Edelweiß - Recipe from Brooklyn Brew Shop - Tips and Advice

[shellsbells]

I actually haven't tried it yet, TasunkaWitko. I bottled it 10 days ago and was going to sample it tonight, but forgot to toss one in the fridge last night
Thanks for the reminder though; I'm gonna chill one now and have a taste tomorrow. I'll keep you posted

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Sounds good - I'm looking forward to it and hope you enjoy it!

 

[shellsbells]

Sounds good - I'm looking forward to it and hope you enjoy it!

I tried the first bottle tonight, and was pretty impressed overall. It was well carbed with about an inch of nice, fluffy head. It smelled delicious, lots of banana & bubble gum and something I can't put my finger on. Those aromas came through in the flavour, as well. The only down side was it also had a pronounced alcohol flavour. Not an undrinkable, jet-fuel alcohol flavour, but enough that it was noticeable. I'm hoping that in time (another week or two) the flavours meld and soften a bit, but either way I'm still pretty happy with it. I definitely plan on re-brewing this one, following the recipe as written

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Hey, @shellsbells -

I caught this reply over the weekend, but was up to my ears in things going on. Glad that you liked it, over-all!

Sorry to hear about the pronounced alcohol flavor. This is something I did not notice with mine, so I am not sure what the cause for it would be. If you don't mind, let me know what your results are with your next batch; maybe we can figure it out. The only different factor that I can think of is the possible factor of the extended fermentation, but I don't know if this would actually be the cause or not.

Keep with it!

Ron

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Looking at the calendar, I decided to bump this one up, in case anyone might be interested in trying it.

For myself, I'm looking forward to brewing a spring batch, soon.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

I'm set to brew this one again tonight or tomorrow; wish me luck!

I've decided to give the Kazbek hop a try this go-round, using a schedule that will amount to about the same IBUs. I could be wrong, but I think that the Kazbek will provide what I was kinda-sorta looking for with this recipe: a noble touch that still has those floral, slightly-citrusy notes.

I want to stress that the recipe is absolutely beautiful as-is, with the original Centennial and Amarillo hops. They work great together and seem to really add what I call an "alpine" touch to this beer, but curiosity is getting the better of me with this, and I think that the Kazbek is at least worth a try.

With the grains, everything will be the same; I briefly considered adding a bit more of that lovely, addicting Melanoidin, but ultimately decided not to do so, due to the delicate timing involved with this beer's fermentation. I wouldn't want to do anything that might inadvertently throw that crucial schedule off, resulting in an over- or under-carbed final product.

I'm not 100% sure, but I might actually have enough to make two (1-gallon) batches of this beer; this Edelweiß is so good that I wouldn't mind having 2 gallons on hand, or 5...or 10.... I will take a closer look at my inventory and - if I do have enough - I will brew one with the Kazbek substitution and the other with the Centennial and Amarillo hops, as written.

If anyone has tried this or plans to try this, please feel free to jump into the conversation. I'm a fan, and I'd like to spread this one around.

More as it happens, etc. & c....

Ron

PS - @shellsbells - did this one ever smooth out for you? Update, please!

 

[Kawahomebrew]

Just made this beer and wanted to say thanks for the detailed thread here. Turned out really nice - softly carbonated, fresh spring taste, really easy drinker. I used the White Labs Hefeweizen yeast and made a two gallon batch. Bottled after three days - closer to 78 hours in the fermenter. Used swing-top bottles and so far no bottle bombs. Also bottled one in a plastic bottle so I could make sure it was carbonating.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Just made this beer and wanted to say thanks for the detailed thread here. Turned out really nice - softly carbonated, fresh spring taste, really easy drinker. I used the White Labs Hefeweizen yeast and made a two gallon batch. Bottled after three days - closer to 78 hours in the fermenter. Used swing-top bottles and so far no bottle bombs. Also bottled one in a plastic bottle so I could make sure it was carbonating.

Hi, Kawahomebrew - thanks for taking a moment to add your experience to this thread. In many ways, this is probably my favourite beer so far, and I'm really looking forward to brewing it again. It really is very much to my liking.

I had Lent services last night, and a book discussion afterwards, so I wasn't able to do the brewing I planned to do; however, I should be able to do so tonight. I am pretty sure that I have enough of all of my grains to make a double batch, so that is the plan. One will be with the Kazbek hop, and the other will probably be as-written, so I can compare them.

If you happen to get a photo, please post one. I intended to last time, but forgot. I most certainly will with this new batch, though!

