First batch need some advice please!

[SkeletorMob]

So I have decide to start learning to brew mead. My mother had purchased me "how to make mead like a viking, Jereme Zimmerman" for Christmas and now I want to make it a hobby.
For the purposes of "starting from the bottom" and to learn traditional technique, I'm learning the wild ferment first. I made a starter with ginger sugar and water per book recipe and it turned out nice (I think lol) so then I went to mix 2 recipes 7 days later. When I mixed my recipes I wasn't thinking properly and mixed in a one gallon container, so when I added my honey I had to lose about a third of the gallon of water. I am now 8 days into an open ferment. The first 5 days were inactive and I got stuck with a cold weather spell, so my room hasn't been over 70 degrees this week. As of Sunday I started keeping the jars on a heat pad and have since noticed a little bubbling but still pretty stuck!
How can I help this? Patience and temp monitering? Or should I water it down? If I water down what may you think I should remove and add. I'm torn between splitting both in half or just siphoning out a mason jar or two and replacing it. One batch has 6 lbs of honey (dessert show mead) the other has 4 lbs of honey.
Surprisingly the batch with 6 gallons shows more signs of fermenting. Thanks for any help guys and gals!

 

[BeeDeeEff]

What was the starting specific gravity of your batch?

or baring that post the specific recipe you used, how much honey, how much water, ect...

 

[JJack887]

Mead still very much ferments below 70° ( None of mine have ever fermented at that temperature, come to think of it). Your key is patience.

 

[SkeletorMob]

Thank you kindly Jack and Bee! I do not have a tool to determine specific gravity yet, I believe that is a hydrometer? I believe my vintner friend has a extra one for me I have not gone to get it yet!
Recipe one (dessert show mead)
called for one full gallon of water
4-6 lbs honey (I used six, I've got a sweettooth)
25 or so raisins
10 oak leaves (called for tannins of choice)
2 tbl of starter (added another two at 6 days)
Recipe 2 (long weird name)
1 full gallon of water
3-4lbs honey (used 4)
Tea from a cinnamon stick and allspice
25 raisins

Now another possible mistake I may have made was that I mixed all my honey at once. I had read a tip it would have been better to mix a lb short and add the lb after an initial ferment.

Jack, Considering how slow it's moving do you think I should continue 5 mins of agitation 3-4x a day as I have been doing until I get a real bubble, or cover it and let it sit? Thanks again guys I'll try and get a photo of before and after agitation right now!!

 

[SkeletorMob]

The amount of starter is the same for the second recipe and a vanilla bean sorry

 

[nitack]

Seems to me that the most likely point of failure is in your wild yeast starter. You may have cultivated a strain that is weak or needs odd conditions to thrive. That is the challenge of wild ferments, there are untold numbers of strains and the vast majority will not be ideal. Falling into a puddle of syrupy sweet liquid is not a condition that you'll find often in nature.

 

[SkeletorMob]

Tack, thank you boss, this was my next fear! I was prepared to figure out a "commercial" yeast that would accommodate in case I recieved this answer! I didn't expect to get it right the first try, the book said the same thing. Lots of different wild strains and that I'd need to hone in the areas I pick my ingredients that produce the best results. You da man! Do you believe I should add a known strain asap if this the case?
Attached are the photos from today's agitation.
photos are having trouble uploading...
yea the server is acting funny cant upload.... damn

 

[nitack]

I would absolutely add a known strain, preferably a killer like KV-1116, ASAP. The longer it goes without a good yeast the more chance you'll have an infection take over.

In the future, if you want to go wild start in a place that is more likely to have a good yeast. Go to a farm growing organic grapes, buy a bunch straight off the vine, crush them and drop them into the must. Then go to an organic pick your own apple farm and do the same thing. Your more likely to find a yeast good at digesting the kinds of sugar you are working with.

 

[SkeletorMob]

Boom brother Thank you! I take the advice to heart! I'll let you all know how everything goes! Thanks again for the quick responses from everyone! Skeletor, out

 

[wildmazer]

in my experience working with wild yeasts, it helps to work up your starter until it's about as sweet as your must (and still active). the theory is that you probably have a wide variety of yeasts to start with, but you want to single out the ones that can handle more sugar/alcohol. it can help to source yeasts from grapes/blueberries/apples etc, but you can get there from ginger as well.

6lbs to the gallon, though? you're going to lose that sweet tooth at that rate! most wild yeasts may find that hard to start in, let alone eat through. would require careful monitoring to get the starter to that range.

