Heady Topper- Can you clone it?

[Mjpetrag]

Just brewed my take on heady topper saturday.

6 gal batch
100% RO
10 g gypsum
10 g epsom salt
5.5 g calcium chloride
16 lb pearl
8 oz dextrose
Mashed at 149 F
1 oz CTZ 60 min
Whirlpool - 20 min at 185
2 oz chinook
2 oz Amarillo
1 oz CTZ
2 oz Centenniel
2 oz simcoe
A04 barbarian fermenting at 67 F

I overshot the grain and ended up with 1.080 OG

Plan to Dry hop with 4 oz simcoe after primary is complete, then again with 2 oz simcoe

 

[day_trippr]

Sorry, couldn't resist

 

[sweetcell]

Just brewed my take on heady topper saturday.

6 gal batch
100% RO
10 g gypsum
10 g epsom salt
5.5 g calcium chloride

this might be a tangent, but: i'm curious about your water additions. have you calculated those salt additions? what sort of a resulting water profile do you arrive at? off the cuff, they seem on the really high end to me, and interesting that you have more gypsum than calcium chloride (not typical for hazies)

then again i'm too lazy to break out a water calculator and plug those numbers in so take my inquiry with a pinch of CaCl...

 

[Mjpetrag]

250

this might be a tangent, but: i'm curious about your water additions. have you calculated those salt additions? what sort of a resulting water profile do you arrive at? off the cuff, they seem on the really high end to me, and interesting that you have more gypsum than calcium chloride (not typical for hazies)

then again i'm too lazy to break out a water calculator and plug those numbers in so take my inquiry with a pinch of CaCl...

yes, 250 ppm SO4, 75 Cl. Just tasted the gravity sample at around 1.024 and it definitely has the heady “bite” as soon as you drink it. Very distinct, think it’s going to be a close recipe. I remember reading earlier in this thread that the SO4 was in the 300+ range from the alchemist water profile. I agree though, with hazies my normal water is 8 g CaCl, 5 g gypsum. Heady is a whole different story

 

[Northern_Brewer]

250

yes, 250 ppm SO4, 75 Cl... I remember reading earlier in this thread that the SO4 was in the 300+ range from the alchemist water profile. I agree though, with hazies my normal water is 8 g CaCl, 5 g gypsum. Heady is a whole different story

It's just a very standard British water profile, see eg here. Remember the influence of British brewing on the US scene in the late 20th century, the origin story of Heady is tied up with Britain what with the yeast and everything.

 

[Mjpetrag]

Trying to find a good consensus on dry hops used. From reading most of the pages here it sounds like only simcoe, but also sounds like could be more. Any ideas?

 

[jerrylotto]

The recipe I usually follow combines Columbus Crystal Centennial Chinook Citra Simcoe and Mosaic in different ratios for different stages. You can find it online at Jasper's (boomchugalug) searching for Heady Popper. The Mosaic is my own addition to the dry hop.

 

[Mjpetrag]

The recipe I usually follow combines Columbus Crystal Centennial Chinook Citra Simcoe and Mosaic in different ratios for different stages. You can find it online at Jasper's (boomchugalug) searching for Heady Popper. The Mosaic is my own addition to the dry hop.

Thanks - I’ll give it a try

 

[Dgallo]

To be honest, most of the clones commercially available are pretty close. Apollo, Columbus, centennial, Simcoe, Amarillo are most likely the hops. Pearl malt should be utilized as the base and the water profile should lean more west coast than NEIPA. As long as you find a kit starting there, you should be good. You can fine tune it from there.

I still like heady but it has certainly become what I consider a run of the Mill ipas.

 

[malhal]

Just returned from a tour of the Alchemist brewery in Stowe on 7th July 2023.

Heady on hand pull (assume that means cask) had little to no aroma at all and was very dank and bitter and had some maltiness while still bright yellow. First impression was it is very close to Pliny in taste but lighter yellow in colour.
Focal Banger in can was bright and citrusy like a modern IPA but with a very slight aroma. Very similar to Vocation Life & Death.
Rapture was fruity and creamy like a modern hazy IPA but with a slight aroma (the most of the 3 but still nowhere near the likes of Verdant). The head was foaming out of the glass so I assume it has a heavy dose of carapils.