 

[TasunkaWitko]

For those interested, here's a profile of the Kazbek hop:

https://bsgcraftbrewing.com/hop-profile-kazbek

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Updated label for this beer:

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Question for anyone who might be reading:

I really like the water that I brew with, and all my beers with it have been great, with absolutely no complaints. I like many, many styles of beer, but the simple fact is that wheat beers in general, and hefeweizens in partifular, are the ones that I find that I truly love - which makes them potentially worth a little extra effort.

I had been meaning to look into "playing" with my water a bit, but never seem to find a good time to jump into it. Anyway, (here are the stats on the water that I use); are there any opinions about these stats vis a vis hefeweizens?

Also, other than a home-brewing shop or website, would you be able to suggest where any of the necessary additives might be available on short notice? I "think" I've seen Calcium Chloride in the pharmacy section at the local Pick-Your-Mart, but I could be wrong, and those might not be suitable for brewing anyway.... This might also be the case for other additives.

It's too late for this batch, but if such additions might result in a "better" hefeweizen in the future, I'll sure consider them.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions -

Ron

 

[TasunkaWitko]

As it turns out, I only have enough wheat to brew one batch, so that's what I'm brewing. I'm halfway through the mash now, with no real complications. My temperature was a little high for the first 10 minutes, but it looks like all is good, now.

I plugged some numbers in for the Kazbek hops (at 4.1% AAs) and came up with a hops schedule that gives just a hair over 11 IBUs, as in the original recipe. 2 grams for each addition, added at 60, 30 and 2 minutes, does the trick.

Aside from the early temperature glitch, I think we're doing good. More as it happens, etc. & c....

Ron

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Alrighty, as mentioned above, I brewed my second batch of Edelweiss on 23 March 2017; the timing worked out so that I should bottle this just a couple of minutes after midnight as 26 March becomes 27 March.

The only real glitch with this brew was the mash temperatures. They were a little high for the first 10 minutes, but over the rest of the mash they were fairly well within range, though still on the high side of it. Time will tell, of course, I don't anticipate too much trouble over this, as this has happened before and things finished out fine.

As with the first brew, the wort seemed a little dark, at first. I remember thinking last year that something went wrong, but everything turned out alright. I am sure that the same will be true here.

I think the Kazbek hop will end up being a good one. The original hops in the recipe (Centennial and Amarillo) work very well, and I would not hesitate to use them again; however, The use of the Kazbek hop puts the beer back on the "proper" side of the Atlantic, at least in my mind. The true test, of course will be in the finished beer, so we'll see how it goes....

With my first brewing of this beer, it had just a whiff of sulfur each time I opened a bottle. It dissipated quickly, and by the last bottle was barely noticeable. For this brew, I used DanStar Munich, rather than Mangrove Jack's; we'll see if it makes a difference. One thing I might have done better was to re-hydrate the yeast before pitching, but it's too late for that, now.

I took a peek this morning, and things are definitely churning up - to my knowledge, we are on schedule. Barring any complications, I'll stay up late on Sunday night, then bottle the beer.

Ron

 

[TasunkaWitko]

One other thing that is probably no big deal, but I'll put it down here, as part of the log -

I didn't quite get the "hot break" that I was expecting, but I did get a small one. This has happened before, without any problems; it might have even happened the first time I brewed this. I did quite a bit of stirring as the kettle was coming to a boil, and I am guessing that this is probably the reason for it.

 

[Lefou]

I'd like to think your Big Spring water linked in Post 41 is just fine for wheat beers.
If you're a fan of light/pale SRM German and American wheats like I am, that base water profile should work. One of the references I used to make my last brew was Chris Colby's advice from his blog on German wheat beer. He has a five part series on that beer style. It's very detailed and I'll give you the link.
http://beerandwinejournal.com/german-wheat-beer-intro/

The last wheat beer I made using Colby's info was very good in my opinion. It was a partial mash (Briess LME with single decoction Belgian Pilsner and red wheat near 152F). Hops were Hallertau and Hallertau Blanc, yeast WLP 320. One caveat with this particular yeast is you won't get the overbearing phenolic of cloves or the ester of banana - it's mild.
The base water I started with was Poland Springs bottled water in gallon jugs, 6 gals for about $5.20.
I added CaCl, a pinch of Epsom salts, and NaHCO3 set for a 5gal. batch. This water is "soft" to start out with and doesn't have quite the hardness of the Big Springs water, but works nonetheless if you go by Colby's advice.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Just after midnight this morning, I bottled this second batch of Edelweiß; considering the time, I'll mark it on the calendar as 27 March 2017, rather than the 26th.

