Dry N Quick Sours (Gose)

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Andrew Hodgson

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I am trying out a technique @RPh_Guy illustrates on a post in this thread: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/bottling-with-brett.667180/

I am just starting this to document the process/results and if anyone else is trying similar things etc. etc.

Simple Gose recipe:
7lb German Pilsner
5lb Red Wheat

Mash for 2 hours at 147F, Ph was 5.1.

Boil, 60 minutes.
@ 15 minutes 7 grams of crushed Coriander.
@ 15 minutes 1.5oz Hawaiian sea salt.
@ 15 minutes 1/2 tsp yeast nutrient.

Yeast:
1 week before brew-day, 2L starter of TYB207 Brett, generation 2.
2 days before brew-day, 1L starter of WLP644 generation 5, last one for this culture.
Brew-day, 1L starter (wort pulled after chill) of Lacto blend, TYB lacto blend + 5 caps of Ultimate Flora and 1/4 tsp chalk.

Decanted and pitched Brett/Sach. Bubbling within 2 hours (that old Sach Trois is still kicking).
Will wait 48 hours then pitch the decanted lacto along with 1/4 to 1/2 packet of glucoamylase, holding some lacto for yeast bank.

Will then let it sit for three weeks and see how it is. This batch will be split, most will just be bottle conditioned with EC1118, a few will get dosed with white wine I have in the basement fermenting. And maybe I will also brett a few at bottling again and see if there is a noticeable difference. First time with this protocol, so we will see how it works for me or what needs adjusting.
 

RPh_Guy

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You like a very salty gose!

What glucoamylase are you using?

Will you be making an acid shock starter?

Just FYI ...
I make much smaller starters, trying to limit the amount of DME. I use a 500mL vitality starter for the 644 and a 500mL non-aerated starter for Brett. Larger starters like yours might work better though, who knows?
Lacto starter I pull about 300mL and use only one capsule of Lacto. My Lacto bank is the box of Ultimate Flora capsules in the fridge. ;)

I tested bottles 2, 4, and 7 months after adding extra cultures at bottling (3 drops of slurry to individual 12oz bottles). The differences were slight at 2 months, but still evident. At 4 and 7 months they were much more different.

I've made batches with and without hops added to halt souring. So far I prefer the batch with hops. Lesser acidity allows more yeast flavor (the palate is less dominated by sourness). Both ways are good though.
In this case however, you may not be able to easily stop souring since you pitched L. brevis. I have no experience with the TYB blend.

Kudos for being adventurous. There's pretty much no one using this technique.
Cheers!
 
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Andrew Hodgson

Andrew Hodgson

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Yeah my last Gose I only used 1oz of the sea salt and I found it to be lost a bit in the other flavors. This will certainly give a ceiling of the saltiness I want I think. Also for this beer I got roughly 6 gallons in the can so I am thinking about .25 oz/gal will be a high but acceptable salt rate.

Making smaller starters makes sense, I don't necessarily mind making large ones if it decreases lag time, but as you said how muchit actually does I don't know. The WLP644 was kicking after a few hours of pitching.

I know I might just scrap saving lacto now that I have a bunch of lacto pills, I will probably use the saved lacto for next week's beer and then call it good.

I have been using this gluco from my local shop: http://saratogaz.com/FERMFAST-GLUCO-AMYLASE-ENZYME-10-GRAM_p_9473.html

I am not terribly concerned with stopping souring for this beer. I think the high level of salt goes well with a really bracing sour beer, but only time will tell.

And yeah I think this will be my strategy for aging beer going forward. Brett some to save but allow myself to crack open the non-Brett ones so I am not tempted to drink the other ones before the funk really kicks in.

Thanks all goes to you man, more than anyone on here your techniques have helped me to make beers I really enjoy. Sour, funky, sometimes strange, but all tasty and never boring. This is only a first try, I am excited to get into different bretts and really dive into funk during bottle conditioning etc.

And yes I will be making an acid shock starter for the EC1118 when I bottle these. First time with that as well and will likely use a "personalized" technique based on several I have seen.
 

RPh_Guy

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Cool, everything looks good!

You can always add more salt at packaging if you want more of it. My last gose I bottled a third of it, and then added hop tea. I bottled another third with the hops, and then added more salt to the remaining third. Which one I preferred actually changed as the beer aged.

Future projects:
Experimenting with oak chips.
Figuring out a way to add barnyard character in a short timeframe (probably through blending). I just need to figure out how to make a barnyard-type funk quickly. Not sure that's possible.
 
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Andrew Hodgson

Andrew Hodgson

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Yeah I actually was thinking about oaking as well. I have a bucket of wine in my basement and I was going to soak some of the cubes in the wine and add them. Figured that is a wrinkle to be added after I get the technique down.

Being able to get that aged funk in a young beer would be nice.
 
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Andrew Hodgson

Andrew Hodgson

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So I pitched the lacto and gluco last night, used 2g of gluco based on nothing whatsoever but my thought that it will be enough.

Also, I decanted the lacto but the chalk definitely got pitched, are we all going to die or will the chalk settle with the trub in the FV? :eek:
 

RPh_Guy

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Chalk should settle.

It's not the slightest bit dangerous. Quite the opposite -- it's the most common form of calcium in calcium supplements and it's in basically every antacid (e.g. Tums, Maalox, Rolaids, Pepcid Complete, Etc).

Depending on how much got pitched, it may as a chalky taste until it settles, and it may make the beer more sour. Buffering causes more Lacto growth and more acid production.
Did you taste the starter by chance? You'd have been able to tell it was super sour, despite all the unfermented sugar.

I wouldn't worry about it; sounds like the extra sourness might be up your alley anyway.

Did the starter get jostled around before pitching? Usually in mine the chalk forms a tight enough cake.
Cheers
 
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Andrew Hodgson

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It settled but the lacto was so dense the chalk got lost and I said YOLO and pitched it all. Only a 1/4 tsp of chalk.

I do like em sour as hell so no worries. I didn’t taste but did sniff the airlock and almost dropped the flask, it’s gunna be sour the TYB207 has been adding a sour angle so this will be a ripper. Can’t wait to see what the ph settles at. Up this weekend straight up kveik lacto beer. SWMBO hasn’t been converted to Brett funk yet :(.
 
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