The big surprise was such little aromas, I think their technique of keg hop recirc may not be optimal. It would be interesting to know how they pump the wort through the keg and for how long.

Rapture was my favourite until the next day when I tried a can of Heady (06-19-23) and realised it is the most drinkable and is the one you want to return to. It's really bitter with a complex flavour but something about it makes you keep wanting to drink more. Perhaps it leaves you feeling thirsty wanting in need of refreshment or need to figure out the complex hop taste. Neither Focal or Rapture have this feature and both are slower to drink and one can would be enough, particularly with Rapture.

On the tour in the malt room I saw bags of Bestmalz BEST Pilsen Malt (maybe 10 bags) and Thomas Fawcett Pearl Malt (maybe 30 bags) lined up ready for a brew (although I don't know which beer). Didn't see any wheat, oats or carapils. In the cold room I saw about 18 boxes each of Haas 2022 Mosaic labeled "(Fruity)" and Mosaic labeled "DANK". And 1 box of Yakima Chief Simcoe. There was a recent batch of Heady cans marked HT 7/6 which I assume means canned on 6th July 2023, the day before my tour (I should have asked for a 4 pack of that!).

 

[kingmatt]

In the cold room I saw about 18 boxes each of Haas 2022 Mosaic labeled "(Fruity)" and Mosaic labeled "DANK". And 1 box of Yakima Chief Simcoe.

Oh, to be able to hand select...

 

[DrGMG]

Just returned from a tour of the Alchemist brewery in Stowe.

Heady on hand pull (assume that means cask) had little to no aroma at all and was very dank and bitter and had some maltiness while still bright yellow. First impression was it is very close to Pliny in taste but lighter yellow in colour.
Focal Banger in can was bright and citrusy like a modern IPA but with a very slight aroma. Very similar to Vocation Life & Death.
Rapture was fruity and creamy like a modern hazy IPA but with a slight aroma (the most of the 3 but still nowhere near the likes of Verdant). The head was foaming out of the glass so I assume it has a heavy dose of carapils.

The big surprise was such little aromas, I think their technique of keg hop recirc may not be optimal. It would be interesting to know how they pump the wort through the keg and for how long.

Rapture was my favourite until the next day when I tried a can of Heady and realised it is the most drinkable and is the one you want to return to. It's really bitter with a complex flavour but something about it makes you keep wanting to drink more. Perhaps it leaves you feeling thirsty wanting in need of refreshment or need to figure out the complex hop taste. Neither Focal or Rapture have this feature and both are slower to drink and one can would be enough, particularly with Rapture.

On the tour in the malt room I saw bags of BEST Pilsen Malt (maybe 10 bags) and Thomas Fawcett Pearl Malt (maybe 30 bags) lined up ready for a brew (although I don't know which beer). Didn't see any wheat, oats or carapils. In the cold room I saw about 18 boxes each of Haas 2022 Mosaic labeled "(Fruity)" and Mosaic labeled "DANK". And 1 box of Yakima Chief Simcoe.

View attachment 825144View attachment 825145View attachment 825146View attachment 825147View attachment 825148

I just got the last batch of the 3 you mentioned. I usually get Focal and Heady every 3-4 months from a friend. This last batch (first week of July) is very different from previous ones. A lot more fruit forward, with less dank. I do get plenty of aroma on all 3 though.

He prob mixes pils with pearl malt.

 

[sweetcell]

There was a recent batch of Heady cans marked HT 7/6 which I assume means canned on 6th July 2023, the day before my tour (I should have asked for a 4 pack of that!).

incorrect.

you should have asked for a case.

 

[Clyde McCoy]

The big surprise was such little aromas, I think their technique of keg hop recirc may not be optimal. It would be interesting to know how they pump the wort through the keg and for how long.

I've noticed this as well (although fairly pungent if you just smell out of the can). Pretty sure they dry hop on the colder side after crashing the beer. I've done ~30 batches dry hopping cold (~38-45F). In my experience, noticeably less aroma than dry hopping at warmer temperatures (55-68F).

