Graff (Malty, slightly hopped cider)

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Obi

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Just finished up and got this into my carboy...but I'm wondering about the hop flavor. I tasted my hydro sample out of curiosity and just tasted pure sweet apple. Do the hops start to show themselves when the gravity drops a bit? Or did I somehow screw this up?

Followed the recipe on the front page but substituted 1lb light DME for 1lb wheat DME since I couldn't find the torrified.
 

Absolut_Ninja

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I have previously read most the posts before, but have a q I did not see. I followed OP almost to a T, using 3056 yeast instead. I have made this before using 1.65# DME and 3.75 gal AJ, and had an OG of 1.053.

My current batch had 4 gal AJ and 2# DME, 1 light 1 amber. I wrote the OG down somewhere weird and cannot find it. Not knowing the specs on AJ, what would you guestimate the OG to be? Is it still around 53 or climbing to 60?
 

flyweed

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well I made this batch..and while it's ok...I probably won't keg another again. I followed original recipe to the letter..no additions of nothing. Kegged, aged and carbed.....still to sour and green applish for my tastes.

Going back to the simple Ckville recipes I think.
 

camatt2989

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did anyone else loose there krausen after about two days of fermenting mine had a good inch of it when i pitched... then it changed to a beautiful frosty white foam.. now its all gone
 

RugenBrau

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Has anyone ever tried this with the Wyeast Belgian Schelde? I have a packet left over and was wondering how that would turn out? Any opinions.
 

Heckle

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I have everything to make a batch of this except for hop/grain bags. I will pick them up tomorrow and start this in a few days. I am following the original recipe and will be using Amarillo hops.
 

brewdogskip

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Used 0.5 oz cascades, C. 120, and fermented with S-04. Just bottled today after two weeks in a carboy. I ended up drinking about half a gallon this evening with swmbo, it is so much better than apfelhooch. Can't wait for it to carb, time for another batch!
 

RugenBrau

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just made 5 gallons myself! I went with 120 and .5 oz of Cascade also. Pitched 2 packets of Notty and it is taking off after 6 hours. Juice was blend of Spy and Spy gold. OG was 1.058
 

klyph

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The malt sweetness is what makes it more palatable sooner. The hops just give it a little character. If you don't like the original because it's too dry/tart, up the amount of crystal malt to sweeten it a bit.
 

FordFan

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I need a quick hand guys and gals. I could only get the torrified wheat and 60L in 1lb packages from Northern Brewer. I have no way of weighing out for the correct amount. I don't not own one of those small scales or anything. Basically I was wandering if there was another way to measure for the correct amount. I am sure there is a way to weigh it out by volume and not weight. Thanks for help!!
 

Recluse

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Well the best way would be to get another container to store it in (you might want to do this anyway... I use big gallon Ziploc freezer bags). Transfer it to the Ziploc with a measuring cup (or 1/2 cup, whatever) Count the number of transfers and you can calculate the oz by weight/unit volume and go to town.

So, for example, if 1 lb (16 oz) of torrified wheat takes 4 cups to transfer, that is 4 oz/cup and you would use 1/4 cup for the 1 oz called for in the recipe. (THIS IS JUST AN EXAMPLE, I HAVE NO IDEA IF THIS IS THE ACTUAL WEIGHT/VOL RATIO)
 

FordFan

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Sweet this is what I used. Came up with 3.25 cups with the wheat which came to about 1/4 cup and 4.5 cups for the 60L which came out to 1/3 cup. Thanks for your help! SWMBO is going to love me for this one!
 

RugenBrau

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Wow...my graff has taken off like crazy. My ciders always have a pretty mild fermentation but this looks like it boiling away!
 
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Have got a 23 L carboy of this going with apple/pear fresh pressed cider as a base and can't wait to taste it. In the carboy 2 weeks today.
 

jar234psu

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I made this a week ago and unfortunately my LHBS was out of nottingham, so i subbed in some windsor. My fermenting chamber hovers around 68, and I'd say that this batch was slooow to start, compared to what I am used to. 3 days before any visible signs of fermentation, and it is currently bubbling away but not very vigorously.

I used 5 gallons of fresh pressed cider from a local orchard here in NC. There was 0.01% potassium sorbate, which i assume is responsible for the slower than normal fermentation. We made a cider last year from the same orchard, and had no trouble getting down to about 1.001, so i'm not too worried.