Those of you who have been following along know the score, but if you're just now jumping in, you'll notice that I bottled only 3 days after BrewDay. This is exactly what the procedure is for this beer, enabling it to develop the qualities that are unique to it. It worked quite well the first time I did it, and I am expecting it to work just as well this time.

I had plenty of time beforehand to prepare my bottles, equipment etc. When it came time to do the actual bottling, everything was all ready, and the process went smoothly and efficiently. I was able to just get 9 bottles from this batch, with a small swig left over for sampling. The whole procedure went so well that I just knew in the back of my mind that something must have gone wrong.

And, sure enough, it did.

The key point about bottling this beer 3 days after Brew Day is that no priming sugars are added - this is because the beer is carbonated by the residual sugars left in the wort after the first three days of fermenting. But guess what? I plopped four Brewer's Best Conditioning tablets into each bottle. This would have been perfect for "medium carbonation" under nearly any other circumstance, but not this one.

Luckily, I realized my error as I was capping the last bottle and swigging down my tiny sample, so I immediately pulled the caps off and separated the beer from the conditioning tablets. I then re-bottled the beer, coming up short on the 9th bottle by just a tiny bit; in fact, the amount that was short is about the same as the tiny sample swig that I originally got out of the batch. It amounted to maybe half an inch in the neck of the bottle, but I capped it anyway, figuring that it can be the first beer I sample in two weeks (plus a day or two in the refrigerator).

So, all's well that ends well - my only concern now is the possibility of oxidation. If it were any other batch of beer, I'd be really worried; however, with this one - bottled in the middle of the fermentation process - I'm hoping that the risk will be minimized a bit as the yeasts are still pretty active. I might be right, or I might be wrong - we'll find out. I did have to re-bottle one other previous batch of beer; this was last year with my Chestnut Brown Ale, and I forget the reason why, but in that case, the entire batch actually had to be run through a fine-mesh strainer before bottling. I was sure that it would be oxidized, but luckily everything turned out fine. I'm hoping that the same will be the case this time.

Anyway, that's that, for a couple of weeks; this batch has been cursed with little glitches since I started, so I'm a little worried about it; but then again, I've learned over time that we homebrewers are not as critical to beer making as we think we are - for the most part, the process and the beer take care of themselves....

I'd like to think your Big Spring water linked in Post 41 is just fine for wheat beers.

If you're a fan of light/pale SRM German and American wheats like I am, that base water profile should work. One of the references I used to make my last brew was Chris Colby's advice from his blog on German wheat beer. He has a five part series on that beer style. It's very detailed and I'll give you the link.

http://beerandwinejournal.com/german-wheat-beer-intro/

The last wheat beer I made using Colby's info was very good in my opinion. It was a partial mash (Briess LME with single decoction Belgian Pilsner and red wheat near 152F). Hops were Hallertau and Hallertau Blanc, yeast WLP 320. One caveat with this particular yeast is you won't get the overbearing phenolic of cloves or the ester of banana - it's mild.
The base water I started with was Poland Springs bottled water in gallon jugs, 6 gals for about $5.20.

I added CaCl, a pinch of Epsom salts, and NaHCO3 set for a 5gal. batch. This water is "soft" to start out with and doesn't have quite the hardness of the Big Springs water, but works nonetheless if you go by Colby's advice.

This is great information, Lefou - thank you for sharing it! I'll read through it and absorb it into what I hope I know. I'm loving the hefeweizens more and more as I try more and more.

 

[SanPancho]

was there a sample grain bill anywhere in here? i dont see one, wouldnt mind taking a stab at this. roughly half/half pils and wheat i'd assume, but the melanoid and munich percentages are a question..?

have some fruity new varieties of german hops, thinking of a neu-deutsche weisse.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

was there a sample grain bill anywhere in here? i dont see one, wouldnt mind taking a stab at this. roughly half/half pils and wheat i'd assume, but the melanoid and munich percentages are a question..?

have some fruity new varieties of german hops, thinking of a neu-deutsche weisse.

Hi, SanPancho -

This recipe is from Brooklyn Brew Shop's BEER MAKING BOOK; you can get it through their website or Amazon, and I very highly recommend it, along with their second book, MAKE SOME BEER. Or, if you'd like, go ahead and shoot me a PM with your email address, and I can email a copy of the recipe over to you. It's a good one!

 

[TasunkaWitko]

I took a look at the bottles last night when I got home from work, and again this morning. So far, no bottle bombs!

Temperatures are hovering a hair below 70, which in my experience is fine. The beer seemed to clear and the sediment seemed to settle a little faster than I remember last time, but I could be wrong. I'm pretty sure that with this batch, I sucked up a LOT less trub, so that could be the reason.