 

[malhal]

Did you shorten the contact time along with the lower temp? I think that is the secret to prevent the oils being reabsorbed into the hops.

 

[Clyde McCoy]

Did you shorten the contact time along with the lower temp? I think that is the secret to prevent the oils being reabsorbed into the hops.

John said they usually do 4-5 days. I’ve done 2-5 days, can’t say I’ve noticed too much of a difference

 

[malhal]

I'm doing 1 day cold and the aroma is unreal

I just noticed in the photo there is 1 sack showing the wheat part of Country Malt's logo in the bottom left, wonder what's in that? The all caps lettering is USE NO HOOKS.

close up below:

 

[couchsending]

Alchemist dry hopping levels are rather low.. actually really low compared to most modern IPA brewers. Somewhere around 1#/bbl. Usually at 45*. I do believe they recirc through Grundys with bagged hops in them but I’ve never actually had that confirmed.

They don’t use any wheat or oats in hoppy beer. Doubt they use much Carapils or Dextrin malt. It’s usually just a Fawcett base malt and some English light Caramalt.

 

[jerrylotto]

There's a recipe kicking around the internet called Heady Popper which has an amazingly complex hop profile. I've brewed it several times and like the result but it doesn't taste like Heady Topper to me.

 

[secretlevel]

My take on Heady came out awesome!

65% 2-row
30% Golden Promise
5% Sugar

40 IBU Hop Shot @ 60 min
10 IBU CTZ @ 60 min
2oz Amarillo @ 5 min

Whirlpool
2oz Amarillo
2oz Simcoe
2oz Strata

DH (for 4 gal)
6oz YVH Simcoe
2oz Roy Farms Strata

Yeast: @bootlegbiology Classic New England at 73F

OG: 1.069
FG: 1.012

SO4:Cl - 210:90

Overall, very happy with the result, the clone is awesome and I can't stop drinking it. Beers like this remind me of why I got into brewing. My clone has that awesome Simcoe juiciness, but it fails to meet the bitterness mark. I ought to double my IBUs and see where we stand. A little more dryness can't hurt either, I'd love to see what a few more points of attenuation would do to this beer.
- Yes, I know they don't use Strata, but I feel like it added a nice level of complexity as YVH Simcoe is never going to be as good as what The Alchemist select
- My color is a bit darker, I'll probably tone down the GP next time. Doesn't taste oxidized and closed transfer process was seamless.

Thanks for keeping this thread up, gang! I might try to brew something like this with Mosaic soon and see how it is.

 

[malhal]

Sounds great! Looks slightly clearer maybe boil length could be reduced to keep some longer protein chains to bind with the whirlpool hop oils? I'd be interested to know your whirlpool temp/time and dry hop temp/time too ;-)

 

[hopfenstopfen]

My take on Heady came out awesome!

65% 2-row
30% Golden Promise
5% Sugar

40 IBU Hop Shot @ 60 min
10 IBU CTZ @ 60 min
2oz Amarillo @ 5 min

Whirlpool
2oz Amarillo
2oz Simcoe
2oz Strata

DH (for 4 gal)
6oz YVH Simcoe
2oz Roy Farms Strata

Yeast: @bootlegbiology Classic New England at 73F

OG: 1.069
FG: 1.012

SO4:Cl - 210:90

Overall, very happy with the result, the clone is awesome and I can't stop drinking it. Beers like this remind me of why I got into brewing. My clone has that awesome Simcoe juiciness, but it fails to meet the bitterness mark. I ought to double my IBUs and see where we stand. A little more dryness can't hurt either, I'd love to see what a few more points of attenuation would do to this beer.
- Yes, I know they don't use Strata, but I feel like it added a nice level of complexity as YVH Simcoe is never going to be as good as what The Alchemist select
- My color is a bit darker, I'll probably tone down the GP next time. Doesn't taste oxidized and closed transfer process was seamless.

Thanks for keeping this thread up, gang! I might try to brew something like this with Mosaic soon and see how it is.

Is a video on the way? Thoughts on Bootleg’s Conan strain?

