# electric hlt

### Help Support Homebrew Talk:

#### pen25

##### Well-Known Member
I am planning an electric hlt using a 5 gallon coleman cooler. how long would it take for 70* water to say 180 with a 2kw 110volt element? i have looked and i had seen several calculations but i cant get my head around the actual #'s

i can do 220 but if i can get away with a 110 and it take a little longer im ok.

say i want to do the creme of 3 crops and do the 10 gallon batch. i am thinking it should be fine in my 48qt cooler im going to convert to a mash tun.

since its 17 lbs of grain i figure 1.5qt a lb of strike water for 6.5 gallon of water. mash for 90 min. then use the 5 gallon e-hlt to heat the sparge water.

would this 2kw element allow me to be able to bring up to temp the water in that 90 min?

OP

#### pen25

##### Well-Known Member
awesome. thank you very much

#### The Pol

##### Well-Known Member
No one mentioned this, so I will. How is a 5 gallon cooler going to hold enough sparge water for a 10 gallon batch??? You will have 6.38 gallons in the MASH, the grain ABSORBS 2.0 gallons... so you need another 6.75 gallons to brew a 10 gallon batch, if you ONLY boil off 1 gallon.

YOU NEED to mash in at 2qt/pound... that is 8.5 gallons and 9.86 gallons of MASH. THEN you will still need 4.5 gallons of sparge water.... which I will tell you is NOT much considering you are sparging 17 POUNDS of grain.

I used to brew in 5 gallon coolers.

My 5 gallon HLT was small...

Id consider getting a 10 gallon cooler or so and converting it. 5 gallons is pretty darned tight. And if you are going to the trouble of making it electric, might as well make it user friendly IMHO

You can heat 5 gallons, with 2000W, from 70-170 in 40 minutes flat. But how is a 5 gallon cooler going to work on a 10 gallon batch??

OP

#### pen25

##### Well-Known Member
No one mentioned this, so I will. How is a 5 gallon cooler going to hold enough sparge water for a 10 gallon batch??? You will have 6.38 gallons in the MASH, the grain ABSORBS 2.0 gallons... so you need another 6.75 gallons to brew a 10 gallon batch, if you ONLY boil off 1 gallon.

YOU NEED to mash in at 2qt/pound... that is 8.5 gallons and 9.86 gallons of MASH. THEN you will still need 4.5 gallons of sparge water.... which I will tell you is NOT much considering you are sparging 17 POUNDS of grain.

I used to brew in 5 gallon coolers.

My 5 gallon HLT was small...

Id consider getting a 10 gallon cooler or so and converting it. 5 gallons is pretty darned tight. And if you are going to the trouble of making it electric, might as well make it user friendly IMHO

You can heat 5 gallons, with 2000W, from 70-170 in 40 minutes flat. But how is a 5 gallon cooler going to work on a 10 gallon batch??
this is why i love the site. well looks like the 5 gallon cooler is going to have to just pull duty as a cooler for the summer
and ill just have to go buy a 10 gallon cooler and consider upping the wattage. guess i have to brew on the side of the hosue close to the garage outlet ;-) thx Pol

#### wilserbrewer

##### BIAB Expert Tailor
...ill just have to go buy a 10 gallon cooler and consider upping the wattage. guess i have to brew on the side of the hosue close to the garage outlet ;-) thx Pol
2000w will power a 10 gal HLT. Sure it won't heat as fast as a larger element, but if you plan ahead, you can use that time for other things. More power is fine, but not required IMO.

#### The Pol

##### Well-Known Member
2000w will power a 10 gal HLT. Sure it won't heat as fast as a larger element, but if you plan ahead, you can use that time for other things. More power is fine, but not required IMO.
+1

Save the hassle... get a 120VAC 2000W element and use it. It will give you 1.3F/minute rise with 10 gallons in the HLT. So, you are looking at 77 minutes to heat that water. NOT BAD, and it will save you from running 240VAC and messing with how to control it.

OP

#### pen25

##### Well-Known Member
thx guys makes sense.

#### IrregularPulse

##### Hobby Collector
So lets run this scenario.
10G batch
total water need ~15G
start heating 10G to 180. drain off 6G to mash at ~1.25q/lb for a 19lb grain bill
We now have 4 Gallon left in HLT at 180. Now we add our remaining 5G of water at room temp to the 4G left in the hlt at 180* to give us the rest of our sparge water to get ~13G into the BK assuming 2G loss to mash.
How long will it take the remaining 5G at room temp added to the 4G at 180 to come back up to 180*? Don't need exact numbers just basically a "Yes or No", will it be less than 60 minutes with a 120Vac 2200w element? If yes then I won't mess with a 220Vac line for just an eHlt. Maybe if I ever go to an eBK in the future. It'd be nce to stay 110 off a normal breaker if it's not going to cause much trouble and time wasted. I'd like to bring my brew days down to 4-4.5 hours instead of the current 6 (no dedicated HLT)

#### The Pol

##### Well-Known Member
So lets run this scenario.
10G batch
total water need ~15G
start heating 10G to 180. drain off 6G to mash at ~1.25q/lb for a 19lb grain bill
We now have 4 Gallon left in HLT at 180. Now we add our remaining 5G of water to bring us up to the rest of our sparge water to get ~13G into the BK assuming 2G loss to mash.
How long will it take the remaining 5G at room temp added to the 4G at180 to come back up to 180*? Don't need exact numbers just basically a Yes or no will it be less than 60 minutes with a 120Vac element? If yes that I won't mess with a 220 line for just an eHlt.
This is what my software calculates for my HERMS... I can get you exact #s... hang on.