Just tasted a sample, and it is delicious. Very sweet, which I assume is because primary fermentation hasn't completed although i didn't take a hydro reading so I cant say for sure.

If the final product tastes half as good as the sample I just drank, I am going to be a happy camper. Just told SWMBO that i'll buy another 5 gallons of cider before the season ends, so that we can have some on hand for the spring. Cheers, brandon... I'm looking forward to tasting the final product!
 

klyph

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So after the old lady's comment about it tasting like vomit, I forced her to try some that had been kegged for a little over a month now. She begrudgingly admitted that it was delicious. I think it was just a hypersensitivity to the yeast still in suspension and the fact that she never wants to admit when I have achieved awesomeness.

Seriously, this stuff goes from good to amazing if you let it age for a while. Love how dry and balanced it is. The tartness fades over time.
 

TRainH2o

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Mine finished out at 1.03 using repitched yeast from my Centennial Blonde Ale.. It's a bit dryer than I was expecting. It has been cold crashing for the past two weeks. I'll carb it up an see how it is after carbonation.
 

jamesjensen1068

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Hey...just want to say that after initally questioning this lovely elixer....I truely love it. It does, like a lot of beers, etc. get better with age. I find myself grabbing one over my stout and cream ale lately...might be the time of year or the fact that I drank stout and cream ale alllllll summer long. If you are on the fence about brewing this...just do it!

Cheers
 

petergriffen

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So I used Lalvin #EC-1118 Champagne Wine Yeast, bubbled for the first day fast and then stopped after two days. It's been two weeks now. Dont want to open up and test, should I pitch another one or just wait a week-two and then check gravity?
 

RugenBrau

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Just took a reading on mine and tasted it. I have to admit it is better than apfelwine at this point . gravity is now 1.010 but I am afraid it is going to keep going and turn out too dry. I hope not
 

petergriffen

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okay I'm at 1.018. Think not much more is happening. Has been in there for 16 days. Think I should pitch the other packet of ec-1118 I have? I didn't make a starter last time, actually never have in my life.
 

Recluse

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okay I'm at 1.018. Think not much more is happening. Has been in there for 16 days. Think I should pitch the other packet of ec-1118 I have? I didn't make a starter last time, actually never have in my life.
I'm surprised. EC-1118 usually tears through everything. I do usually rehydrate it, though, following the directions on the packet. Not really a STARTER, per se.
 

pimento

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okay I'm at 1.018. Think not much more is happening. Has been in there for 16 days. Think I should pitch the other packet of ec-1118 I have? I didn't make a starter last time, actually never have in my life.
I may be off-base, but I recall reading somewhere that wine yeasts aren't as good at processing complex sugars as ale yeasts, so the ec-1118 may have given up sooner than nottingham would.

You could try repitching with an ale yeast, but I'm not sure how it would do competing with all that living ec-1118 in there.

Your best bet is to give it a gentle stir and warm it up a few degrees to see if that rouses the yeast.

Graff does seem to have a wide range of ending gravity, people have posted theirs ending up from 1.000 to 1.012.
 

chuckjaxfl

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I'm doing this again, this time w/ Crystal 120L, East Kent Goldings, and I've got it bubbling away with some Pacman at about 50 degrees F.

I played it a little smarter this time. I doubled up on the everything except the juice, so I had two gallons of the wort portion of the recipe. The first gallon went into mason jars and have been processed. The second gallon went into the fermenter with the apple juice.

Now, when I rack this batch off of the yeast, the next batch is, literally, ready to pour in.
 

wedge421

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Just had a pour of this for the first time. Really really interesting stuff. Anyone want to spare a bottle for a video review?
 

corbomite

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I have read most of this thread(not all because its 99 friggin pages) and there are different posts about adding non fermentable sugars and whatnot, but has anyone tried bottle priming with DME. Mine is at 1.008 and there is still a krausen chugging away so it will go lower(12 days in fermenter). I don't like splenda, stevia, or lactose, and I was thinking of bottle priming with light DME.

Any one got an opinion on this?

I probably could have used a white labs yeast(like 002) if I wanted it to finish higher but I like US-04. In any case, the hydrometer sample was pretty good(which is surprising this early) so this should be a great cider.
 

