Different taste/carb levels in different bottles from same batch

[jhock]

Hello. First, let me say that I finished my first brew ever, and as many of the first timers on this site am probably over-reacting. I did search for this topic on the site and didn't find any specific answers, so here it goes:

The beers that I bottled last taste completely different (better) than the ones I bottled first and have very different "mouth feel" due to different kinds of carbonation.

I know which bottles I filled last because they were "misfits". I popped a couple open only a week after bottling and they were GREAT! They tasted like "real" beer, and while the carbonation was low, they had the typical little small bubbles. After the success, I kept opening the misfit bottles and drank about 5 which were all the same quality.

After the second week, I opened a couple of the bottles that were near the beginning of the assembly line and they are completely different. They have huge, soda pop like bubbles and a sort of dry champagne/cider taste.

My hope is that, despite my efforts to keep the priming sugar thoroughly dissolved throughout the mixture, the sugar was of a higher concentration in the bottom of the bucket and thus the first bottles have more priming sugar than the latter. As such, the first bottles might need more time to ferment out that sugar than the later bottles? (Assuming that more unfermented sugar gives that cidery taste and led to the difference in carbonation)

That is the only explanation that I can come up with. Has anyone else ever had a similar experience? Do you think that if I just let the earlier bottles sit longer that they will start to taste better? Or should I have drank the whole batch within the first week when it tasted right?

 

[ncbrewer]

No real diagnosis, but some thoughts:

The beer conditioned for two weeks would normally would taste better, not worse, than the beer conditioned for one week. Three weeks is normally better.

I think longer conditioning time causing big bubbles and a dry champagne taste could mean wild yeast or bacteria, fermenting out to 1.000 FG – I don’t know about the cidery taste. Maybe someone else can comment on this. Hopefully this is not the case – could lead to bottle bombs. These two-week beers – did they seem to have very high carbonation?

I always taste the few ounces of beer that are left after bottling (with priming sugar included), and I wouldn’t describe it as having a dry or champagne/cider taste.

Poor mixing of the sugar would cause varying carbonation. Did you use a priming solution of sugar in water?

 

[jhock]

Yep, I used dextrose that was diluted in boiled water (I weighed it, cant remember the ratio now, I want to say 8 grams/liter), poured it in bottling bucket, and then racked the beer from the carboy into the sugar solution. I also carefully stirred it every so often while bottling to try to keep it all well mixed (bottled using racking cane, tube, and wand).

No, the off-tasting bottles aren't overly carbed, just differently carbed (again, something like pop - huge bubbles that leave the beer shortly after pouring, it is practically flat by the time I've finished the glass). That doesn't bother me as much as the off taste. It isn't undrinkable, but it is not good.

I sterilized the bottles by submerging them in a chlorine solution for 30 minutes and then rinsed them thoroughly.

 

[ncbrewer]

I don’t really know what is causing the problem, but here are a couple of sources that might be of some help.

http://byo.com/stories/article/indi...9-the-ultimate-homebrew-troubleshooters-guide
“…4. I always seem to have cidery, sour, or off-flavors in my beer.
Most likely, your beer is being contaminated somewhere along its way to your mug. There’s one exception: Cidery flavors can arise if you are using a lot of cane (table) sugar or corn sugar as part of your recipe (other than priming). These sugars were sometimes recommended in older kit recipes and will almost always make your beer taste thinner, cidery, or vinegar-like.
Remember, you should be thinking like your beer. Follow the flow through every step of the operation. If your off-flavors are due to contamination, you have to be extra careful with cleaning and sanitizing.
Bacteria are on everything in the home brewery. A good cleaning with warm water, mild detergent, and a non-abrasive sponge will clean off the majority of the microorganisms. Make sure to thoroughly clean all your equipment before and after you use it! All equipment should be regularly inspected for stains, organic deposits, and scratches, all of which will harbor bacteria. Don’t forget to take apart and clean and sanitize spigots, valves, airlocks, hydrometers, thermometers, and anything else that might contact your sterile wort. Don’t take any chances: clean everything. Then sanitize. “
And “7. My beer has no head.
The problem may not be with your beer. A dirty or greasy glass, oily fingers, and lip balm or lipstick will kill a beer’s head immediately. Then check bottles and equipment for sanitizer residue.
Next, assuming you have enough CO2 but no head retention, you may want to think about your recipe. Proteins are the primary contributors to a good head, so beers with a proportion (around 10 percent) of a higher-protein malt such as wheat or rye will generally have a better, longer-lasting head. Flaked oats and flaked barley have long been employed in stouts to improve the creamy, thick texture of the head. All-malt beers have plenty of foam proteins. However, if you’re using adjuncts such as sugar, honey, or rice, expect less foam.
Alternatively, many ingredients such as coffee, chocolate, and tea, and many herbs and spices such as mint are very oily and will kill a head instantly. Try using them in small proportions and with a little of the high-protein malts to boost the head’s staying power. “

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/ne...virtue-time-heals-all-things-even-beer-73254/ (Revvy’s thread)
”New brewers, and those who have ever dumped a beer, or contemplated dumping a beer come pull up some chairs, Uncle Revvy has a story he wants to tell you....It is a tale that teaches some important lessons...