 

[SkeletorMob]

Mazer thank you very much the reinforcing knowledge!!
I had picked my oak leaves from a local winery, should a go be with the grapes, Haha!! now I've got a strong foundation to lay my next wild starter on I'm stoked!
That's interesting, because when I first added starter definitely smelled as sweet as the mixes, I tried to make the starter stronger by using a cup of the orginal into a new starter mix, results smelled a little funkier with a sweet taste. Last night the dessert show mead (the 6 lbs of glory lol) had quite a funky smell and not necessarily a good funk, so I'm very glad I turned to advice, today I'm going to add in the k1v 1116 and dim down one mason of water. Hopefully I can save these two jars! Thanks again man, will definitely be watching and waiting! Worst case it fails and I try again, second best worst case I've got some probiotic sugar water lmao thanks again! Hope everyone has a great wednesday!

 

[SkeletorMob]

Thank you Mazer!! The first round of starter was just as sweet as the other jars so thanks for mentioning that when I attempted to make it stronger it tasted just as sweet but has a funky smell to it but more activity. Definitely will be experimenting and nailing down a starter batch. Today the goal is to add k1v 1116 and then dim down a mason jar or two of water. Last night the desert show me took a rather funky smell but still taste sweet so I'm afraid I may have an infection in that one but hopefully this gnarly yeast will shave my batch. I feel confident and armed with lots of good advice I can't thank you guys enough! If anybody has suggestions for good literature on mead-making that would be great too! Have a great Wednesday guys and gals!!

 

[SkeletorMob]

Woops I didnt see my first reply actually went through haha

 

[JJack887]

Wow, you really made a monster-strength mead. If I were you, I'd cork, cap, AND wax a bottle or two of that batch for years of aging (higher strength ages very well).

 

[SkeletorMob]

Well we are at 3 days with the new yeast everything looks great! Now I know what a ferment looks like!
The 6lb batch got diluted by a gallon with the new yeast, one gallon is a little more active than the other. They were mixed together in a pot. Because of the bad smell I decided to pasteurize and neutralize it. I did this by bringing the the gallon of new water to near boil and then adding the mix and letting it cool. Probably not a true pasteurization but it killed the bad smell, and still holds a sweet honey smell. Along with grape. Lol we'll see how the ages out I geuss. They are open fermenting right now covered with a think towel. The second recipe I threw in a 1 gallon carboy and airlock after pitching the new yeast. Before I pitched I was surprised it actually took the wild ferment but didn't want to risk a mistake. It tastes really good to me, like Christmas or really tasty cereal. Might be a lot of vanilla and cinnamon coming through but I like it. And thanks to everyone's advice I now have 3 gallons bubbling and foaming away!
Still haven't acquired the hydrometer but I don't think I'll worry to much for a reading until another 4 days. Which would mark 8 days of a (stuck start)wild open ferment, and 7 days of nice known ferment! I don't think I'll check the second recipe until it's closer to bottling. Just trying not to get overwhelmed in the beginning, keeping it fun and learning everything I can especially mistakes!

 

[SkeletorMob]

The gallon that got diluted to two, just got mixed back together today into a 3 gallon carboy with a new gallon of water with one pound of honey mixed in! Airlock Ed and bubbling away. I planned to a taste/adjustment this weekend before it ages out the ferment! This brings the ratio to just over 2lbs/gallon. Which will bring this mead down from a sweet dessert show mead, to hopefully a delicious dry show mead! This is also the batch that took a weird smell so hopefully it hasn't soured. Updates this weekend. Odin's Tears (recipe 2)is steadily bubbling away. I also have acquired a hydrometer and am awaiting proper instructions and personal how to as I could not procure a reading myself... derp..
Also my next check I want throw some money at this radical forum so I can show you some fruits of the labor! Fruits from some of your advice!!!

 

[SkeletorMob]

