First Recipe: Extract IIPA

[mbbransc]

So I ordered an IPA kit but want to expand on it to make something unique and better. Here's what I was thinking. Please guide/advise as you see fit.

Steep 1# Crystal 75L 20min in 2gal at 155*-160*
Add water to 6gal
Add 4# DME Pilsen
1oz Summit (18.5%) 60min
1oz Cascade (7%) 15min
7# extra light LME 15min
1/2# table sugar 15min
1oz Zythos (11%) flameout, steep 15min before chilling
1oz Palisade (7.5%) flameout, steep 15min before chilling
1oz Centennial (10%) flameout, steep 15min before chilling
Wyeast 1272 American Ale II 2L starter


According to BrewersFriend, all aligns with IIPA
OG: 1.084
FG: 1.022
ABV: 8.15%
IBU: 97.79

 

[GrogNerd]

they package kits for a reason: the recipe is tried and true and makes a decent beer. if you've never brewed the kit before, or never brewed at all, I'll advise you to use the kit as is and follow the instructions

if you deek around with the recipe and it turns out like crap, you'll never know if it was your technique or the recipe

you would be better off just buying an IIPA kit to begin with

but, it's your beer; either way you do it, good luck with it

 

[mbbransc]

^ I have an IPA fermenting now. Wanted to try something else. Thx.

 

[eric19312]

FG sounds way too high for IIPA. You are steering into hoppy barley wine territory at 1.022. Style guide puts IIPA FG at 1.010-1.020 but the low end of the range is better IMO.

You are high because of unfermentables in extract. Adding the crystal doesn't help either.

A couple strategies to consider would be:
(easy) drop the crystal and increase the sugar to #1
(better) stovetop partial mash - sub as many pounds of base malt as you can mash, pound for pound with LME. Mash it low 145-150 to enhance fermentability.

(experimental) I heard this on a podcast this weekend. No idea if it will really work but I will throw it out there.
After straining your partial mass, take the hot wort you collected and combine this with your DME. Hold the temperature of the mixture at about 150F for a few minutes. Can't remember what they said but 10-15 is probably fine. The still active enzymes in the PM wort will chew on the unfermentable sugars in the DME and give you a more fermentable wort.


Also on the hops...you need to plan on some dry hops. Other than that I really can't comment on your specific selections it is really a matter of personal preference.

 

[m3n00b]

I had a double IPA finish at 1020 and it was really tasty. Wasn't sweet at all.

I also recommend 2-3oz of centennial/chinook/mosaic dry hops.

 

[mbbransc]

FG sounds way too high for IIPA. You are steering into hoppy barley wine territory at 1.022. Style guide puts IIPA FG at 1.010-1.020 but the low end of the range is better IMO.

You are high because of unfermentables in extract. Adding the crystal doesn't help either.

A couple strategies to consider would be:
(easy) drop the crystal and increase the sugar to #1
(better) stovetop partial mash - sub as many pounds of base malt as you can mash, pound for pound with LME. Mash it low 145-150 to enhance fermentability.

(experimental) I heard this on a podcast this weekend. No idea if it will really work but I will throw it out there.
After straining your partial mass, take the hot wort you collected and combine this with your DME. Hold the temperature of the mixture at about 150F for a few minutes. Can't remember what they said but 10-15 is probably fine. The still active enzymes in the PM wort will chew on the unfermentable sugars in the DME and give you a more fermentable wort.


Also on the hops...you need to plan on some dry hops. Other than that I really can't comment on your specific selections it is really a matter of personal preference.

Hmm, what if I partial BIAB 5# 2-row and drop the DME? I already have 7# container of LME I'd like to use. Maybe add ~2# LME pre-boil and the other 5 and the end?

Plugged it into BrewersFriend and the OG falls too much. I added back 2# DME to get it back to 1.080. Looks like it is still finishing at 1.021. Really, I don't mind a sweeter finish in my strong IPAs so it may be negligible point for me.

 

[m3n00b]

I got a 33 on my second IPA ever which finished at 1.020 from 1.068. No comments on it being sweet at all.

 

[eric19312]

Hmm, what if I partial BIAB 5# 2-row and drop the DME? I already have 7# container of LME I'd like to use. Maybe add ~2# LME pre-boil and the other 5 and the end?

Plugged it into BrewersFriend and the OG falls too much. I added back 2# DME to get it back to 1.080. Looks like it is still finishing at 1.021. Really, I don't mind a sweeter finish in my strong IPAs so it may be negligible point for me.

