Extended run Keg to Tap.

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rgr331

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We are building a new home and don't really have a good place to put a Kegerator. I think the best option is actually up stairs above the bar. This results in approximately a 25 foot run and a 10 foot vertical drop from center keg to top of tap.

My questions:

1) What is the best way to cool/insulate this line. Just insulation, or run the line through chase loop which would be cooled & insulated via some sort of fan from the kegerator.

If we only insulate, the line will be in a 6" thick wall with foam insulation sprayed all around.

2) How does the 10 ft drop affect the psi needed to handle the 25 foot run. I intend to use a vinyl 1/4" ID line.
 
25 feet of 1/4" ID line needs active cooling, otherwise 8+ ounces of beer is sitting in the line(s) is going to get warmed up between pours, which isn't great for dispensing.

As for the drop, it's actually rather interesting what happens: you'll need a lot more of your 1/4" ID line - or use a short length of smaller ID line at the end as a "choker" to add enough restriction to make things work and allow a shorter length of 1/4" line.

Check out Mike Soltys' line length calculator and use "-10" for the drop. You'll also find you can't use 3/16" ID line at all as it won't reach...

https://www.mikesoltys.com/2012/09/17/determining-proper-hose-length-for-your-kegerator/

Cheers!
 
25 feet of 1/4" ID line needs active cooling, otherwise 8+ ounces of beer is sitting in the line(s) is going to get warmed up between pours, which isn't great for dispensing.

As for the drop, it's actually rather interesting what happens: you'll need a lot more of your 1/4" ID line - or use a short length of smaller ID line at the end as a "choker" to add enough restriction to make things work and allow a shorter length of 1/4" line.

Check out Mike Soltys' line length calculator and use "-10" for the drop. You'll also find you can't use 3/16" ID line at all as it won't reach...

https://www.mikesoltys.com/2012/09/17/determining-proper-hose-length-for-your-kegerator/

Cheers!
Thank you. Attached is what I came up with. 45 ft with a 2 ft 3/16" line at the end is certainly achievable.

As far as active cooling, what are the best options?

I was thinking a 2" ID chase with air from the kegerator actively directed down the chase. That chase would be surrounded by 3" foam insulation.

Also, what about some stand alone unit that pumps freon through a line coiled around the tube.

Im really just spitballing here, dont really have any idea on the options.
 

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Presumably you'd keep the chase length as short as possible and coil the excess tubing at the cold end, but even at 25 feet it's improbable that air cooling the chase would work. I air-cool my 6 faucet T-tower using a small fan driving chilly keezer air up through a 2 foot long 1" ID tube and there's still a 10°F differential at the faucets.

The classic solution is to build or buy a well insulated trunk line with a cooling loop inside, and use a small refrigerating cooler and recirculation pump made for that purpose - or make your own out of an AC unit with its evaporator submerged in a pumped reservoir, I suppose.

Cheers!
 
The classic solution is to build or buy a well insulated trunk line with a cooling loop inside, and use a small refrigerating cooler and recirculation pump made for that purpose
Most commonly called a "glycol chiller", yes?

(And, if not, searching that term brings up many results of that and some other examples.)
 
The only way a conduit would work is if you also built in a return path back AND use a blower fan that has a LOT of power. The way it's done in commercial installs is with a dedicated glycol chiller that is constantly recirculating coolant down the bundle and usually with purpose made shank chiller coils.

Due to variations in different tubing types and their associated pressure drops, I wouldn't rely on a calculator. I'd physically mock it up with a single line and see how it pours. Buying all the tubing and making the insulated trunk is no joke both time and money.

Given the cost of everything including the glycol unit, there's a really compelling reason to try to get your kegs closer.
 
On ^That note, there was a recent thread (among many) regarding DIY long runs and something that doesn't always come up early enough IMO is the suggestion to use EVABarrier from the get go.
BTW: Welcome to HBT! Here's an awkward question bluntly just to get it out of the way so we can best help you in the long run: How's your palate and do you notice the taste of plastic in beer? Do you notice the taste of oxydation in beer? Will you notice these things over time? Since you're new on here, we have no idea to your tastes or even if this is for homebrew or commercially bought kegs....either way many of us would recommend using EVABarrier as you beer-line from the start. Given the length, you'd wanna buy it by the roll which is usually available in 39' lengths, (though I believe I have recently seen it available in longer lengths). How many taps are you running? What size is your kegerator?...many kegerators or keezers have a hump and there are some posts on here in which users have put a water or glycol resevoir with a pump there for line/tower chilling purposes.
There's a lot of details that may or may not work for you over time, not the least of which is the expense and effort that go in to a long run beer tap...tell us more about what you have and what elements are most important to you.
Welcome to the Fun!
:mug:
 

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