Okay so here's an update with thoughts on plans of action, would appreciate any input here!! So the new 3 gallon carboy, was once a dessert traditional now will be more towards dry at 2.2lb/gallon or so, has kicked off and stayed that way. The other recipe with the spices or "Odin's tears" I did not dilute so much. Only by one mason jar of water + the rehydrated k1v1116. It took off a little bit and then slowed drastically. Airlock burps at just under 30 seconds consitent. Here are my brainstormed plans:
1. I don't own a ph tester, hydrometer or a wine thief, so I am getting them tomorrow to run tests/tastes/adjustments this weekend.
2. I haven't run a nutrient schedule. So I am purchasing fermaidK also.
3. I believe it's the Sg halting the k1v1116 from starting, because (a) it kicked off the other batch no problem without any new nutrients and (b) because I ran 4 lbs to the gallon and wasn't aware of specific tests for fermentation management. So while 6lbs was obviously to much in the show mead, I thought "meh, 4 lbs to the gallon in this batch might just fare well" My first book was strictly wild and basic, so it made it seem like a hydrometer was for fancy pantsmen. Lol was I ever so wrong? (Yes) and unfortunately never tested anything!
4. If by chance the sg is in range after this weekends tests, wtf? Lol
The two options I've come up with are these:
Outcome: sg out of range;
Make a new 2-3 gallon must with the recipe and kick it off with the yeast cake and some liquid from this gallon along with a new packet of k1v1116
Outcome: sg in range;
Test ph level
If out of range; adjust and add fermaid
If in range;
Pull out 1/4 to 1/3 of the mix into a sterilized blender to aerate with fermaid k and mix back into the carboy airlock and pray.
If anyone gets a chance to read this, please let me know what you think of the game plan!! Do you feel like I'm missing a step or am I on track with this current trouble shoot procedure? Thanks brothers and sisters, I hope your day is most excellent!!!

 

[SkeletorMob]

Bueller? Lol running tests today, will post the outcome of results! Hopefully it will help someone, I'd like to think I'm not the only dumb@$$ here ipe:

 

[nitack]

Nah, I'm following, just nothing worthwhile to contribute at the moment

 

[SkeletorMob]

Alright friends here are the results and taste notes from tonight! It wasn't the nightmare I was dreading that's for sure! Now keep in mind this starts from an affinity to viking culture, the only bottle of mead I ever had came from a friend in denmark. I remember it was delicious but that was like 6 years ago so yea... I'm no taste master or connessuire of sorts so my notes are purely immature speculation.
At day 21 with all above stated updates:
Dessert show mead: 3 GAL @ SG 1.040, PH 3.6-4.0, Bubbles@12 secs, TASTE like a sweetish champagne bitter bite after smells like white wine cloudy to clear light Amber almost yellow color. Topped with one mason jar 3lbs:gal mix ratio
Odin's Tear's: 1 GALLON @ SG 1.082, PH 4.0, Bubbles@25 secs (this was the possible slow ferment), Taste first cinnamon pretty strong then smooth vanilla taste and then a spicy bite in the throat. Frigging tasty as hell I'd say but what do I know haha pretty clear with a small cloud in the glass very dark Amber color. Topped with the bare end of the mason jar used to top the 3 gallon mixed with water.

So there it is I couldn't find the nutrient I just bought for some damn reason so right now it's airlock Ed and set away again. Nobody gagged, probably won't be my favorite ever but it didn't turn out like crap for a very first home ferment!
I feel like I could stand to mix the gallon a new 3 gallon must of Odin's tears and try to kick it down a few more points. For the 3 gallon I think I should rack off soon.
What do you all think? Thanks in advance!

 

[SkeletorMob]

Also hydrometer showed a potential alcohol of 5% in the show mead but 10% in Odin's tears???

 

[SkeletorMob]

Today. Because I found my nutrient, I removed a mason jar from the one gallon Odin's tears added 1 teaspoon fermax aerated and replaced. For the three gallon I removed about half a blender head add 2 tsp fermax a rated and replaced. Got a good foam up in both and bubbles back up! Hopefully that will help nock it down a few more points through ferment. Pleasant smells and only small taste through the siphon, all similar to last week's testing! Will be checking sg again next week! Stay tuned!

 

[AdamBomb92]

I just started my mead brewing Wednesday. I used 3lbs of honey, one gallon of water, a whole organic navel orange, and half of a packet of yeast. It's bubbling and fermenting well as of this morning. Any tips, pointers, and recipes are all appreciated. I'm using a one gallon carboy for fermenting.

 

[SkeletorMob]

I just started my mead brewing Wednesday. I used 3lbs of honey, one gallon of water, a whole organic navel orange, and half of a packet of yeast. It's bubbling and fermenting well as of this morning. Any tips, pointers, and recipes are all appreciated. I'm using a one gallon carboy for fermenting.

