English Barleywine help

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motobrewer

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I've never brewed a barleywine and was wondering if this is something that'd work.

Note, this is a 3 gallon batch (5gal mash tun...) at 65% eff. i usually get around 70% but i'm assuming some loss from a completely full tun.

11.00 lb 2-row
01.50 lb munich
00.50 lb c120

mash at 149? for....60? 75? 90? not sure

2.00oz US goldings at 60 (4.5% AA)
1.00oz Williamette at 30 (4.8% AA)
0.50oz Williamette at 15 (4.8% AA)

WY1098 British Ale

1.100, 75 IBU tinseth

thanks for your input.
 

Beernip

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I think that it looks good. The IBU's are a little high for an English Barleywine 40-70 range. I'd still think it would taste great. I'd mash for 75 but that is just me.
 

GuldTuborg

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Looks like a good recipe. Mash for at least 90 min, I'd say, and then boil for 120 or even more if you want.

I tend to slightly overhop my beers I intend to age, as I know they'll lose bitterness and hop character over time. 75IBU is well within the range of good hopping levels, whatever the silly charts say. It will be a little bitter at first, but will age gracefully. Make sure to aerate well, pitch enough yeast, and give this time. A month or to in the primary before transferring for bulk aging (if you choose to do that) for a few more months would not be out of the question.
 
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motobrewer

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yeah i was overshooting the IBU's to allow for aging.

why 120 minute boil? is it just for mallard/melanoidin development or something else?

mash temp ok?
 

944play

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Make sure that 2-row is a pale ale malt, preferably one from Blighty....

If I were you, I'd make the biggest batch possible. No shame in a partial mash. You want to age that puppy for a few moons, so you will do well to have plenty of it around to take samples of when it's cold out.
 

mithion

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I might add just a touch more caramel character if it were me. Considering you have a strong attenuating yeast (which has a bit of a tart character) and that barleywines are supposed to be hugely malty, i'd go with an extra .25lbs of crystal 120. But maybe i'm being nit picky. Otherwise the rest looks good. I love the use of some munich.
 

GuldTuborg

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Make sure that 2-row is a pale ale malt, preferably one from Blighty....
Agreed, a darker kilned English malt is to be preferred. I was hoping it would be assumed in an English barleywine, but it sure doesn't hurt to specify.

Most experienced brewers will state that a big beer requires big and long everything, boil included. Most seem to suggest at least a 2 hour boil. Flavors do develop over that long boil that you wouldn't get otherwise. I've only made a few "big" beers, say, over 1.080, but I've always followed these suggestions and have always met with success. The choice is yours, naturally, but I'd at least look into the issue a bit if you're worried about the long boil.

Use as much dark crystal as you like. A pound wouldn't be too crazy in a beer like this, but more might leave you with a very big, sweet beer. If that's what you want, fantastic. If you want something a bit more balanced, I'd stay in the .5-1lb range. A long boil will net you some of the flavors and textures of a dark crystal anyway.

Mash temp should be fine. In a beer like this, 149 should net you a pretty balanced FG and taste. More crystal malt will offset this, naturally. If you want a big, full bodied taste, up the crystal a bit or the mash temp a degree or two, but not both (unless you want a really big beer). There are a million variables; just try to imagine what you want it to be like, and then make adjustments accordingly.
 

14thstreet

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Looks good moto. If you want to go with a bigger batch or fear your efficiency will suffer more than you think, I've heard you can use extract for up to 50% of your fermentables and not notice much if any difference if using all grain in a beer this big. Best of luck!
 
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motobrewer

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i'm worried about doing a partial because my previous partials/extract beers had a certain "twang"...

what would you use, Light DME? Liquid?
 

mithion

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I would use DME. I've done this before myself and I can second that the results were fantastic even though it wasn't "all-grain". I also think the extract twang probably comes from LME which has gone stale. DME has a much better shelf life and is less likely to produce any off flavors. Normally, DME has the worse flavor profile (from the point of view of freshness of taste) due to the increase processing the wort undergoes to produce it, but in a big beer like that, it won't make any difference because you're using a lot of grains.
 

Bobby_M

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FFIW, my Maris Otter/EKG SMASH English BW always scored over 40 in comps. IOW, barleywines don't need big caramel malt additions to be sweet and malty. On the contrary, it's hard enough to get a huge beer like this to dry out enough. Add a pound of table sugar while you're at it.
 

Jack

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I was going to start my own barleywine thread, but I saw this one which answered some of my questions. I got married on 7/31 and want to brew a barleywine to drink on anniversaries and family gatherings.

I was thinking about doing the primary fermentation on the yeast bed from a different batch. I would assume that I wouldn't want anything too dark or hoppy, and obviously the same style of yeast as I want for my barleywine. Would the yeast left-over from a mild be appropriate?

Also, any advice in terms of yeast? I'm currently weighing the pros and cons of the following four yeasts:
Wyeast 1028 London ale
pro - classic flavor profile, love this yeast in other beers
con - tops out at 10%

Wyeast 1098 British ale
pro - classic flavor profile
con - tops out at 10%

Wyeast 1728 Scottish ale
pro - tops out at 12%, probably drier flavor profile
con - yeast contribution might be a little off

Wyeast 1388 Belgian strong ale
pro - tops out at 13%, probably drier flavor profile
con - yeast contribution not appropriate to barleywine (could be interesting though?)

As you can tell, one of my big concerns is not ending up with something that's unbearably sweet (already planning a low mash temp and thinking about using a sugar addition, based upon comment above). One of my friends suggested that I ferment with 1028 and then add 1728 when primary fermentation is almost complete. Would that work?
 

GuldTuborg

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Those strains will all make good beer, but here are a few things to consider:

1028, while a great strain (one of my favorites), tends to make a slightly edgey beer which may be harsh in a monster like this. Consider it if you know you like this characteristic, but I might avoid it if you're uncertain.

1728 would be fine from a flavor standpoint, works great at a variety of temps, and handles big beers with ease, but you'll need to spend some time rousing it towards the end of fermentation to make sure it attenutaes the way you want it to.

If you want a slight Belgian character, I'd go with the 1762 instead. It's still great for high gravity worts and isn't bothered much by alcohol, and it's got much more of an "English" character, especially if you keep the temp around 65-70F. It will also give you fantastic attenuation before settling out nicely for a clear beer.

All of these are fine choices. I didn't mention 1098 only because I have had no experience with it.
 
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