Fly sparge with a braid?

[bendavanza]

Ok so I just got a clone recipe (AHS) with mostly 2 row and a bit of crystal, and the instructions describe a fly sparge. I haven't done a Fly sparge before, but I would like to try it, and I have a gravity setup with ball valves.
My MLT is a 10 gallon round cooler with a braid loop. Would this be effective for fly sparge? And would I really want my sparge water to be 175˚?
With batch sparging I was using 190˚ water for sparging, which became 170˚ in the mash if I remember correctly.
brewing this sunday, any advice appreciated

 

[Denny]

The way you have your braid set up should work for a fly sparge. I'll be curious to hear your comparison of batch/fly.

 

[bendavanza]

doing more reading I'm thinking more about Bobby M's N.M.O.D.B.S. - No Mash Out Double Batch Sparge. Hmm...

 

[Bobby_M]

Fly would work fine if you can keep your input water up to temp for the whole time and keep your flow rate slow. You should drain at about 1 qt per minute so for a 6.5 gallon runoff, it should take about a half hour. I think most first time fly spargers run it off way too quickly.

 

[bendavanza]

This will be my first time using more than 1 kettle, and all gravity. I'm psyched. I have a 3 tier sculpture in the works but for now I am making use of the back porch. I will also be filtering (culligan RV filter and campden tablet) my water and using 5.2 for the first time. 3rd all grain. I spent most of the day scrubbing the kettles, calibrating the thermometers, marking the increments on the sight glass, etc. I also made an aerator out of some 1/2" and 5/16" tubing. Fly Sparge "sounds" like water boarding. But once I got the flow started it should be auto pilot. I guess I just wonder which would be more efficient, FLY or NMODBS? And which is easier. Less stirring with FLY, a few tweaks to the ball valve and adjusting the propane burner...
I'm also deciding wether or not to try out the 30x30 hopstopper. I use an immersion chiller. Just 2 oz of hops for this batch, and I can use 1/2 of it as leaf if needed.

 

[bendavanza]

Bobby:
in response to another thread about fly sparging "Has anyone tried this techinique with a SS braid instead of a manifold or false bottom?" you said "I know I wouldn't. A stainless braid begs for channeling due to it's small collection point."
Were you referring to the standard single piece braid, all braids in general, or to the looped braid like mine?
-Ben

 

[Bobby_M]

Yeah, I was talking about the typical short straight lonely braid down the center. In a loop that covers a lot of area, it would work better. However, when you're stirring your grain in, I'd be surprised if it's stays nice and neat like that. It won't hurt to give it a shot on one batch.

Note on the 30x30 mesh, it worked like a dream on an all-leaf hop bill for me yesterday. I really wanted to try pellets but I didn't have any in the variety I needed. I'm still editing but I have a video on how I made mine in the works.

 

[bendavanza]

ok the FLY went alright. The spent grain was much less sweet than with batch, but then again, it was still full of water at the end. I collected 6.25 gallons, and already had the flame on the kettle. 60 minutes in to the boil, I really had not lost the gallon I was planning on. I boiled maybe another 10 minutes, and got down to about 5.25 (compensating 1/4 for the IC) but ended up with 4.5g in the carboy, due to the 1oz pellets and 1 oz leaf hops, and whatever cold break etc. was left in the kettle. I used the 30x30 mesh homemade hopstopper. It worked well. All in all, this was a long brewday. I wonder if I'd save time by doing NMODBS.
The recipe calls for 1.051 OG, and that's what I got but I added 1lb of crystal 60.
Here's the grain bill: 9lbs 2-row, 3/4lb crystal 40, 1/8lb chocolate malt, to which I added the 1lb crystal 60. I got full conversion as indicated by the iodine test.
I know it will be a good beer but I think I'm getting lower efficiency than I would expect. I think my brew day was about 5 hours, not including cleanup. ugh.
I kind of miss the quick extract days, but it is more fun to mash.
-Ben

 

[dontman]

doing more reading I'm thinking more about Bobby M's N.M.O.D.B.S. - No Mash Out Double Batch Sparge. Hmm...

Ooh ooo ooh! I did not realize that I was using an officially acronymed process for my sparge.

"NMODBS " Ok. Doesn't really roll off the tongue though. How about "The Bobby "M"ethod".

I did fly sparge for my first 10 or so AG batches. I like it because I always got good efficiency and I could really nail the runoff properly by monitoring the gravity at any spot.

Minuses: Big swings in efficiency. Anywhere from 73% up to 85% I couldn't nail down the specific cause. I assume it was channeling. Also: It took a LONG TIME! Usually an hour. Now this is only about a half hour longer than double batch but it is also very labor intensive. I had to tend it the whole time. With batch I pour in the first batch, stir, clean crap for 10 minutes, and drain. Repeat. Lots of free time to do other stuff (or relax.)

The best benefit is that with batch my efficiency is always within a point or two of 79%. I can plan brews reliably based on this.

Awesome looking setup btw!

 

[bendavanza]

Leftover wort in the kettle with 30x30 mesh homemade hop stopper. I think if i sealed the connection to the ball valve better I could have gotten out another quart, maybe.

Perhaps too much venturi + hole in the hose aeration? It was foaming big time. I lost some wort to foam as well. The beer settled out very clear overnight but so far no yeast activity.

 

[bendavanza]

One thing I'll add, cleanup is a lot easier with a grain bag for hops rather than the kettle. Especially if you have a dog and are worried about hop poisoning. It did produce a clearer wort, though.

 

[Bobby_M]

Do you have your mesh attached to an easily removable siphon tube? Mine attaches with a compression fitting so it's easy to remove to hose off. I cleaned all the keg vessels in place this last time after the discussion on the wet/dry shop vac for that purpose. It was awesome just sucking the spent grain and hops out of there. BTW, I promise I'll have my 30x30 mesh construction video posted tonight.

 

[bendavanza]

I need one of those compression fittings, actually 3 of them I guess. Mine is in a threaded 1/2" copper fitting that you would sweat the tube to. It's a sort of snug fit but not a great seal. Looking fwd to the video