English porter

[Jag75]

I have never brewed a porter. Ive read up a bit on them and trying to brew an English brown porter.

9# MO
1# Brown Malt
1# Crystal 45
1# Choc malt

Using East kent Golding hops at
60, 10 and 5 . Ibu approx 24

British Ale yeast , I think 005 .

Is the 1# of Brown , Crystal and Choc too much ? Its about 8% of grain bill each .

 

[Funky Frank]

You have made up the exact recipe from “brew your best” so I’d say you’re good.

 

[IslandLizard]

Crazy, yes, but I've never brewed an English Porter, only an American one, a Black Butte Clone.

005 seems to be a good choice for an English one.

 

[Bramling Cross]

Is the 1# of Brown , Crystal and Choc too much ? Its about 8% of grain bill each .

You have a solid, by the numbers porter and you're pretty much squarely in the the "reasonable brewers can reasonably disagree" area of the style spectrum. I think the brown malt will determine whether or not you like the recipe--it's a bit of a polarizing malt. Many folks (like me) love it and argue that you can't make a real UK porter without brown malt, others dislike it...some passionately hate it. The trick is to understand that brown malt doesn't like to be rushed, give it a solid month (two is better) of aging to allow the flavors to come together.

I would happily brew your recipe. It's going to make a great porter.

 

[Jag75]

Talked to my LHBS and they dont carry brown malt . He said they have coffee malt and to scale down a bit. Ive never tried brown or coffee malt .

 

[IslandLizard]

Talked to my LHBS and they dont carry brown malt . He said they have coffee malt and to scale down a bit. Ive never tried brown or coffee malt .

Brown Malt is not very commonly used here in the U.S. so availability can be sparse too. But they do sell "Coffee Malt, huh?" Is that a light/pale Chocolate Malt perhaps?
Here's some interesting reading about using that Coffee Malt:
https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=18228.0
I bought some Crisp Pale Chocolate Malt and Brown Malt at our group grain buy. Modern-day Brown Malt is quite assertive and definitely does NOT belong in a Brown Ale, as I found out, the hard way.

The Black Butte clone I brew uses 8 oz Crisp Pale Chocolate Malt (200-250°L), 8 oz Weyermann Chocolate Wheat (300-450°L) for the darker roasts. The Chocolate Wheat is rather soft and mellow, low astringency. I like the layering of the darker roasts, similarly to layering crystals malts in Ambers and such.

 

[McKnuckle]

I use Crisp brown malt in my porters and stouts. MoreBeer carries it. Also do your utmost to use English chocolate malts, as they taste different from the Briess products.

I use Crisp pale chocolate but also Simpson's regular chocolate at 600L. Northern Brewer has that one. It's a pain to have to shop around, but at least for me, the authentic ingredients are worth it.

I'm working on a small batch of the Fuller's Imperial Stout (scaled back) that was posted recently from their recipe books. That one takes brown, chocolate, treacle, and invert #3 among the more pedestrian ingredients - so a real scavenger hunt to make it happen!

 

[Jag75]

Thanks @McKnuckle for the info. I'm going to get stuff from my LHBS and the special grain from morebeer.

 

[wes_d]

Brewed plenty of English Porters this year. English ingredients and making sure mash pH is correct really puts the final touches on it.

My recipes are generally about the same as yours, give or take a percent here or there. I use Bairds C50/60 and Simpson's Chocolate. I've also gone 50/50 with that and Fawcett Pale Chocolate with no profound effect. I'm set to brew another this weekend. I've pulled back on the Simpsons to 4.5oz and am breaking my 'English ingredients' rule a tad- I'm filling out the Chocolate role with Chocolate wheat which is really known for mostly providing flavor and aroma. I'm hoping to steer this the rest of the way toward Fullers.

I've found I prefer mostly to 100% Fuggles in this style, but that's a preference. I've successfully used Target and EKG and would use them in a heartbeat if I were out of Fuggles.

005 is a good yeast. I've used 002, 005, and 013. I think the 002 has been really good, but no complaints about 005- it's just that I can usually find 002 at the LHBS more often and now I'm used to it's behavior.