1)Never give up on a beer.

2)Never dump a batch unless it has mold or other noticeable signs of infection confirmed by a brewer with more experience than you. Or if it tastes, as Evan says, "like Satan's anus."

3)Always see your bottled beer through the complete conditioning/carb process....And if it still taste "funny" give it a couple more months.

4)Never ever panic about making mistakes and ruining your beer.

5)Never ever believe that you beer is frail, weak or easily "damaged." It really is hard to ruin your beer, no matter what bonehead n00b mistake you may think you made...

6)Have patience....have Patience...have Patience....

7)Give the yeasties the props they deserve, never doubt them, and Never Ever Rush Them!!! Let them do the job they are made to do...and let them see that job through til the end...(That means leave them at least a week beyond fermentation to clean up...or like me, leave it for 3-4 weeks.)”

With some question about the carbonation, be careful about bottle bombs.

 

[freisste]

Just a thought: what do you mean by misfits"? If those happen to be a different sized bottle (smaller), that could account for the brew coming to a finished carb level faster than larger bottles. Again, just a thought.

 

[sweetcell]

My hope is that, despite my efforts to keep the priming sugar thoroughly dissolved throughout the mixture, the sugar was of a higher concentration in the bottom of the bucket and thus the first bottles have more priming sugar than the latter. As such, the first bottles might need more time to ferment out that sugar than the later bottles? (Assuming that more unfermented sugar gives that cidery taste and led to the difference in carbonation)

my first guess would have been that the sugar wasn't properly mixed through the batch, but based on your description that isn't the problem. the fact that you boiled in water, racked on top and then mixed a few times during bottling makes me think that the sugar was very well distributed.

even if there was a difference in sugar concentrations, i don't think they we would be so much as to require a whole lot more time. you're not adding much sugar at bottling, that stuff gets consumed pretty quickly. after 2 weeks it should be all gone if you were keeping those bottles at room temp (70*F).

Do you think that if I just let the earlier bottles sit longer that they will start to taste better? Or should I have drank the whole batch within the first week when it tasted right?

if it is an infection, drinking ASAP is indeed your best option.

be extra diligent with sanitation on your next batch to ensure that you've ruled out that problem.

 

[jhock]

Thanks, the misfits were actually pop bottles, they were only off in volume from normal beer bottles by a half an ounce more or less.

I doubt that the batch had any bacteria or wild yeast, as some bottles are unaffected and I was insanely careful about sanitization. My new working hypothesis is that perhaps there was a bit of chlorine left over in the bottles I used first. I rinsed them well, but those ones might not have been completely dry when I started (just a couple of drops), meaning that if there were any chlorine left that it might have affected the bottle conditioning. I will be using a no-rinse sanitizer in the future.

Oh, and I did use corn sugar in the brewing process as the kit recommended. I used a Coopers IPA kit and added DME and dextrose, along with two ounces of Amarillo hops. I won't be using dextrose for anything but priming in the future.

My sense is that the best advice is to wait and see what happens. I know I have freaked out at every step of the process so far and everything worked out in the end. It is just hard to be patient when you are so excited about the first try! I'll post an update so anyone else who has a similar experience has an idea of what to expect.

Thanks for the responses and encouragement!

 

[beergolf]

How long did your bottles spend in the fridge? You will get better carbonation and head retention with more time in the fridge. After the bottles condition for at least 3 weeks, put a few in the fridge for several days or even a week before drinking them. You will notice that the head is much different.

 

[ncbrewer]

How long did your bottles spend in the fridge? You will get better carbonation and head retention with more time in the fridge. After the bottles condition for at least 3 weeks, put a few in the fridge for several days or even a week before drinking them. You will notice that the head is much different.

Why didn't I think of that? Not enough time in the fridge could be a good possibility.

 

[jhock]

Oh, thanks, I didn't know that played a factor. I thought once the beer got cold that everything more or less ceased to change. They were in the fridge for less than 24 hours to be sure. Again, too eager.