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SEndorf

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Been reading some interesting stuff about oxidation / C02 and closed transfers.

Thinking of retiring my two 6.5 Gallon Better Bottle fermenters and getting one Speidel 15 Gallon fermenter, primarily to develop closed transfer in my process.

The Speidel fermenter has a bottom spigot for gravity samples and transferring wort to keg.

But the confusing part is the large number of options for the ONE opening at the top. (airlock, grommet, thermowell, spigot valve, gas valve, etc.…)

So if the goal is no exposure to oxygen once the cooled wort is transferred to the fermenter, oxygenated, and pitched, WHY would you open the top at the end of fermentation, remove the airlock, and install a gas-in valve or spigot to push the finished wort with CO2? You’ve just put oxygen in your beer. How much is debatable, but you’ve exposed it nevertheless.

What I’m thinking is the combination thermowell and blow off tube for the top of the Speidel. At the end of fermentation, fold/kink the end of the blow off hose sitting in the sanitizer, attach a CO2 line with a simple barb, and push the beer out at 2 psi. That way, there is absolutely no oxygen exposure from fermentation to keg. You’ve not exposed your beer to ANY oxygen until you pour it in the glass.

What say you Speidel folks? How have you handled this? Does this seem like the right track?
 

MotoGP1000

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This is an old post but I just got my speidel and was fishing around, so i'll give it a shot.

my plan is to use the airlock for the primary fermenting process. Then pop the top and add my dry hops. Im hoping that there is enough residual fermenting going to give the beer a layer of C02 during the dry hopping process (3-4 days). When I do pop the top and replace the airlock with ball lock gas in valve, I should be doing this pretty quickly combine with Im ultimately pumping C02 into the top of the beer anwyays essentially pushing the oxygen out or at least out of contact with the beer.

That's how its working in my head. idk, in reality, that's what its doing..
 

beernutz

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I have a 60L Speidel and recently bought the Jaybird attachment (link below), which has a ball lock gas in and a pressure relief valve, for sealing the Speidel in order to do pressurized transfers . I was planning to do closed loop transfers using gas into kegs but my first attempt didn't work.
https://www.norcalbrewingsolutions....l-Lock-Gas-In-with-Pressure-Relief-Valve.html

Unfortunately the first time I tried it I could not get the Speidel pressurized enough to actually push beer up into a keg. This was a 10 gallon batch which fills about 2/3rds of the capacity of the Speidel so there's significant head space which may have been the culprit.

I first tried pushing beer into the liquid out valve of a purged keg with the keg top vented but that would not work so I switched to just having the transfer hose go straight into the keg's opening where it rested on the bottom and that was a no go as well. I finally gave up after about 10 minutes of unsuccessfully trying to get the pressure high enough to push out the liquid and switched to a gravity transfer.

The Speidel with the above attachment was air tight though as when I was doing the gravity transfer the siphon stopped and I finally realized it was because there was a vacuum in the container. When I loosened the top with the attachment insert the beer flowed again.
 
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SEndorf

SEndorf

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Some time ago I bought the Speidel and set up as described above.
Since there are no parts to switch out, it works very well with no oxygen exposure during transfer.
 

MotoGP1000

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I have a 60L Speidel and recently bought the Jaybird attachment (link below), which has a ball lock gas in and a pressure relief valve, for sealing the Speidel in order to do pressurized transfers . I was planning to do closed loop transfers using gas into kegs but my first attempt didn't work.
https://www.norcalbrewingsolutions....l-Lock-Gas-In-with-Pressure-Relief-Valve.html

Unfortunately the first time I tried it I could not get the Speidel pressurized enough to actually push beer up into a keg. This was a 10 gallon batch which fills about 2/3rds of the capacity of the Speidel so there's significant head space which may have been the culprit.

I first tried pushing beer into the liquid out valve of a purged keg with the keg top vented but that would not work so I switched to just having the transfer hose go straight into the keg's opening where it rested on the bottom and that was a no go as well. I finally gave up after about 10 minutes of unsuccessfully trying to get the pressure high enough to push out the liquid and switched to a gravity transfer.