 

[secretlevel]

Sounds great! Looks slightly clearer maybe boil length could be reduced to keep some longer protein chains to bind with the whirlpool hop oils? I'd be interested to know your whirlpool temp/time and dry hop temp/time too ;-)

Thanks! I honestly haven't paid attention to boil times vs haze, but I think it can be improved with a colder DH for sure. I DH'ed at the tail end of ferm, 70F or so. WP was 170F for about 30 min. DH'ing at 40's or 50F should also be in line with what they do at The Alchemist, I was just short for time.

Is a video on the way? Thoughts on Bootleg’s Conan strain?

Oh man, I wish a video was on the way haha. Just had a baby so I'm surprised I got to brew this at all...
Also, heckin' love that Conan strain and everything that I've had made with it! So juicy and peachy... I can't wait to brew with it again. A thicc hazy also in the books for it.

 

[YankeeBrewer09]

Trying to find a good consensus on dry hops used. From reading most of the pages here it sounds like only simcoe, but also sounds like could be more. Any ideas?

I made this one a couple months ago. It was the best of all the heady clones out there
Heady Popper https://boomchugalug.com/products/h...t-beer-recipe-kit?_pos=1&_sid=21c30cf5a&_ss=r
I just used the dried lallemand yeast. Came out perfect!

 

[sweetcell]

I made this one a couple months ago. It was the best of all the heady clones out there
Heady Popper https://boomchugalug.com/products/h...t-beer-recipe-kit?_pos=1&_sid=21c30cf5a&_ss=r
I just used the dried lallemand yeast. Came out perfect!

what is the hopping & dry-hopping schedule of this kit?

 

[jerrylotto]

what is the hopping & dry-hopping schedule of this kit?

There is a bittering hops step, two sets of Whirlpool hops 8 minutes apart and two stages of dry hopping at 7 and 14 days.

 

[YankeeBrewer09]

I made this one a couple months ago. It was the best of all the heady clones out there
Heady Popper https://boomchugalug.com/products/h...t-beer-recipe-kit?_pos=1&_sid=21c30cf5a&_ss=r
I just used the dried lallemand yeast. Came out perfect!

I used the Lalbrew New England

 

[DrGMG]

My second attempt at Heady. My sealed bag of Amarillo smelled like cheese, subbed it for Sequoia. Used Conan. This is after 1 week in the keg, pretty happy with it.

 

[samandbekah]

Looks nice! When you say you used Conan, did you use a commercialized strain of it or spin up a starter with some Conan dregs off a fresh can of heady?

 

[Dgallo]

Looks nice! When you say you used Conan, did you use a commercialized strain of it or spin up a starter with some Conan dregs off a fresh can of heady?

Imperial has a great Conan strain. A04 barbarian

 

[DrGMG]

Looks nice! When you say you used Conan, did you use a commercialized strain of it or spin up a starter with some Conan dregs off a fresh can of heady?

I used Vermont Ale yeast from Yeast Bay. White Labs sells it now.

 

[Clyde McCoy]

Looks nice! When you say you used Conan, did you use a commercialized strain of it or spin up a starter with some Conan dregs off a fresh can of heady?

Brewed yesterday with Omega's ALDC-producing version of Conan (OYL-436). Typically I've used isolates grown from cans of Heady or Focal. Will see how it compares. Start at 69F and raise to 72F, increasing 1F per day.

 

[DrGMG]

Brewed yesterday with Omega's ALDC-producing version of Conan (OYL-436). Typically I've used isolates grown from cans of Heady or Focal. Will see how it compares. Start at 69F and raise to 72F, increasing 1F per day.

I've done the dreg yeast to make Focal Banger before, worked well.

 

[Shenanigans]

I'm going to do a version sometime this winter and I'm going to try the dry East Coast 01 Conan from Gozdawa.

https://www.gozdawa.biz/de_DE/p/Gozdawa-Bierhefe-U.S.-East-Coast-01-Conan-10g-USEC01/280

Gozdawa are cheap and can be a bit hit a miss but I heard good things about their version of Conan on a German homebrew forum.