First Time All-Grain BIAB - Fermentation stuck TWICE?!

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Joined
Mar 31, 2020
Messages
5
Reaction score
0
Hello,

I've started doing two BIAB recipes using allgrain. In the past, I've done BIAB with extract and specialty grain, and have consistently exceeded my target ABV. These last two BIAB's I've decided to try all grain with no extract.

My issue is both my last brews have been severely UNDER the target. My first brew with all grain was a 5 gallon batch called "Juicy NEIPA". I wanted to hit a starting OG of 1.063, but ended up hitting 1.05. I targeted the FG to be 1.013 but it has instead finished at 1.021. What I was hoping to be a 6.6% beer is now a measly 3.8% (perfect for Utah laws...). I've attached below a photo from my TILT Hydrometer's chart and grain bill. I think I mashed somewhere around 156 degrees F. When I saw the SG halt, I tried warming the brew.

upload_2020-3-31_14-58-22.png


JUICY NEIPA
New England IPA

6.6% / 15.4 °P

All Grain


BIAB (No sparge)
67% efficiency

Batch Volume: 5.5 gal

Boil Time: 75 min


Mash Water: 7.7 gal

Total Water: 7.7 gal

Boil Volume: 6.53 gal

Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.053


Vitals
Original Gravity: 1.063

Final Gravity: 1.013

IBU (Tinseth): 0

Color: 4.3 SRM




Mash


Temperature — 150 °F — 60 min


Malts (13 lb)
9 lb (66.7%) — Avangard Pilsner Malt — Grain — 1.8 °L

1 lb 8 oz (11.1%) — Briess Barley, Flaked — Grain — 1.8 °L

1 lb 8 oz (11.1%) — Briess Oats, Flaked — Grain — 1.6 °L

1 lb (7.4%) — Wheat Flaked — Grain — 1.7 °L


Other (8 oz)
8 oz (3.7%) — Sugar in The Raw Turbinado — Sugar — 7.9 °L


Hops (12.24 oz)
1 oz — Centennial 10% — Aroma — 0 min hopstand @ 180 °F

1 oz — Citra 12% — Aroma — 0 min hopstand @ 180 °F

1 oz — El Dorado 15% — Aroma — 0 min hopstand @ 180 °F

1 oz — Mosaic 12.25% — Aroma — 0 min hopstand @ 180 °F

1 oz — Willamette 5% — Aroma — 0 min hopstand @ 180 °F

2 oz — Citra 12% — Dry Hop — day 3

1 oz — Centennial 10% — Dry Hop — day 3

1 oz — El Dorado 15% — Dry Hop — day 3

1 oz — Mosaic 12.25% — Dry Hop — day 3

0.25 oz — Willamette 5% — Dry Hop — day 3

2 oz — Lemondrop 6% — Dry Hop — day 6


Yeast
1 pkg — Imperial Yeast A38 Juice


Fermentation
Primary — 68 °F — 14 days



The other recipe I tried was a 1.5 gallon batch called "LemonDrop IPA". I hit my target OG perfectly at 1.04 and was excited. After 24 hours the fermentation stopped and is stuck at 1.028 which is far off my target of 1.009. I believe I also mashed high at 156 degrees. In my 3 gallon brew kettle, I leave the element on low for the duration of the mash to maintain temp. I've attached the TILT graph and recipe below as well.

upload_2020-3-31_15-4-52.png


Lemon Drop IPA
4.3% / 10.6 °P

All Grain


BIAB (No sparge)
67% efficiency

Batch Volume: 1.5 gal

Boil Time: 60 min


Mash Water: 2.46 gal

Total Water: 2.46 gal

Boil Volume: 2.23 gal

Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.032


Vitals
Original Gravity: 1.042

Final Gravity: 1.009

IBU (Tinseth): 49

Color: 2.2 SRM




Mash


Temperature — 149 °F — 60 min


Malts (2 lb 8.8 oz)
1 lb 12.8 oz (70.6%) — Briess Pilsen Malt 2-Row — Grain — 1.3 °L

7.2 oz (17.7%) — Briess Oats, Flaked — Grain — 1.6 °L

4.8 oz (11.8%) — Briess Barley, Flaked — Grain — 1.8 °L


Hops (1.79 oz)
1.19 oz (49 IBU) — Lemondrop 6% — Boil — 15 min

0.6 oz — Lemondrop 6% — Dry Hop — day 3


Yeast
0.3 pkg — Imperial Yeast A24 Dry Hop


Fermentation
Primary — 68 °F — 14 days


Do any of you know what could be causing this? I thought maybe my imperial yeast was the issue, but using a whole packet for my 1.5 gallon brew is MORE than enough yeast, so figured the yeast is not a concern. I made sure to keep my temp between 64-74 degrees for the second batch, and oxygenated really well. I'm not sure why my attenuation is so poor these batches?
 