I am hopeful that things are going well. My parents had to run to Billings, so I asked them to stop at the LHBS and pick up a pound of pale wheat, if they have time. If they're able to do this, I'll brew one more batch, with the Centennial and Amarillo hops, per the recipe; this way, I'll be able to compare the two. Not having an LHBS close by can be a drag sometimes.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Here are two more articles, to add to the knowledge base:

http://byo.com/body/item/2265-german-hefeweizen-style-profile

http://braumagazin.de/article/brewing-bavarian-weissbier-all-you-ever-wanted-to-know/

 

[shellsbells]

TasunkaWitko, I'm glad to see that you gave this recipe another try (even though you had a bit of a snag with the carb tabs). I hope it turns out even better than the first! As for me, it's hard to say if my first batch ever really smoothed out - it became way over-carbonated and I ended up unable to pour a proper glass (every one turned into a gusher, even after 30 minutes in the freezer).
I gave it another shot a month ago, and this time fermentation kicked off quickly. The airlock smelled amazing for the first two days and I was really excited to make the recipe as written. But when I went to bottle on the third day, the airlock reeked of sulfur. I didn't bottle it, because I've bottled other wheat beers in the past when they've smelled like that and never been happy with the results. So I let it ride for three weeks anyway. I tried my first bottle tonight and it's good, but just kind of tastes like a plain old wheat beer. I'll just have to try again.
I'm looking forward to hearing how your new batch turns out with the kazbek hops. Recently, kazbek has become one of my favourite hops but I've never tried them in a wheat beer. Keep us posted!

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Good morning, @shellsbells - I hope all is well!

Sorry to hear that this one isn't going as well as it could for you. I did notice that my first batch of Edelweiss really seemed to hit it's stride at about 6 or 8 weeks. I know that this runs counter to conventional hefeweizen wisdom, but it was at that point that the Centennial and Amarillo hops - for whatever reason - really started to contribute to that "alpine" character of the beer, making it very unique. It was also at that point - for my batch - when the carbonation hit a perfect level, in my opinion. Before then, the beer was very good, and the carbonation was also fine; it might have been just a hair under, but the beer had been living up to its "soft and gentle" reputation. However, once it passed 6 weeks, it really turned into something that I would consider unique and special. This was my experience only, and I can't explain it, but that's how it was. We'll see how things go with this one.

I'm also sorry to hear about the carbonation issues with your first batch. I never did have that problem, so I have no explanation as to what happened.

I checked on my beer last evening and this morning; things seem to be going well, with no bottle bombs yet! Having said that, I do have one correction to yesterday's post: the bottle that I picked up and looked at yesterday was NOT Edelweiss, it was from another unrelated batch (none of the bottles are labeled at the moment, but I keep track of the caps that I use to tell them apart), which explains the clarity and very small amount of sediment that I observed. When I took a look at an actual bottle of the Edelweiss, it was exactly as expected: beautifully hazy with a bit more sediment than a non-wheat beer would have.

I have high hopes for this Kazbek variation - hopefully it will turn out well. I plan on brewing another batch (as-written) soon, both to see how it compares side-by-side with the Kazbek version and also to have a good supply of Edelweiss for the near future. My parents were recently in Billings, which has an LHBS, but they were unable to find the DanStar "Classic" Munich yeast - only the DanStar "Regular" Munich yeast" - so I may have to order that and give it a try. One of thee days, I'll try it with the "proper" WLP 300 or perhaps the Wyeast 3068, and we'll see what I end up with.

That's it for now - more as it happens, etc. &c....

Ron

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Checked on it this morning - all's well. The sediment continues to compact, as it should, and the beer is looking nice and hazy - as it should.

And - no bottle bombs! []

 

[SanPancho]

Hi, SanPancho -

This recipe is from Brooklyn Brew Shop's BEER MAKING BOOK; you can get it through their website or Amazon, and I very highly recommend it, along with their second book, MAKE SOME BEER. Or, if you'd like, go ahead and shoot me a PM with your email address, and I can email a copy of the recipe over to you. It's a good one!

sending PM.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

I put the labels on this beer last night, which gave me a chance to see how it is doing. So far, all is well, and pretty much the same as above.

The temperatures in my closet where the beer is carbonating fell off a bit last night, but I don't think it will be a terrible problem. After a week, it should be in pretty good shape, but I bumped the temperatures up to around 70 again, just in case.

