First BIAB/AG recipe and brewday

[karch]

I've recently made the jump from extract to all grain. I'm going to be doing the BIAB way, and decided to start it right off with making my own recipe. I'm going for a crisp, piney beer with a pleasant aroma.

Recipe Type: All Grain
Style: Rye Pale Ale
Yeast: Wyeast Labs #1056
Batch Size (Gallons): 5.5
Est. Original Gravity: 1.050
Est. IBU: 40.3
Boiling Time (Minutes): 60

Grain Bill:
6lbs Pale Malt (2-Row) - 53.3%
2lbs Vienna Malt - 17.8%
1.5lbs Rye Malt - 13.3%
1lbs Cara-Pils - 8.9%
0.75lbs Crystal Malt 20L - 6.7%

Hops:
11.4g Nuggest @ 60min
14.17g Chinook & 14.17g Simcoe @ 15min
42.52g Simcoe & 42.52g Citra @ 0min

I've never dry hopped before, but I'm thinking after primary fermentation, I'll put two gallons into separate one gallon jugs and dry hop in there (1 gall w/Chinook, 1 gall w/ Citra) while transferring the rest of the 3 gallons to a 3 gallon carboy.

I plan on mashing @ 156F for 75 mins with 6.44 gallons of water. After the mash, I'm going to do a dunk sparge into 2 gallons of water.

Any comments, questions, concerns would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Build]

That seems like a good recipe. I would probably mash lower if I wanted it crisp and let the pine hops come through more. 156F will give some real malt flavor with your grain bill.

 

[Aristotelian]

I wouldn't go a milligram over 14.12g of Chinook...Just kidding, but you've got almost 15% crystal malts, which seems high, especially because you are also mashing high at 156. I would probably cut both the Carapils and the 20L in half, or maybe just ditch the Carapils and keep the 20L if you want the color.

 

[2trout]

Consider a 90 min mash. No extra work, and it seems to give me a drier profile.

Trout

 

[karch]

Okay. Think I'll tone mash temp down to 152 and ditch the carapils.

 

[TexasWine]

You might consider posting this in the recipe/ingredients section. You're sure to garner more responses.

 

[BlurryEyed]

I'd skip the dunk sparge if your kettle can handle full volume and do a thinner mash.

 

[karch]

You might consider posting this in the recipe/ingredients section. You're sure to garner more responses.

Re-posted in recipes. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7527560#post7527560

I'd skip the dunk sparge if your kettle can handle full volume and do a thinner mash.

90 min mash with full volume? Is there any possible negatives of mashing for too long or having too thin of a mash?

 

[BlurryEyed]

I normally do a 60min mash for BIAB and saw no difference in mash efficiency when sparging of any kind vs. no sparge. Just my 2 cents

 

[karch]

Great, thanks.

 

[BlurryEyed]

There's a couple of threads regarding BIAB sparge vs no sparge. I think the consensus was sparging yielded 5% +\- efficiency differences. Perhaps try both and see how ya do!

 

[karch]

I think that's what I'll do. I'll start off with no sparge and see where my efficiency is then make adjustments off of that.

 

[doug293cz]

There's a couple of threads regarding BIAB sparge vs no sparge. I think the consensus was sparging yielded 5% +\- efficiency differences. Perhaps try both and see how ya do!

A well conducted, equal runnings, batch sparge will yield about 8% better lauter efficiency than no sparge, if grain absorption rate and pre-boil volume are the same for both cases.



Pour over sparge lauter efficiency will usually be in between the no sparge and optimal batch sparge.

Many BIABers, including me usually, accept the lower efficiency and go the no sparge route cause it's a little less work.

Brew on

 

[BlurryEyed]

Yea I'm lazier. I tried sparging for a while but didn't see much gain in it. Thinner mash and an extra half lb of grain was much easier.

 

[karch]

I ended up brewing this beer this past weekend. It turned out pretty good for my first AG, but I think I may have overshot my efficiency by getting higher than expected OG.

Pre-boil SG: 1.052
Measured OG: 1.066

My estimated OG according to beersmith was 1.062. Is that an issue? Should I top up in the future to fix that? Does anyone have any insights into correcting efficiency in beersmith?

Thanks! Pics below!

All mashed in

Heating up for the boil

A couple of hours post-brew

About 24 hours after brewing (I've never had krausen like that!)

I'll post again in a couple of weeks when I dry hop or at latest, when I'm sipping this thing.

 

[Aristotelian]

A well conducted, equal runnings, batch sparge will yield about 8% better lauter efficiency than no sparge, if grain absorption rate and pre-boil volume are the same for both cases.

What about a good squeeze? I get virtually identical numbers sparging vs squeeze (no sparge). Could squeezing be considered a BIAB approach to sparging?

 

[karch]

I gave this one a big squeeze.

 

[doug293cz]

,

What about a good squeeze? I get virtually identical numbers sparging vs squeeze (no sparge). Could squeezing be considered a BIAB approach to sparging?

Not really. Squeezing reduces the amount of wort (and thus sugar) held by the grain, whereas sparging rinses sugar out of the grain (by diluting the wort held by the grain), but the grain still holds the same amount of wort. It is possible with aggressive squeezing to get better efficiency with squeezing vs. single batch sparging for larger grain bills (study the previously posted curves to see this.) However, a squeeze, sparge, squeeze will provide the best efficiency.