 

[McKnuckle]

The porter-to-stout continuum is such a diverse set of styles, and with all the specialty malts and adjuncts out there, the canvas is wide open for the brewer's brush.

I have made 3 this fall/winter already, but only one has been consumed. The others are conditioning and fermenting, respectively. I hope to share recipes if they come out as good as I'm hoping. One is a brown porter and the other is the aforementioned Fuller's imperial stout (lower OG version). I cooked up a pound of invert #3 and I'm excited to taste the finished beers made with it.

I am using WY1469 Yorkshire ale with all of them, to nail down a fermentation schedule for that yeast.

 

[kmarkstevens]

You have a solid, by the numbers porter and you're pretty much squarely in the the "reasonable brewers can reasonably disagree" area of the style spectrum. I think the brown malt will determine whether or not you like the recipe--it's a bit of a polarizing malt. Many folks (like me) love it and argue that you can't make a real UK porter without brown malt, others dislike it...some passionately hate it. The trick is to understand that brown malt doesn't like to be rushed, give it a solid month (two is better) of aging to allow the flavors to come together.

Brewing minds can disagree. Personally, I think brown malt tastes like ass. Both in my homebrew and brands such as Samuel Smith Taddy Porter. The taste simply does not work for me

You've got a pound each of brown malt AND chocolate malt. Whilst it will change the end product, one can substitute any of these for brown malt in a recipe: amber, flaked barley, chocolate, invert #3, black patent, victory, etc. (probably the coffee malt as well)

Personally, I really like the London Porter Clone found in BYO. Admittedly, BYO is an american magazine, but I like the results a lot: 5 British Ale Clone Recipes - Brew Your Own (byo.com) It is a different take on Porter with a mix of chocolate, black patent and roasted barley. As an American who first assisted in a homebrew in 1980, stereotype/style delineation is/was: American Porter is exclusively black patent (I still like Papazian's original sparrow hawk porter decades later), Stout is roasted barley and never the twain shall meet.

London Porter Clone Ingredients
9 lb. 12 oz. (4.4 kg) British 2-row pale ale malt
14 oz. (0.40 kg) crystal malt (60 °L)
7.0 oz. (0.20 kg) chocolate malt
7.0 oz. (0.20 kg) black patent malt
4.0 oz. (0.11 kg) roasted barley (500 °L)
8.5 AAU Kent Goldings hops (60 mins) (1.7 oz./48 g of 5% alpha acids)
1.25 AAU Kent Goldings hops (15 mins) (0.25 oz./7 g of 5% alpha acids)
0.25 oz. (7 g) Kent Goldings (5 mins)
0.25 oz. (7 g) Kent Goldings (0 mins)
1 tsp. Irish moss (15 mins)
Wyeast 1968 (London ESB) or White Labs WLP002 (English Ale) yeast (1.5 qt./~1.5 L yeast starter)
0.75 cups corn sugar (for priming)

Step by Step
Use moderate to highly-carbonate rich water (75–125 ppm). Mash grains for 60 minutes at 156 °F (59 °C). Collect 6.5 gallons (25 L) of wort. Boil wort for 90 minutes. Ferment at 70 °F (21 °C).

@McKnuckle I also like the WY1469 West Yorkshire (not to be confused with POF+ abomination that is WLP Yorkshire Squares. These are not the same yeast.)

I prefer Pub to WLP002. I brew a lot with vault strain WLP085, which is WLP002 and widely believed to be WLP005 or WLP006 (White Labs won't 'fes up to what makes up the blend). I will do a yeast off this winter between WLP002, Pub and WLP085.

 

[McKnuckle]

Another point of comparison is the Fuller's Imperial Porter recipe that was recently posted by the brewers themselves on Twitter, and analyzed here in a cool thread.

Here are the fermentable percentages:

64.8% pale ale malt
11.6% glucose
11.1% crystal light (probably 45-60L)
7.9% brown malt
1.4% chocolate
2.3% treacle
0.9% invert #1

The regular porter is described there, too.

