First Lager and Adding Yeast for Bottling

[MIWI]

I used a Briess recipe and it notes to add extra yeast for bottling. I asume this is due to cold crashing after the dycetil rest. Speaking with my homebrewing shop they never add additional yeast. After researching some I read some confusing information on adding yeast when bottling. So I get to thinking will the dycetil rest along with cold crash down to 34 F use up or kill any left over yeast? Thus the reason to add yeast along with the priming sugar. I am just afraid of blowing up bottles if added or no carbonation if not added!
Your thoughts or experience? Thanks.

 

[VikeMan]

34F doesn't kill yeast. Any yeast added at bottling would be for "insurance," but is rarely needed. If you do add yeast, you don't have to worry about blowing up bottles (assuming you don't use too much priming sugar). It's the amount of sugar that determines the level of carbonation, not the amount of yeast.

 

[MIWI]

Thanks for the reply. I only been homebrewing for 2 years and wanted to make a attempt at a lager. If I would use additional yeast should I used the same WLP 800 or can I use CBC-1?

 

[VikeMan]

If I would use additional yeast should I used the same WLP 800 or can I use CBC-1?

Either would work. The thing you don't want to do is to use a yeast strain that's more attenuative than your primary strain (WLP800), because that could go to work on residual maltotiose in the beer instead of just the priming sugar.

Edit: That's maltotriose, not maltotiose, which isn't a real thing.

 

[Beermeister32]

Either would work. The thing you don't want to do is to use a yeast strain that's more attenuative than your primary strain (WLP800), because that could go to work on residual maltotiose in the beer instead of just the priming sugar.

So very VERY true. I was bottling some US-05 produced ale once and tossed in a bit of Hornindal in as bottling yeast. MISTAKE! Completely over-carbonated the batch. Best to use the original type yeast.

 

[MIWI]

Thanks for all the help. Since my homebrew snop is out of that yeast I think i will bottle without adding additional yeast. Hopefully there is suficient amount left.

 

[Steveruch]

I brewed a pilsner many years ago that sat in my brew fridge for three months at 34f that carbed fine without adding yeast at bottling.

 

[balrog]

Yeah, with homebrewing it is actually quite difficult to remove enough yeast post ferment to hamper bottle conditioning, without centrifuge or high level filtration, unless you do high alcohol, very long term ferment like a RIS.

 

[TheCache]

I have brewed a few lagers and never added yeast. They have all carbonated just fine. The last one I fermented at 53-55, slowly raised to 67 over 5 days for diacetyl rest then lowered to 34 for lagering (all in the fermentation tank). Kept it at lager temp for 3 weeks (could have been longer, but I wanted to drink it) then moved to a bottling bucket and added priming sugar (while still cold). Moved the bottles to a 68-70˚ part of the house and let them set for another 2-3 weeks (since I bottled cold, I left the bottles at the higher temp for a little longer than I normally would). Moved them all to a fridge and after a few days popped open a nicely carbonated, clean Helles lager.

I agree with what a few have said above, removing or killing all the yeast from a beer would take some serious effort, and if you do add yeast use the same strain.

Also, not the same topic and not sure what your setup is, but you might consider a cold crash guardian or something like that. Raising and lowering the temp that much can certainly suck in some oxygen if you don't have a way to mitigate it.

 

[MIWI]

Hello The Cache well you convinced me along with others to not add yeast. I am at the cold crash point and will start that today. You metioned you cold crashed for 3 weeks but should have longer. My recipe calls for 4 to 6 weeks. I am awaiting the first bottle also. I will try for 6 weeks!
Thank you all for the great information to help me with my first lager.

 

[VikeMan]

You metioned you cold crashed for 3 weeks but should have longer. My recipe calls for 4 to 6 weeks. I am awaiting the first bottle also. I will try for 6 weeks!

Recipes really shouldn't call for a specific length of cold crash, any more than they should call for a specific fermentation time. The right length of time for a cold crash depends on how long it takes for stuff to drop out of suspension, leaving beer that's clear enough, as judged by the brewer. That will vary.

 

[TheCache]

Recipes really shouldn't call for a specific length of cold crash, any more than they should call for a specific fermentation time. The right length of time for a cold crash depends on how long it takes for stuff to drop out of suspension, leaving beer that's clear enough, as judged by the brewer. That will vary.

Agreed, but I think in this case, the OP is just using the term cold crash to indicate the entire lager period. When I do a lager I don't technically have a "cold crash" period, because I go straight into lagering and try to leave it there for at least 4 weeks or until it is a clear as I think it is going to get. So its either a nice lager or a really long cold crash

 

[VikeMan]

Agreed, but I think in this case, the OP is just using the term cold crash to indicate the entire lager period. When I do a lager I don't technically have a "cold crash" period, because I go straight into lagering and try to leave it there for at least 4 weeks or until it is a clear as I think it is going to get. So its either a nice lager or a really long cold crash

I think he was too, but either way, the "required" period will vary according to grain bill, yeast strain, water, mash parameters, actual temperatures, height of vessel, etc. IMO, If a lagered beer is clear enough (to the brewer's own standard), it's time to drink it. But I think you might agree, given your statement of "at least 4 weeks or until it is a clear as I think it is going to get."

IMO, once off flavors have been cleaned up, and the beer subsequently crashed/lagered until clear, there's not really much happening except for staling reactions.

ETA: I'm also convinced that some drinkers have a preference (consciously or not) for lagers with some mild staling, because it matches what they find in german imports and some craft brewpubs. Which is fine, but it's not my preference.

 

[TheCache]

IMO, once off flavors have been cleaned up, and the beer subsequently crashed/lagered until clear, there's not really much happening except for staling reactions.

Now see, I could have just passed right over this sentence and thought you were misspelling a word (stalling/staling), but no, I had to go search it out and realize there is whole new shelf full of information about staling, especially in regard to lagers that I never even knew about. Sheesh, just when I think I'm starting to understand brewing I find a whole new thing to study...

Good staling article here, if anyone else is interested. It does mention that many people probably consider staling flavors part of their favorite beers without even knowing that they occur... like me until a few minutes ago.

Thanks for the new word/brewing event.