The Speidel with the above attachment was air tight though as when I was doing the gravity transfer the siphon stopped and I finally realized it was because there was a vacuum in the container. When I loosened the top with the attachment insert the beer flowed again.


did you use the ball lock as a replacement to the airlock? or just switch them out when you were ready to transfer the beer to keg?

I surprised that gravity alone didn't allow the fermentor to keg closed transfer to get started. at least a little bit
 

beernutz

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did you use the ball lock as a replacement to the airlock? or just switch them out when you were ready to transfer the beer to keg?

I surprised that gravity alone didn't allow the fermentor to keg closed transfer to get started. at least a little bit
I used the airlock until I was ready to transfer then swapped out the top with the ball lock gas-in on it.

The Speidel and the keg I was attempting to transfer to were at the same level initially. When I couldn't get the gas to push the beer up to the top of the keg I raised the Speidel about 4 feet and did a gravity transfer.

I could have tried to use gas to transfer, but didn't, after I had raised the Speidel. Not having to raise the Speidel at all was one reason I bought the ball lock gas-in top.
 
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eric19312

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Here is what I do...
The blow off tube is on the right. I close that valve and hook up CO2 to the ball lock. Push beer out the port on the bottom to my kegs. It works. My issue is the 3/8 line I have running to the kegs is pretty small and even decent pressure on the Spiedel .... maybe 4 psi ... will take me at least an hour to transfer 15 gallons. But like I said it works...
upload_2018-10-31_13-42-20.png
 

MotoGP1000

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I used the airlock until I was ready to transfer then swapped out the top with the ball lock gas-in on it.

The Speidel and the keg I was attempting to transfer to were at the same level initially. When I couldn't get the gas to push the beer up to the top of the keg I raised the Speidel about 4 feet and did a gravity transfer.

I could have tried to use gas to transfer, but didn't, after I had raised the Speidel. Not having to raise the Speidel at all was one reason I bought the ball lock gas-in top.

ok I see. I planned on having them staggered anyways, but I can see the issue. Raising the speidel probably meant taking out the airlock right? so you could have still used the CO2 as a closed transfer system to make sure all that hit the beer was CO2 if im thinking about this correctly
 
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SEndorf

SEndorf

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Here's my no oxygen transfer system:
Keg Purge.JPG
keg purge
Counterpressure blowoff.JPG
counterpressure blowoff
Gas line adapter.JPG
gas line adapter
Gas to Spidel blowoff tube.JPG
gas to Speidel blowoff
Transfer to keg.JPG
transfer to keg
 
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SEndorf

SEndorf

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what is going on in the 2nd pic with the two mason jars?
Thanks..
It's a counterpressure blowoff. So when cold crashing, you don't get Star-San suck back.
Don't really need it with all that head space in the spiedel, but came in handy with my old big mouth bubblers.
 

ttuato

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I have the 8gal speidel.

I installed a weldless thermowell around the three gallon mark - that eliminated those optionS from Jaybird.

IF you don’t fill it completely and have enough headspace for the Krause then the blowoff tubes become unnecessary. All problems can be solved with ONE accessory - gas lock / PRV referenced above (get the 20lb spring upgrade-stock is 5lb which is not enough for natural carb and barely for transfer). Hook a line up that ends in starsan during early fermentation as a blowoff. Once you hit 75-80% attenuation, remove blowoff and allow pressure to build and get naturally carbonated beer (spund). When cold crash there will be no suck back to worry about because sealed. Can provide supplemental CO2 in top during transfer if needed.

Here is my setup - I do the closed loop corny oxygen elimination system as described on HBT.

Besides the lock/prv, Consider the pickup tube. Stock spigot works for me but I could a pickup useful for the ultra clear beer chasers



Reference above about not pressurizing good - get a new gasket. Made a world of difference for mine. I can get 26lbs in mine no problem (spund)
 

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