an unreasonable thing to do, I'd personally up the 60 minute addition then... I just don't think 11IBU is going to cut it for this big of a beer...

What would 1.5oz of Liberty do for you for 60?
 
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RoaringBrewer said:
If you axe the 20 and 5 hop additions, which I don't think is an unreasonable thing to do, I'd personally up the 60 minute addition then... I just don't think 11IBU is going to cut it for this big of a beer...

What would 1.5oz of Liberty do for you for 60?
I changed it to this.....1.5 oz Liberty 60
1.0 Oz Liberty at 15 23.2 IBU's
 

homebrewer_99

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Yes, in my own way I was saying to up the 60 min hops a bit to at least 4.5 AAs and not use the 20 and 5 hops. :D

The 4.5 AAs will still leave your brew on the sweet side like a normal (sweet) HW.

If you are looking at making it on the bitter side then I'd up that to 5 or 6. It is your brew.

I'm just relating it to a normal HW. ;)
 
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RICLARK

RICLARK

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homebrewer_99 said:
Yes, in my own way I was saying to up the 60 min hops a bit to at least 4.5 AAs and not use the 20 and 5 hops. :D

The 4.5 AAs will still leave your brew on the sweet side like a normal (sweet) HW.

If you are looking at making it on the bitter side then I'd up that to 5 or 6. It is your brew.

I'm just relating it to a normal HW. ;)
Thanks, You gotta put that **** it Layman's Terms. :D I failed Reading Comprehension twice. Thanks I want it on the sweeter side so im gonna use the bigger 60 min addition.
 

homebrewer_99

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Just in case you were bad at math also: Your hops are 4.3 AAs and you would want 4.5 to 5 AAs.

4.3 / 4.5 = 1.05 oz for the low side
4.3 / 5 = 1.16 oz for the high side.

That's a relative range of 1.00 to 1.2 oz. at 60 mins.

I'd use 1.15 to 1.2.

I don't use brewing software so anyone who does is free to comment on my calculations...;)
 
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Alright I have another question on this brew. In my Mash Beersmith tells me to strike with 4 3/4 gallon water, so with grain absorption my first batch sparge should be at 2 gallons then my second batch sparge at 1.5 gallons? This does not seem like much water.
 

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RICLARK said:
Alright I have another question on this brew. In my Mash Beersmith tells me to strike with 4 3/4 gallon water, so with grain absorption my first batch sparge should be at 2 gallons then my second batch sparge at 1.5 gallons? This does not seem like much water.
Well, the 4 3/4 sure sounds right - thats about 1.25qt per lb. You could go up to 1.5 if you like, but I always do 1.25qt/lb and get 80% efficiency.

I'm less sure about sparge volumes, but I think you might get enough water if you follow that routine... There isn't near as much absorbtion after the initial strike.

7 3/4 gallon total, reduced by some absorbtion of 15lb. grain... sounds about right?

I have never made an AG beer that big, so I'm not totally sure. Normally my sparge volumes are equal to or sometimes even more than my initial strike b/c since I've gone AG I've only been making beers with 8-10lb. grain.

I'd make sure you have an extra gallon of sparge water ready if that doesn't seem like its enough after the runnings, but I think you'll be OK?
 
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RoaringBrewer said:
Well, the 4 3/4 sure sounds right - thats about 1.25qt per lb. You could go up to 1.5 if you like, but I always do 1.25qt/lb and get 80% efficiency.

I'm less sure about sparge volumes, but I think you might get enough water if you follow that routine... There isn't near as much absorbtion after the initial strike.

7 3/4 gallon total, reduced by some absorbtion of 15lb. grain... sounds about right?

I have never made an AG beer that big, so I'm not totally sure. Normally my sparge volumes are equal to or sometimes even more than my initial strike b/c since I've gone AG I've only been making beers with 8-10lb. grain.

I'd make sure you have an extra gallon of sparge water ready if that doesn't seem like its enough after the runnings, but I think you'll be OK?
Thanks for the reply I think I am going keep the strike the same but use two sparges of 2 gallons mash out after the first sits for 20-30 mins.
 
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