Going all grain - equipment purchases

[lefty96]

I am looking to work towards expanding my gear to allow for all grain brewing. I've read volumes on the web and from Palmer and watched hours of youtube video but I am still hung up on a couple of spots and thought I might get some feedback here

1) Size

I brew 5 gallon batches and I'm the only person that really drinks any volume of the beer I brew. I have read that a 5 gallon tun would work most of the time for this. I don't want to over spend but I do worry what "most" won't cover. I don't ever see myself making barely wine or any heavy gravity beers but who knows.

2) Type

My original plan had been to just go w/ coolers for the tun and hlt, but then wondered how well that works for a 2 or 3 stage mash. Going to get kettles with valves is obviously a huge leap up the price grade, but is that ultimately what needs to be done?

I don't want to break the bank, but at the same time, I don't want nor need a closet full of retired gear so I'd love to hear people's experiences.

 

[Kent88]

Check this out, there is also a youtube video where he demonstrates using this as well: DonO's cheap and easy mash tun. The guy does a lot of his own youtube vids and appears in others, like some of the old BrewingTV vids and Chop & Brew, so I think most people assume he knows what he is doing and you'd have some decent references to look back on.

As far as 2 or 3 stage mashes, I would think any cooler with sufficient volume for your strongest beer to mash in at 1.75:1 water to grist ratio would be fine. Check out these calculators, they might be helpful. Use them to plan a fairly high gravity beer and see what kind of volume you'll want.

 

[feinbera]

1 – get 10-gallon kettles/coolers/whatever you decide to get. The five-gallon kit works "on paper," but, realistically, you'll find yourself sloshing grain/wort onto the floor even at moderate gravities, especially when you're first starting out and your efficiency isn't great and you're having to add extra ice/boiling water to hit your temps. That is, unless you want to end up like me, with ludicrously-oversized paperweights that look an awful lot like a five-gallon cooler and a six-gallon pot that never get brewed in anymore since I broke down and got 10-gallon versions two or three brews later...

2 – I get by with one kettle and one cooler. I heat my batch sparge water in the kettle during the sacc rest, and collect first runnings and the first sparge into a fermentor bucket (well, OK, I lied, I collect into the six-gallon pot I never boil in anymore – but you'll be smart and not buy this pot in the first place). My second batch sparge would be too much to fit in the bucket, but, hey, by the time I'm collecting it, the kettle is free, so I can dump the already-collected wort in there and get it heating while I do my second batch sparge. Not saying this is the One True Way To Brew, but I find it a very workable compromise between one-vessel BiaB and a full three-vessel setup.

 

[casualbrewer]

For me I just did my first all grain and used what I had on hand. I had large aluminum turkey fryer pot (about 11-12 gallons). I did a no sparge and used my total volume of water and grains at once. I used 8.5 gallons of water with 9.5 lbs of grain if that helps you and still had a couple inches of space in the pot. I mashed my grain and did my boil in the same pot. I did a BIAB though so it makes it a bit easier. I did use a 3 gallon pot and a metal basket so I could squeeze the grain over the small pot and dump it into the big pot to so I could get decent efficiency which I did (75%). If you do 5 gallon batches then a 10-15 gallon turkey fryer pot would work perfect for a BIAB all grain.

 

[Brian77095]

I was in the same boat. I finally decied on a 10g set up. It gives you more flexibility and if you don't drink that much find a brew partner. You make 10g and split it up.

 

[plan_ahea]

Have you considered going all-grain via BIAB? It's way cheaper since you only need 1 vessel (10 gallons for 5 gal. batches is a safe bet), it takes less time since you aren't sparging, at it makes the exact same beer as a 2- or 3-vessel system.

 

[lefty96]

Have you considered going all-grain via BIAB? It's way cheaper since you only need 1 vessel (10 gallons for 5 gal. batches is a safe bet), it takes less time since you aren't sparging, at it makes the exact same beer as a 2- or 3-vessel system.