Recluse

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Bottle priming with DME will not add much sweetness because the yeast will eat up the sugars just like regular priming sugar. Might add a little maltiness, but that's it.
 

petergriffen

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I'm surprised. EC-1118 usually tears through everything. I do usually rehydrate it, though, following the directions on the packet. Not really a STARTER, per se.
Pitched the second one and it got bubbling a bit, hopefully enough to drop it down a few points

Has anybody racked a new batch in on top of the yeast cake from another batch of graff?
Same question, I'm about to even though I didnt have much luck with the EC-1118....could also be slow since it's 55 in here.
 

jar234psu

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I just took my final hydrometer reading and WOW!!! This is positively delicious. I opted for the Crystal 120, and used 0.35 oz of cascade. I used Windsor instead of notty, since the LHBS was out of it... and it ended up finishing a bit on the sweet side which is fine with me. I didnt take an OG reading, but my estimate is about 1.060, and it finished at 1.011.

The thing that (i think) makes it so damned good, is I used 4 gallons of fresh, locally pressed cider from the farmers market here in NC. I did not boil it, and just threw caution to the wind. It had a little K sorbate (0.01%) which slowed the fermentation down quite a bit, but really did not end up affecting the final product.

I am definitely going to pick up another 8-10 gallons before the season is over. Does anyone know how well this keeps? I'd love to serve it over the summer.
 

djinn88

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My search of this thread led me to no definitive answer.... I need some info on priming with dextrose or light DME, I would prefer to use my dextrose. Please let me know how much weight per gallon. I have about 4.5 gallons if you would like to do the math for me :)
 

Recluse

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I generally prime with 1 oz (by weight) dextrose per gallon of Brew. Using DME, approximately 2 oz (by weight) per gallon according to references I have seen. I have never used DME to prime personally.

Here is a handy priming calculator that you can use to determine your desired level of carbonation based on style etc.. calculates for Dextrose, Sucrose, DME

http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/priming.html
 

jabumbo

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just pitched the yeast for my batch. OG = 1.058

i couldn't get any of the torrified wheat, and i subconsciously stuck the entire pound of crystal 60L into the pot because that's the smallest size i could get at the brew shop.


very excited to compare this to the other 3 batches of cider i started today as well!
 

jameshig

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Hey, this is my first post, go easy on me please.

I found this recipe googling around for brewing ciders and it has just come out of the primary fermentation into bottles.

I tried it and it's actually got really good flavor, but it's not sweet at all. When I brew this again, which I will because I'm kind of a perfectionist, I am wondering what I should add to kick up the sweetness. I tried to read through the entire thread, but there are 100 pages.

Also, I didn't add any dextrose to the bottles for secondary fermentation. When I do my second batch, should I do this? What does this add exactly? I'm guessing it allows whatever yeast is left to continue to ferment drying out the beer and adding more carbonation? If this is the only thing it does, then I guess I don't need another addition as it's pretty dry as it is.

I am also getting a little bit of a sour note at the very finish- does anyone have any idea what could cause this?

I did not take a hydrometer reading before starting the fermentation process, but took it before we started bottling. It was at 1010- does this equate to the current alcohol content (I think 1.5%)?

I loved the idea of using hops and malt in the cider, this was a fantastic find.

Sorry for all the questions in one post and thank you.
 

Recluse

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Also, I didn't add any dextrose to the bottles for secondary fermentation. When I do my second batch, should I do this? What does this add exactly? I'm guessing it allows whatever yeast is left to continue to ferment drying out the beer and adding more carbonation? If this is the only thing it does, then I guess I don't need another addition as it's pretty dry as it is.
The Dextrose is for the purposes of carbonation. It will not dry things out appreciably as all the fermentable sugars have already been dealt with. The small amount of priming sugar is added to generate CO2 to carbonate the beverage. I guess you can drink it still, but I like my ciders bubbly and since this is sort of between a beer and a cider, I don't think it would taste too good flat.

I am also getting a little bit of a sour note at the very finish- does anyone have any idea what could cause this?
It will probably mellow with age. All ciders have this to some extent or other.

I did not take a hydrometer reading before starting the fermentation process, but took it before we started bottling. It was at 1010- does this equate to the current alcohol content (I think 1.5%)?
Without a starting gravity reading, this measurement is useless for predicting alcohol. GENERALLY following the recipe gives a starting gravity around 1.058-1.064 or thereabouts.. so your 1010 final gravity reading would equate to about

6.3-7 %ABV
 
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