 

[DBhomebrew]

I have never brewed a porter. Ive read up a bit on them and trying to brew an English brown porter.

9# MO
1# Brown Malt
1# Crystal 45
1# Choc malt

Using East kent Golding hops at
60, 10 and 5 . Ibu approx 24

British Ale yeast , I think 005 .

Is the 1# of Brown , Crystal and Choc too much ? Its about 8% of grain bill each .

I'm just about done drinking a batch of the smoked version of this porter. Absolutely delicious, I'll definitely rebrew. Recipe is super close to yours.

https://beerandbrewing.com/pliers-porter-recipe/

 

[bwible]

Talked to my LHBS and they dont carry brown malt . He said they have coffee malt and to scale down a bit. Ive never tried brown or coffee malt .

I remember reading years ago how “brown malt” was somewhat of an enigma refrenced in old recipes and it was something that did not exist today. Also referred to in old recipes as blown malt. Magazines like BYO would give articles on how to make your own at home because it was something you could not buy. At least here in the US. Not sure when companies started making it.

 

[Jag75]

I dont like venturing away from my lhbs but I wanted to be as English as I could. I ended up ordering crisp brown and Simpsons chocolate malt from Northernbrewer , getting the rest locally. Hopefully it comes in quick.

 

[McKnuckle]

Sounds good! My last Northern Brewer order took 10 days to arrive when I recently ordered. We're all spoiled by Amazon, but geez. Well, patience is a key skill in our hobby.

 

[monkeymath]

Looks pretty solid to me. What OG are you targeting?

I'm just putting together the recipe for a rye porter/stout/whatever that I'm going to brew on sunday. It's not decidedly English, but at least terms of yeast (finally giving WY1469 a try, I'm really curious!) and hops (Bramling Cross, love that stuff).

My grainbill is a tad overcomplicated (7 grains), in particular when compared to yours, but for a rich (OG around 1.060) porter/stout/whatever, I do allow myself the indulgence.

 

[IslandLizard]

I dont like venturing away from my lhbs but I wanted to be as English as I could. I ended up ordering crisp brown and Simpsons chocolate malt from Northernbrewer , getting the rest locally. Hopefully it comes in quick.

So NB is still good for those, huh?

My first goto LHBS doesn't have a malt selection that wide and deep either, still they have 30-40 malts on hand, and also sell whole sacks at a reasonable price. Anything can be ordered, alas you buy the whole sack.
Now the 2nd LHBS makes up for that, they got a huge malt inventory. At least used to, haven't been there in nearly 2 years.

We can get a lot of those English malts through our group grain buy, as well as torrified wheat, which is always a big hit. I'm always good for a sack of Golden Promise, MO, and such. We organize splits since no-one needs 55# of brown malt, chocolate malt, etc. Sadly the # of participants in the group buy has been shrinking over the years as has our order frequency.
It also gets harder to split sacks without someone getting stuck with 10-15# of a variety of non-base malts. <uhm>

 

[IslandLizard]

(Bramling Cross, love that stuff)

Me too, hands down my favorite British hop! You're a lucky man!
We don't see much Bramling Cross here, Stateside, anymore, but it does pop up occasionally.

 

[Jag75]

Looks pretty solid to me. What OG are you targeting?

I'm just putting together the recipe for a rye porter/stout/whatever that I'm going to brew on sunday. It's not decidedly English, but at least terms of yeast (finally giving WY1469 a try, I'm really curious!) and hops (Bramling Cross, love that stuff).

My grainbill is a tad overcomplicated (7 grains), in particular when compared to yours, but for a rich (OG around 1.060) porter/stout/whatever, I do allow myself the indulgence.

1.058 expected OG

 

[kevin58]

One of the best porters I've made is a recipe from 1880 and was brewed by Whitbread brewery in London. It is not much different than yours but without the crystal and chocolate. In place of those two it has black malt... 81% pale malt - 13% brown malt - 6% black malt. I have used that as the base for all of my porters since.

The recipe comes from Ron Pattinson's book, The Homebrewers Guide to Vintage Beer.