I'd do it. Partial BIAB the base malt instead of some of the DME. I bet you do better than 1.080 but 1.085 will also be a good beer...The partial mash will do wonders for the flavor whether or not you follow my suggestion to shoot for lower FG. Make sure you get it crushed at the store if you dont have a mill--don't want to be crushing 5# 2-row with a rolling pin..

FG is a matter of preference and am sure if you use good technique you are going to end up with good beer that you like very much. PTE and HT are outstanding commercial examples, both of these are supposed to come in at about 1.010, getting there starting with 1.070-1.080 wort is an important part of the art of their brewers. I imagine the bitterness from the hops can mask a lot of sweetness so the low FG is really about drinkability. Here is a link to an article written by Vinnie Cilurzo (head brewer at Russia River) on the subject.
https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/6351/doubleIPA.pdf

Vinnie clearly allows that FG is a matter of personal preference but his preference is for "a Double IPA that is light in body thus allowing the hops to plow through the overall flavor profile of the beer". I like his beer too and aim for that when making an IIPA.

Lastly...I haven't seen software that can accurately predict FG. You pretty much have to brew it and ferment it out and see what you get. But I'd expect extract and crystal to add unfermentable sugars, pushing FG up.

 

[boydster]

If it were my brew, which it is not, I would cut the crystal in half and increase sugar to a full pound. Then, I would add more hops. Push the 15 min cascade out to 10 mins and make it 1.5oz. Pick an ounce or two of some of your other hops and add at 5 minutes. Keep the flameout additions. Dry hop with another 3+ ounces hops, I'd probably mirror the flameout hops plus add some more cascade.

 

[TriggerFingers]

ok 2 things....

1) For your hop steep, its not just a time, its temp you are aiming for. You want to get the hops in and the temp down into the 140-160 range so the hop oils don't vaporize. I put a paint strainer bag in at knockout and then throw the hop steep hops in (also makes it easier to separate into the primary).

2) you will need to dry hop.....

I would go with 2-3 ounces spread out over 8 days (you could do more--e.g. 4-5 ounces). So, maybe 1 oz of Centennial and 1 oz of Columbus (or whatever you prefer) on days 1-4, and 1 oz of something else for days 5-8. Dry hopping is about preference.....if you go too long it will get grassy, I have found that 7-8 days is the sweet spot. However, I know some people go 2 weeks, some will take it even longer....I had 5 gallons of grassy IPA and its not very appealing. YMMV.

I also agree about cutting back on the crystal a touch (but its your call).....IPA's with too much crystal can be cloyingly sweet. I usually shoot for half a pound or crystal and thats it--I think I did 12oz in a ruination clone once, but again---your preference.

Good luck!

 

[mbbransc]

ok 2 things....

1) For your hop steep, its not just a time, its temp you are aiming for. You want to get the hops in and the temp down into the 140-160 range so the hop oils don't vaporize. I put a paint strainer bag in at knockout and then throw the hop steep hops in (also makes it easier to separate into the primary).

Interesting. That's the first time I've heard that. That's sort of the sweet spot for infection and I was under the impression that I just want to keep the pot covered until we get under 100*. Hence, the hop steep would start as soon as I turned the flame off. I have just tossed them in the wort in the past and let them transition to the primary with everything else. I'll worry about clearing them out when I cold crash.

 

[m3n00b]

Bacteria can't live above 140. I usually do my hop stand between 160-180. I also transfer these hops into the fermenter.

 

[mbbransc]

OK, so here is an updated stab including the most prevalent recommendations here:

Mash: (I'll be using a rectangle cooler and paint strainer bag. Any recommendations on temp/time? I'm guessing around 148*-152* for 45-60 minutes in ~2gal water)
- 5# 2-Row
- 1/2# C75L
dunk/sparge in 170* 3gal water. Add wort and top off to 6gal.

- 2# LME extra light
- 2# DME pilsen
- 0.75# sugar
Boil

- 1oz Summit (18.5%) 60min
- 5# LME 15min
- whirfloc 15min
- 1.5oz Cascade (7%) 10min
- 1oz Zythos (11%) flameout (~160* steep)
- 1oz Palisade (7.5%) flameout (~160* steep)
- 1oz Centennial (10%) flameout (~160* steep)

- 1.5oz Cascade (7%) dry, ~5 days
- 1oz Centennial (10%) dry, ~ 5 days

I adjusted the attenuation on BrewsFriend up to 78% based on some of the feedback here. With that adjustment, here are the new numbers.

OG: 1.081
FG: 1.018
ABV: 8.34%
IBU: 116.8
SRM: 8.37 (odd that the color scale for IIPA goes from 8-15. Would have expected to see a lighter range)


Any more opinions?