High hopes for this - we'll see what's up.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

As mentioned above, I am brewing another batch of this tonight, to go with the one that I brewed a couple of weeks ago. also as mentioned above, I am brewing it "as-written," using the original Centennial and Amarillo hops.

A couple of issues with this batch:

I didn't quite have enough German Pilsner for this batch, so I used a little Belgian and Bohemian Pilsner to make up the difference. I'm sure that everything will be fine.

The bigger wrinkle is with the yeast. I had intended to use Danstar's Munich Bavarian yeast, but it "mysteriously disappeared." So, I will have to use a yeast that I was saving for another time, Wyeast 3638:

http://www.wyeastlab.com/yeast-strain/bavarian-wheat

I had hoped for a little more time to learn about and prepare to use this yeast, but circumstances have made that impossible. I've never used one of these before, so it will be new territory; to complicate things, a very tiny "pin hole" appeared near the top of the front of the package. Once again, no one knows how it happened, although everyone was man-handling it while I was at work.

Anyway, I sanitized it as well as I could, and I believe I "smacked" it correctly. It is sitting now, hopefully doing what it is supposed to do. I don't know how much was lost to the leak, but I am reasonably certain that it was a tiny amount. I'll use about a quarter or maybe a third of the yeast for this batch, which should hopefully be enough to get some good fermentation going, and save the rest for another use.

I don't have any LME or DME, so I am unable to make a small vial of wort to feed the remainder. I can only hope that it will be "okay" in a very small Mason jar in the refrigerator (like half of a half-pint). This may not be "correct, but it is my only alternative at the moment. Just to be safe, I'll be sure to have a back-up package of something standing by the next time I intend to use it.

Anyway, I am on the back side of the mash now, and will report any noteworthy happenings....

 

[TasunkaWitko]

A couple of quick notes relating to my post immediately above:

The brew was largely without incident - the malted wheat seemed just a little bit dark...red wheat, maybe? Or maybe just my imagination; the wort seemed to be of normal colour.

Mash smelled great, hops smelled great.

The Wyeast pack seemed to expand as it is supposed to. Some small bit of leakage left approximately 3.5 ounces in the pack. By comparison, the package says that there should be 4.22 ounces, for a 5 gallon batch. I pitched approximately 1.75 ounces, which should be more than adequate if everything is doing what it should be doing. I put the rest in the sanitised jar and into the refrigerator. We'll see how it goes.

Yeast smelled really nice.

I'm sure we made beer here, but there are a few unknowns. I'll keep an eye on it over the next couple of days, then will decide whether to bottle 72 hours after pitching the yeast (per the recipe), or simply ferment for the two weeks and bottle normally.

More as it happens, etc. & c....

Ron

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Well, there is some good news.

I checked this morning, and it looks like fermentation is indeed churning up, so I will cautiously declare my Wyeast experiment a success.

I'll see if things seem to stay "on schedule" for this beer. I assume that they will, but if not, I will wait out the two weeks and bottle as I would with a "normal" batch of any other beer, rather than following the 3-day schedule for this beer.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

I bottled this third batch last night, and we'll see how it goes. Everything was fairly normal and according to the recipe. Unfortunately, I wasn't quite able to get 9 bottles out of this; hopefully, 8 will be enough.

I did have about 3/4 of a bottle left over for sampling, and it was interesting. Keeping in mind that it was only 3 days since pitching the yeast, I believe it is developing well. Because of the different yeast, I got a few flavours I couldn't immediately identify, but they were pretty good, and I would say complex. There was a bit of sulfur to the aroma, but I am finding that this is normal and dissipates fairly quickly.

For now, that's all I've got - we'll see where this ends up, but I think it's going to be good.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Here is a photo from "the Kazbek batch," taken 10 April 2017:

It probably isn't the best picture, because I split the bottle between two glasses. The first glass poured quite a bit clearer; but then again, this is a hefeweizen, so it is expected to be hazy.

Appearance aside, it tasted great! I liked it a lot, and the DanStar Munich yeast brought out some nice character. The Kazbek hops were a good fit, and I wouldn't hesitate to use them again, especially for a "traditional" style hefeweizen. Having said that, for this particular recipe of this particular beer, I think that the original Centennial/Amarillo combination might be the way to go, as it really gives it that "Alpine" ambience that I remember enjoying so much.

This is only a first impression of this batch, based on a quick sample of half a beer that was at the absolute minimum age for drinking, judged against my memory from about a year ago - so it is not 100% set in stone. I'll see if my feelings evolve a bit after a few samples of this, and after comparison against the latest batch that is brewed with the original hops.

On all fronts, though - this is still among my top favourite brews - very much worth a try ~