I have considered this as I have a couple of large aluminium pots from a turkey cooker and a large gumbo pot. I think both are over 15g. I guess If I did that I would need to add a tap on one of them.

In my mind with what I have today - I have a 5g kettle I could use to heat strike/splarge water and the 2 large pots above, one of which would be a brew kettle. Whichever one I chose would prob need a ball valve added as dumping a full volume kettle of wort into a fermenter alone would probably be a huge mess - I guess I could siphon some off first?

 

[Foosier]

+1 to going BIAB. I have a very similar experience in that I am the primary consumer of the beers I brew. As such, 5gallon batches work for me. I made the switch to all-grain by going to BIAB using a 10 gallon aluminum pot with no ports. All you need is the 10 gal pot (cheap if AL) a bag and a burner. You can decide to add on later, but you may be surprised that you don't feel you need to. I have friends with keggles systems and cooler tun systems and they were all impressed with the simplicity of the BIAB process (Especially in time savings and clean up ease).

If you decide to get more equipment later it is easy to add a cooler tun to your process. BIAB just makes it easier to get into the all-grain game without the big up front investment.

 

[jtratcliff]

Whichever one I chose would prob need a ball valve added as dumping a full volume kettle of wort into a fermenter alone would probably be a huge mess - I guess I could siphon some off first?

I BIAB in a 10g aluminum tamale steamer with no valve. It's not a big deal to pour from the kettle straight to a fermentation bucket. I would do it outside, however, since there can be a little splashy spillage. Good aeration, though.

If you're trying to pour through a funnel into a standard narrow necked carboy, then that can be tricky.

 

[SatanPrinceOfDarkness]

I have considered this as I have a couple of large aluminium pots from a turkey cooker and a large gumbo pot. I think both are over 15g. I guess If I did that I would need to add a tap on one of them.

In my mind with what I have today - I have a 5g kettle I could use to heat strike/splarge water and the 2 large pots above, one of which would be a brew kettle. Whichever one I chose would prob need a ball valve added as dumping a full volume kettle of wort into a fermenter alone would probably be a huge mess - I guess I could siphon some off first?

You could siphon the whole thing if you wanted to. I've done it. It's certainly the safest thing to do when it's just you and a glass carboy. I have a funnel, but it's just a little scary pouring that big a pot by myself. You can improve aeration when siphoning by leaving the down end at the top of the carboy so it's splashing against the side the whole time.

 

[TexasWine]

I have considered this as I have a couple of large aluminium pots from a turkey cooker and a large gumbo pot. I think both are over 15g. I guess If I did that I would need to add a tap on one of them.

Already addressed, but BIAB is the way to go, and no you don't need to add a tap/valve. Siphoning works (make sure to get high temp hose) but I've also used a 2 quart plastic pitcher and just transferred it one scoop at a time. Once the level gets to a manageable level I just would just tip the kettle and pour it all in.

 

[lefty96]

Already addressed, but BIAB is the way to go, and no you don't need to add a tap/valve. Siphoning works (make sure to get high temp hose) but I've also used a 2 quart plastic pitcher and just transferred it one scoop at a time. Once the level gets to a manageable level I just would just tip the kettle and pour it all in.

On the whole, does biab lead to a cloudier beer? Not a huge concern but I'm curious. It seems like it would

 

[Kent88]

On the whole, does biab lead to a cloudier beer?

I've brewed several small batches BIAB-style, no issues with cloudiness unless I added flaked barley to it.

 

[TinyHands]

Already addressed, but BIAB is the way to go, and no you don't need to add a tap/valve. Siphoning works (make sure to get high temp hose) but I've also used a 2 quart plastic pitcher and just transferred it one scoop at a time. Once the level gets to a manageable level I just would just tip the kettle and pour it all in.

+1 on making sure you have a high-temp hose if you do that. Remind me I need to make a submission on the "Don't do that" thread later.