That's awesome Adam, Sounds like you got a great strong start! Now you can leave it set for quite some time, in a dark cool area (60-75F), generally 2 or months. Temperature is important for a) to keep the yeast happy and b) to prevent a massive mess where ever you are keeping it! Take gravity readings with a hydrometer and monitering the pH with strips. I recommend two great books that will tell you everything you need to get started and then some, one is Ken Schramm's Compleat Mead Maker and Jereme Zimmerman's Make Mead like a Viking! You'll probably spend 40 bucks for the two of them! There are more than a few great beginning recipes in the viking book as well as it being really fun to read. I have a few recipes I've started posted as threads here as well! I'm in your boat too taking all the advice I can get! Just keep searching for threads and get involved with the the current threads and there is unsurmountable amounts of knowledge here!

 

[SkeletorMob]

Woohoo check out that cake at 36 days! This is the 3 gallon batch showing a small amount of clearing!

 

[AdamBomb92]

This was from Day 1. I've got 2.5 weeks to go. I'm aging it in my dad's wine fridge with complete temperature control. Keeping it at 65 and dark in there. I'll check it in the morning. I've been researching more online and hoping to eventually make my favourite flavour, Orange Dreamsicle. Once I get this done fermenting, I have another 1 gallon carboy for aging so I can clean this one out for batch #2. I've been saving my beer bottles and dad's wine bottles for bottling. I've even got friends saving their's for me.

 

[Lefou]

Woohoo check out that cake at 36 days! This is the 3 gallon batch showing a small amount of clearing!

Good picture. It looks exactly like my 3gal. melomel, but I waited almost two and a half months before decanting to secondary. As it progresses and clarifies, it will take on more of a golden color top to bottom.

I can almost see to read the printed letters of a book through mine right now. Speaking of books, I bought Schramm's book. There's nothing else like it on the market for meads with wine yeasts. I'm using ale yeasts instead, assuming a lower attenuation rate for sweetness, but got a surprise when my S-05 yeast ticked over a 91% attenuation rate to a 14% ABV ... that's touching the energy of a champagne yeast!

 

[SkeletorMob]

Good picture. It looks exactly like my 3gal. melomel, but I waited almost two and a half months before decanting to secondary. As it progresses and clarifies, it will take on more of a golden color top to bottom.

Awesome! Thanks for the reassurance and for sharing! I imagined waiting about as long as well before the decant! I worried about loss with the that giant yeast cake but I may just stabilize and then top off during the rack off.

I can almost see to read the printed letters of a book through mine right now. Speaking of books, I bought Schramm's book. There's nothing else like it on the market for meads with wine yeasts. I'm using ale yeasts instead, assuming a lower attenuation rate for sweetness, but got a surprise when my S-05 yeast ticked over a 91% attenuation rate to a 14% ABV ... that's touching the energy of a champagne yeast!

I can almost make out my hand from behind mine lol!
Word I read Zimmerman's book first and my lady got me Schramm's and it was perfect. Incredibly descriptive and definitely an excellent bridge from amatuer getting into advanced knowledge and techniques! I don't have any experience out side of k1v1116. But from what I've read in Schramm's you must have taken great care of that ale yeast!! Nice work dude! Keep a note on that must too they must have really enjoyed it!! Im about to give white labs San Diego super a go in a high gravity must I plan to prepare!
I wanted white labs high grav, but the lhbs didn't have it right then so I figured why not try one similar! Plus i live in San diego, so it seemed right lol

 

[SkeletorMob]

This was from Day 1. I've got 2.5 weeks to go. I'm aging it in my dad's wine fridge with complete temperature control. Keeping it at 65 and dark in there. I'll check it in the morning. I've been researching more online and hoping to eventually make my favourite flavour, Orange Dreamsicle. Once I get this done fermenting, I have another 1 gallon carboy for aging so I can clean this one out for batch #2. I've been saving my beer bottles and dad's wine bottles for bottling. I've even got friends saving their's for me.

Looks awesome Adam! Keep it up and stay disciplined!
Be careful with the bottles. If your mead ends up carbonated and it isn't in the proper glass it can explode! I usually see Belgian ale beer bottles and champagne bottles recommended the most. Sometimes even if you plan on a still mead they can become carbonated and active after bottling, I've read many a horror story!

 

[AdamBomb92]

I'm using Red Star Cuvee Yeast in a glass Carboy. No carbonation. I've got a reliable source for the brew. Just gotta let it age in another glass carboy and kill the fermentation in this one after 3 weeks. I forgot to take the OG, but it should turn out well for TexRenFest. I just want something nice for getting drunk with while I'm camping.

 

[Lefou]

While decanting my 3 gallon melomel to secondary, the yeast lees displaced less liquid than the suspended fruit and raisins. I debated on waiting for the fruit to drop or just moving to secondary when I noticed a mild clearing going on, but that decision didn't take long.