 

[McKnuckle]

^ I have that book, too. It's quite a revelation by modern recipe standards. It really shows the way brewing evolved in England in terms of the basic ingredients. At one point, long ago, all malt was brown! And there's some kind of sugar in nearly everything.

I have to get back to some of those recipes... I did brew one porter as well, and I remember it had something like 40% brown malt! This was long before I knew how to adjust my water, so I would love to brew it again today. I just remember coffee...

 

[kmarkstevens]

I have Ron Pattinson's book, The Homebrewers Guide to Vintage Beer as well. A really good overview with a lot of good recipes spanning the decades, nay, centuries of English beer.

One of the downsides of covid was that Ron was going to do a talk at Machine House Brewery in Seattle in May. Machine House is run by an English brewer, has beer engines, and a Mild that is to die for. Hopefully by 2022 Ron will be able to keep that gig.

 

[Hanglow]

Porter for me absolutely must have brown malt, it is integral to the flavour imo. Not saying that is the only way though!

I have a Fullers london porter downstairs, when is it acceptable to open on xmas day?

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Another point of comparison is the Fuller's Imperial Porter recipe that was recently posted by the brewers themselves on Twitter, and analyzed here in a cool thread...The regular porter is described there, too.

The regular Fuller's porter on cask is pretty much the benchmark for modern British porter IMO - 75% pale, 14% UK light crystal, 10% brown, 1.5% UK chocolate, 5.4% ABV, 37 IBU of 100% Fuggles, Fuller's yeast.

If I was starting out with British porters, then that's where I'd start. The imperial version is cute but not particularly relevant.

Brown malt is essential as the defining ingredient of London porters.

I remember reading years ago how “brown malt” was somewhat of an enigma refrenced in old recipes and it was something that did not exist today. Also referred to in old recipes as blown malt. Magazines like BYO would give articles on how to make your own at home because it was something you could not buy. At least here in the US. Not sure when companies started making it.

It never went away, more a factor of more international trade making it easier for US retailers to stock it.

One of the best porters I've made is a recipe from 1880 and was brewed by Whitbread brewery in London. It is not much different than yours but without the crystal and chocolate. In place of those two it has black malt... 81% pale malt - 13% brown malt - 6% black malt. I have used that as the base for all of my porters since.

Can't knock those mid-19th century versions either, they do need a little more time to come round IMO - but can be a great basis for a blend of 2:1 young and Bretted versions of the same beer.

^ I have that book, too. It's quite a revelation by modern recipe standards. It really shows the way brewing evolved in England in terms of the basic ingredients. At one point, long ago, all malt was brown! And there's some kind of sugar in nearly everything.

Those 18th-century versions were made with diastatic brown malt though, which is a different thing.

Porter for me absolutely must have brown malt, it is integral to the flavour imo. Not saying that is the only way though!

I have a Fullers london porter downstairs, when is it acceptable to open on xmas day?

The good thing about doing virtual church on Christmas Day was that we had to have a bottle of wine open for communion by about 10.15. And since I got to choose, it ended up being champagne....

 

[KeizerBrewr]

Not speaking much about the grain bill/hop schedule, but the yeast is an excellent choice!

 

[Jag75]

Man I'm bummed out. Everything going smoothly with this brew . Hit the boil and I forgot to take out the hops and prep them like I normally do. I frantically was searching the freezer and grabbed them. Dumped in 1 oz . Then thought to myself , why do I have 3 oz ??? Looked at the package and noticed it was Azacca!!!

I quickly grabbed a strainer and scooped out the hoppy sludge . It wasn't in very long but I'm hoping its all good . I then tossed in the right hops . I put in a tad less the I was supposed to .

Oh well , we will see how this turns out .

 

[KeizerBrewr]

I'm sure it will come out just fine! It might have been a happy accident.

 

[Jag75]

I'm sure it will come out just fine! It might have been a happy accident.

I'm really hoping so . This is for a comp as well. I'm hoping that the Azacca didn't impart too much since I scooped out quickly