 

[lefty96]

I've brewed several small batches BIAB-style, no issues with cloudiness unless I added flaked barley to it.

So do you just do a full initial volume on the mash - like strike + lauder at once - I assume outside that there are no real changes to the recipe.

 

[Kent88]

@lefty96 from what I've read you can (maybe should?) just use the full volume of strike and sparge water, but I've actually been going with about a 1.6:1 water to grist ratio and I sparge. Probably not something you'd want to do if you're brewing more than a couple gallons, but a lot of my recent beers have been low gravity and I don't want to extract tannins. Also, maintaining temps even in thicker mashes is a pain at the amount I do, so I don't want it any thinner than it has to be. Plus, I want to hit ~73% efficiency.

For BIAB medium to high gravity beers you should be able to go ahead and add all the water you need up front. You just need a big kettle and to keep an eye on those temps. Also for the first couple BIAB brews one does, he or she should also plan on ~65% efficiency.

 

[TexasWine]

On the whole, does biab lead to a cloudier beer? Not a huge concern but I'm curious. It seems like it would

Nope. Sure doesn't.

 

[jtratcliff]

On the whole, does biab lead to a cloudier beer? Not a huge concern but I'm curious. It seems like it would

The wort *can* be cloudier, since the crush for BIAB can be finer and you don't get the benefit of set grain bed acting as filter. And it's pretty common practice to squeeze the bag. But in the end, the final beer itself can be just as clear.

 

[Kent88]

@jtratcliff people actually squeeze the bag? I thought that was a big no-no.

 

[jtratcliff]

Yup plenty of bag squeezers... Plenty of folks who just let gravity do the work too. It seems to be purely a matter of preference.

The pressures that you can realistically achieve by squeezing your bag (hey, now!) are nowhere near high enough for tannin extraction.

 

[Gavin C]

On the whole, does biab lead to a cloudier beer? Not a huge concern but I'm curious. It seems like it would

Not in my experience

I'm a proponent of BIAB

5.5 gallon batches in an 11 gallon pot

I've done alot of different styles and find the results to be to my liking. I do not want cloudy beer unless it is part of the style, a wheat or the like.


APA

ESB

My methods are below in my sig. Might get some ideas for what you do/don't want to buy.

 

[cannman]

Go 15/16 gal kettle

You're time invested in All Grain is worth too much to only make 5 gal batches. with a 15/16 gal kettle, you can make 10 gal batches BIAB split between two carboys.

 

[Brew_G]

Add another voice to the pro-BIAB crowd.

I made one partial extract batch, then moved to BIAB, and now I'm nine batches in. I have a 9-gallon stainless steel fryer pot without valves, and all I do is pour the wort (including trub) into my carboy via one of those massive funnels. I'm amazed at how well those funnels will stay in a carboy neck without any other support.

I understand that folks like to brew in the "traditional" manner with multi-vessel systems - and more power to them for going that route - but BIAB is incredibly simple and an inexpensive gateway into all-grain brewing.

 

[cannman]

Aso invest in in a 50,000 BTU burner. Most I've seen are 30,000 btu. The 50k will save you SOOOOOOOOO much time. It will boil 16 gal of water in NO TIME at all.

 

[Mirilis]

Ive tried all mannor of processes and systems from cooler mash tuns to fully automated propane, and now electric BIAB.. and the BIAB works best for me. They all made good beer, but my life is busy and I get less time to brew every year. The BIAB process helps me keep my kegerator full (4 taps usually with a couple kegs in reserve).

I saw one of the posts about worrying about tannin extraction. Thats not a function of bag squeezing but a function of high pH in your lautering water. Squeeze away! I usually get 70-75%.

I use a cheap 12g stainless pot to make 6 gallon batches (7-7.5 pre boil volume), and 5.5 into the fermenter.. 5 into the keg.


my spelling is jacked.. my newborn kept me up all night so i can barely function as a human being right now.