#### The Pol

##### Well-Known Member
You will have 9 gallons at 119F if the water you added was 70F

It will take you 43 minutes with 2000W to get from 119F to 180F with a volume of 9 gallons.

#### IrregularPulse

##### Hobby Collector
Doesn't get better than that. Looks like I'll go with the 120V eHLT. Brewing 10G this weekend, 20G in a few weeks, then I'm stopping until I get this thing built. Just can't find the 10G Rubbermaids on sale anywhere. Or even regular price locally.

#### wilserbrewer

##### BIAB Expert Tailor
Something to consider, that I haven't done but would like to do...perhaps even w/ a smaller element, put the electric hlt on a simple appliance timer, and the strike water will be ready and waiting for you at strike time.

A simple cheap timer will handle 1500w, i believe? 2000w or 20 amps is not so easy or readily accessible???

#### IrregularPulse

##### Hobby Collector
You could could the timer off a relay if you wanted.
But most likely I'll fill my cooler the night before and set the temp, then when I wake up on brew day, walk out turn the element on, then go back inside to wake up and get everything else ready. I figure doing this by the time I've made coffee and eaten cereal, it'll be time to mash in. I'm so excited about cutting my brew day times down. I'll especially be excited after these next 3 10G batches with not HLT.

#### LooyvilleLarry

##### Well-Known Member
Yeah, I have a larger element ( ) but I turn it on, get a cup of coffee, crush my grain, and it's about ready. Someday I'll figure out how close I can get on my strike water and save time.

Right now, I strike @ Mash + 10-15*, and spend time waiting for it to cool down to mash in.

#### IrregularPulse

##### Hobby Collector
Yeah, I have a larger element ( ) but I turn it on, get a cup of coffee, crush my grain, and it's about ready. Someday I'll figure out how close I can get on my strike water and save time.

Right now, I strike @ Mash + 10-15*, and spend time waiting for it to cool down to mash in.
So you don't have a temp control on the element? This is my main reason for going electric. I hate waiting for it to heat up, then realize I over shot, then over cooled, blah blah blah.

#### The Pol

##### Well-Known Member
So you don't have a temp control on the element? This is my main reason for going electric. I hate waiting for it to heat up, then realize I over shot, then over cooled, blah blah blah.
No no, you mis-understood.

He has a temp controller on the HLT, what he is saying is that on the Brew Beast v2.0 we pump STRIKE + 10F into the MLT, then it it takes TIME, 10-20 minutes to cool to STRIKE temp and pre-heat the tun. He is saying once he determines HOW LONG this takes, he can then make that assumption and not waste time monitoring it.

#### leboeuf

##### Well-Known Member
Just a quick add on the appliance timer: This would work for turning the element on, but it would eat the switch if you tried to turn it off while the element was at full bore. Regular timers have the ability to switch off an amp or 2 (maybe 3) at 120v. That whole i=Cdv/dt thing has killed more than it's fair share of people over the years....

#### IrregularPulse

##### Hobby Collector
No no, you mis-understood.

He has a temp controller on the HLT, what he is saying is that on the Brew Beast v2.0 we pump STRIKE + 10F into the MLT, then it it takes TIME, 10-20 minutes to cool to STRIKE temp and pre-heat the tun. He is saying once he determines HOW LONG this takes, he can then make that assumption and not waste time monitoring it.
Gotchya

Just a quick add on the appliance timer: This would work for turning the element on, but it would eat the switch if you tried to turn it off while the element was at full bore. Regular timers have the ability to switch off an amp or 2 (maybe 3) at 120v. That whole i=Cdv/dt thing has killed more than it's fair share of people over the years....
Couldn't you just have the timer turn on/off a relay that then powered the element?

#### leboeuf

##### Well-Known Member
Well it says it can switch 15A, so you would be pushing the limits of the system, but it would probably work for your uses.
Edit: On second thought, I can't find anything that states what it's switching capabilities are.... the 1800 watt capacity is just an average. The unit probably has the diode mentioned below to handle the switching voltage spike... probably....

The relay would have the same issue. However you could connect a diode to eat the switching voltage spike; this is how it's done on many industrial applications.

OP

#### pen25

##### Well-Known Member
lowes has a timer that can handle 120v 20amp for around 60 bucks. its in the lighting section.