If using liquid always make a starter unless you pitch two packs.
You should always have dry yeast on hand just in case..
Your 5 gal batch looks good. I scale my recipes for 5.5 gal into fermenter and I usually start with 7.2- 7.6 gal strike water. I usually always hit my target OG.
How much was your boil off? I use electric and I only get about .5 to .75 gal/hr boil off.
How was your crush? If your boil off is less than 1 gal you may need to adjust your water volume.
 
If using liquid always make a starter unless you pitch two packs.
You should always have dry yeast on hand just in case.

That's great to know for the future, but in the case of my 1.5 gallon batch, I used a whole Imperial Yeast liquid pack. This is designed for a 5 gallon batch, so that's pitching 3.3x more yeast than I need too, right?

How much was your boil off? I use electric and I only get about .5 to .75 gal/hr boil off.
How was your crush? If your boil off is less than 1 gal you may need to adjust your water volume.
I started with 2.5 gallons, then ended with about 1.3 gallons.
 
No primary fermentation held at 69F is over in 24 hours. I'm not so sure I would trust your Tilt in this situation. Aren't they known to get hung up on krausen and give false readings? Mashing at 156 is not going to cause such poor attenuation. I would let the Lemon Drop ride and see what happens.
 
No primary fermentation held at 69F is over in 24 hours. I'm not so sure I would trust your Tilt in this situation. Aren't they known to get hung up on krausen and give false readings? Mashing at 156 is not going to cause such poor attenuation. I would let the Lemon Drop ride and see what happens.

Hey Mr. McKnuckle. I thought the same thing too, but I'm on my third day and there is no Krausen at the top. I double checked the calibration and the Tilt is spot on (+-0.001) from what I'm getting with my hydrometer. I want to let it ride out, but I'm hoping to brew another batch this weekend. Don't want this to happen to another batch, so eager to see what I may be doing wrong.

Below: Photo of LemonDrop IPA 50 hours after yeast pitch

thumbnail


Photo Below: Hydrometer reading matching Tilt:

thumbnail
 
If it were me (and I couldn't wait) I would bump the ferm temp up 4 degrees and see what happens.

I would also double check my temp gauge.
 
Leaving the element on during mashing could be part of the problem. Brew-Dudes did a video about attentuation issues and elements during mashing.



I don't use BIAB so I couldn't advise you on efficiency issues but there's plenty out there on the topic.

I also have never used a Tilt hydrometer, so no help there either.

What I can say is simplicity is key when switching to all grain. The learning curve can be steep, and often beer qaulity goes down for people during their first few batches when they transition from extract to all grain (it sounds crazy...I know).

Extract vs All Grain Aside...the first thing I would ask myself is..."Am I doing everything I can to promote a healthy fermentation?"

Do I have proper pitch rates (yeast starter), yeast nutrient, proper oxygenation (not just aeration), sufficient cooling method, proper pitching temp, proper fermentation temp ( temp control).

Some people do all of the above, some pic and choose, but if you want a healthy fermenation and good attenuation, I would trying checking all those things and add or correct what you can.

Sometimes I ask myself not what I did wrong, but what did I not do at all.

We're asking a lot of the yeast by having them make us tasty beer... we should try and give them every advantage possible...so they can get their job done :)
 
Low starting gravity is almost certainly about your grain crush. It should be closer to flour with no kernels intact.

Stuck fermentations, for a new all grain brewer, is most likely too high of a mash temp. Check your thermometer calibration.

One pack of Imperial yeast is about a 5x overpitch in a 1 gallon batch unless the pack was 3 months old.
 
you didn’t seem too sure of you mash temp and 156 is getting warm. Where and how did you measure that. That’s starting to get warm so if you’re off on the high side, you’re going to begin denaturing your enzymes.
 
A lot of homebrewers are shy to approach the higher end of alpha amylase temps. True, 156 is "getting warm," but it's nowhere near the point where attenuation will be dramatically limited like these examples (58% and 30%). The latter of those is an extreme.

Now, if your mash was actually much hotter, over 162, it could be another story.
 
A lot of homebrewers are shy to approach the higher end of alpha amylase temps. True, 156 is "getting warm," but it's nowhere near the point where attenuation will be dramatically limited like these examples (58% and 30%). The latter of those is an extreme.

Now, if your mash was actually much hotter, over 162, it could be another story.

156F is fine if you are absolutely sure it's 156 and not 159 or higher. Not all thermometers are created equal which is why I suggested checking calibration. It's possible he overheated the lower half of the mash in a warm up step.
 
I think I mashed somewhere around 156 degrees F.

I leave the element on low for the duration of the mash to maintain temp.

These two comments are why I’d be surprised if OP is mashing at 156. I don’t know what kind of element is being used using or how insulated the vessel is but this seems to be playing fast and loose with mash temps.

And agreed, 156 is not too hot. It is getting on the warm side where room for error diminishes.

@Peptobismol165 what’s the wattage of your element, how are you measuring temp and when during the mash are measuring temp.
 
Back
Top