There was a bit of extra space in the secondary carboy when the fruit got removed, so I just topped the carboy off up to the neck with filtered water. It diluted the must and lowered the ABV a bit, but what's one percent when you already have fourteen? The less air the better. As long as the carboy has a snug airlock, I think it's fine.

 

[SkeletorMob]

Alright last week ran some tests. Been loaded up with house sitting the last 20 days. So although it gave me away time to let the mead do its thing, I'm also using this time as an experiment against similar emergency situations in which I can not forseeablly check in to do some thing. Now last week's testing yielded interesting results!
The "dessert" show mead:
G: 1.000, Fermented completely dry at or around day 42
Ph: 3.6-4.2.
No many flavors in this except for alcohol. Strong tastes of alcohol.
Racked into secondary. Beautiful orange color. Mostly clear. We'll see how this ages out. I'm thinking another 5 or so months will allow some of the honey flavors to come back. I shouldn't feel disappointed but kind of am. I'm hoping that the alcohol will tame with age because, well yea, the alcohol is overpowering the entire drink lol
Odin's Tears:
G: 1.010
Ph: 3.6
Can definitely feel the alcohol behind a beautiful array of flavor. Transition followed the same as last time(cinnamon, vanilla swallow, spiced dry finnish) but much less bold, I geuss I would describe the flavors as more blended rather than individual punches. Again I'm not a connessuire and my pallette is extremely immature. So I don't know exactly what I'm explains yet haha. But nevertheless still a very tasty beverage! It's been one week since these results and I wish to rack soon. It might be dry by now, but again experimenting with these time tables with the the k1v 1116 will provide me much knowledge for the future. I like the yeast. It's very aggressive though. Soon will be trying another less aggressive yeasts with similar recipes to see how they work compared to k1v1116. I need more carboys...... I'm in what I'll call a racking deficit....

 

[nitack]

The honey flavor will come back with time. I felt the same way when my first couple of batches came out very bland initially. I thought I had done something wrong, or didn't add enough to honey. I ended up adding more and more honey, chasing the flavor , and I was using EC-1118, so this turned into a war of escalation between me and the yeast. I won, they died, but the mead was so damn hot it wasn't any good for over a year and a half. Then the flavor came on. It was very good, but at 20% ABV this was a sipping wine, nothing you'd drink with dinner, or company.

 

[AdamBomb92]

Racked and clearing.

 

[AdamBomb92]

I've racked it and added potassium sorbate to kill the fermentation. I'm gonna filter it and rack it one more time then leave it to clear and age. Will I need to sweeten it in a few days? And how? I was suggested making a simple syrup (1 cup of sugar to one cup of water).

 

[SkeletorMob]

Potassium sorbate will only inhibit the yeast from reproducing. It will still continue to ferment available sugars in the liquid. But yes it does slow them down. Back sweetening will be up to your tastes. If you feel like it could be sweeter then you will want to! You could use sugar or honey to sweeten, but I don't have my book available for suggestions and I although I have racked into secondary I won't be sweetening as I want to establish "regularity" with the yeasts I'm using in attempt to be able to plan ferments to finish at the desired sweetness

 

[nitack]

I've racked it and added potassium sorbate to kill the fermentation. I'm gonna filter it and rack it one more time then leave it to clear and age. Will I need to sweeten it in a few days? And how? I was suggested making a simple syrup (1 cup of sugar to one cup of water).

If you are making mead then why sweeten with anything other than honey? Mead is about the flavor of the honey. More honey = more flavor.

 

[SkeletorMob]

Well tonight I racked the Odin's Tears recipe which had miraculously gone from murky to clear in a matter of 3 days this week! Gravity at 0.998!!! It went bone dry and tasted damn delicous! Kept the vanilla bean in for secondary, felt it would help wrangle the cinnamon a little more with age. The only thing it needs it some more tannin, it had a bit of a watery feel this taste. And probably because there are no sugars left in this one! I think a good oaking will match this vanilla-cinnamon-allspice wonder and solve that! It was such a warming drink, will be perfect for winter! Which I don't even experience in southern california. I'll have to drink a bottle in big bear for the real effect haha! All in all I'm getting really excited about brewing mead and extremely Thankful for everyone's guidance shared along the way! These batches could have gone wrong but instead I've got a helluva good brew! (To me lol)
The other traditional style recipe has been/will be sitting in secondary. It's on time out till it learns to mellow out