Brew on

 

[Build]

,

Not really. Squeezing reduces the amount of wort (and thus sugar) held by the grain, whereas sparging rinses sugar out of the grain (by diluting the wort held by the grain), but the grain still holds the same amount of wort. It is possible with aggressive squeezing to get better efficiency with squeezing vs. single batch sparging for larger grain bills (study the previously posted curves to see this.) However, a squeeze, sparge, squeeze will provide the best efficiency.

Brew on

Doug293cz said it greatly. I always pull the bag, let it drain/squeeze, batch sparge, squeeze again as I'm getting up to boil. Efficiency is 80%+ even with 20lb+ grainbills. The grain crush size can have a large effect on efficiency with biab.

 

[doug293cz]

... The grain crush size can have a large effect on efficiency with biab.

Indeed it can. The crush however affects the conversion efficiency, not the lauter efficiency (and in a strange quirk, higher conversion efficiency actually reduces lauter efficiency a tiny bit.) Smaller grits convert faster than larger grits, since gelatinization (first step in conversion) proceeds from the surface of the grits towards the centers. Longer mash times can make up for larger grits, until you get to the point where alpha amylase is all denatured, at which point conversion stops.

Brew on

 

[BlurryEyed]

I ended up brewing this beer this past weekend. It turned out pretty good for my first AG, but I think I may have overshot my efficiency by getting higher than expected OG.

Pre-boil SG: 1.052
Measured OG: 1.066

My estimated OG according to beersmith was 1.062. Is that an issue? Should I top up in the future to fix that? Does anyone have any insights into correcting efficiency in beersmith?

Thanks! Pics below!

All mashed in

Heating up for the boil

A couple of hours post-brew

About 24 hours after brewing (I've never had krausen like that!)

I'll post again in a couple of weeks when I dry hop or at latest, when I'm sipping this thing.

That is a ton of trub in that fermenter. While you may have a high mash efficiency, your brewhouse efficiency looks to be cut in half based on the amount of volume you'll yield.

 

[doug293cz]

That is a ton of trub in that fermenter. While you may have a high mash efficiency, your brewhouse efficiency looks to be cut in half based on the amount of volume you'll yield.

That will settle down to a much thinner trub layer after fermentation is complete. Mine usually look like that a few hours after filling the fermenter, but after cold crash, the trub layer is about 1" thick.

Brew on :mug;

 

[BlurryEyed]

That will settle down to a much thinner trub layer after fermentation is complete. Mine usually look like that a few hours after filling the fermenter, but after cold crash, the trub layer is about 1" thick.

Brew on :mug;

While I agree it will "thin down", that's a lot of trub. My trub layer for my 6.5 carboy is usually 2-3" thick after settling, then about 1" or so after cold crashing.

 

[karch]

Yeah, I didn't filter it at all. Everything the pick up tube sucked up, went into the fermenter. I mainly use hop pellets and saw a lot of the in-kettle filters don't work too well with pellets as they get clogged. I'm going to look into using a cheese cloth or muslin cloth to filter out the hop pellet trub from kettle to fermenter

 

[MaryB]

I went to hop bags for the pellets. Keeps 90% of the hop trub in the bag...

 

[BrewinBromanite]

,



...It is possible with aggressive squeezing to get better efficiency with squeezing vs. single batch sparging for larger grain bills (study the previously posted curves to see this.) However, a squeeze, sparge, squeeze will provide the best efficiency.



Brew on

This is pretty much what I do. I mash at 1.25-1.5 qt per lb, stirring well once or twice during mash. Drain and squeeze. Dunk/batch sparge with remaining required volume, the drain and squeeze a second time. First time doing this I overshot gravity pretty significantly based off of Beersmith estimates. Good news, it came out awesome (ended up with an accidentally 7.5% version of Yooper's House pale ale). Since then, when using this technique, I adjust Beersmith estimated efficiency to better predict future batches. Don't remember exactly off the top of my head, but I think I changed efficiency prediction from the default in the 70% range to about 80%, and my numbers come out much closer to the software predictions.

 

[BlurryEyed]

Yeah, I didn't filter it at all. Everything the pick up tube sucked up, went into the fermenter. I mainly use hop pellets and saw a lot of the in-kettle filters don't work too well with pellets as they get clogged. I'm going to look into using a cheese cloth or muslin cloth to filter out the hop pellet trub from kettle to fermenter

I see a few "upgrades" in your future

1) Hop Spider
2) Ball valve for your kettle
3) Future upgrade: whirlpool arm/chugger pump

You can achieve a decent whirlpool with your brew spoon. This will help collect the proteins in the center of the kettle so they don't end up in your fermenter.

 

[karch]

I transferred this into a secondary yesterday to help clear it up (still pretty hazey) and dry hop it.

It fermented down to 1.01 giving it an abv of 7.35%. It tasted really good, more citrusy and floral than I was expecting. I'll pull out the hops in a couple of days and let it settle some more before bottling.

Will update again at bottling or when I pop one open.

 

[BlurryEyed]

Can you cold crash? I typically cold crash for 24hrs, then use Gelatin fining for another 24hrs, then keg. Clear beer!

 

[karch]

I was actually thinking about that. Trying to visualize if the fridge in my garage will be able to hold a 5 gall carboy. I'll take some measurements next time I get a chance.