Diacetyl in first lager i think.

[HomeDrewBrew]

So i brewed a lager couple weeks back(3gallon) and i know i maybe should have tried the long lager method but tried the proven early method.
8 days at 50,2day diacetyl rest at 65 then lagered to 34F for 14days,bottled with cane sugar and added ale yeast at bottling.
Its been a week and getting ancy i decided to grab one put in fridge for a day and tried tonight and well......
Getting a very bready yeasty buttercotch taste..
I know its early but if i let it go for a few weeks to condition will that butterscotch be gone? Or am i stuck?.
Thanks

 

[Kent88]

8 days and on to the d-rest? I know people are pushing it lately, but that seems way to short. I guess that is why when I get advice on this sort of thing it usually includes "YMMV". What was the OG? What yeast did you use?

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

8 days and on to the d-rest? I know people are pushing it lately, but that seems way to short. I guess that is why when I get advice on this sort of thing it usually includes "YMMV". What was the OG? What yeast did you use?

OG was 1040 fg was 1008, used S23 yeast.
If i leave it in bottle for carbing will that make it better?
Next time should i let it rest longer like 7days?
Thanks

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Diacetyl doesn't clean up in the bottle, but I find beers that have it are mostly still drinkable.

I too am just now trying a 'quick' lager method (from brulosophy website). I hope it works (5 days at 10C, then warm up over a few days to 16C).

I find that pitching colder than fermentation temp helps reduce diacetyl. Also, I taste diacetyl in the fermenter much more easily if I have just eaten something sweet....if there is still diacety present, keep it warm.

 

[beerkench]

If it was yeasty it may just be in the process of bottle conditioning. Was it fully carbonated? Let it condition another week at room temp and then lager all the bottles in a fridge if you can resist temptation for two weeks or more.


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[HomeDrewBrew]

Diacetyl doesn't clean up in the bottle, but I find beers that have it are mostly still drinkable.

I too am just now trying a 'quick' lager method (from brulosophy website). I hope it works (5 days at 10C, then warm up over a few days to 16C).

I find that pitching colder than fermentation temp helps reduce diacetyl. Also, I taste diacetyl in the fermenter much more easily if I have just eaten something sweet....if there is still diacety present, keep it warm.

How long is your D rest going to be?

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

If it was yeasty it may just be in the process of bottle conditioning. Was it fully carbonated? Let it condition another week at room temp and then lager all the bottles in a fridge if you can resist temptation for two weeks or more.


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It was only a week into carbonation,i did jump the gun a little but was curious.

 

[j1n]

You didnt follow the fast lager method the way its outlined.

"Allow the beer to remain at this temp until fermentation is complete and the yeast have cleaned-up after themselves, which can take anywhere from 4 to 10 days."

you only did 2 days.....

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

You didnt follow the fast lager method the way its outlined.

"Allow the beer to remain at this temp until fermentation is complete and the yeast have cleaned-up after themselves, which can take anywhere from 4 to 10 days."

you only did 2 days.....

Ya,I guess i completely bypassed that whole step!.
So i should have done 8days at 50F,4-10 days at D rest then lager for 7-10 then bottle condition?.

 

[Gnomebrewer]

My normal method is to not have a D-rest - pitch yeast at 8C, ferment for 3 weeks at 10C, then lager. Never had diacetyl fermenting this way. I'm only just trying the fast method now. I'll stay at D-rest temps until I can't taste diacetyl any more.

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

My normal method is to not have a D-rest - pitch yeast at 8C, ferment for 3 weeks at 10C, then lager. Never had diacetyl fermenting this way. I'm only just trying the fast method now. I'll stay at D-rest temps until I can't taste diacetyl any more.

Wow! No D rest?!.
I thought it was a must for lagers.
So how long would you lager for?
Thanks

 

[Murph2002]

Did you move to a secondary to lager? If you removed the beer from the yeast after just 10 days, diacetyl is going to be pretty strong. I leave my ales on the yeast for at least two weeks, which amounts to anywhere from 7-10 days after reaching final gravity. Lager yeast ferments more slowly. Fermentation may not have been complete yet, so the yeast likely didn't have time to clean up.

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

Did you move to a secondary to lager? If you removed the beer from the yeast after just 10 days, diacetyl is going to be pretty strong. I leave my ales on the yeast for at least two weeks, which amounts to anywhere from 7-10 days after reaching final gravity. Lager yeast ferments more slowly. Fermentation may not have been complete yet, so the yeast likely didn't have time to clean up.

Ive never tried seconary with any of my batches.

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

Another question.
My other lager thats been fermenting for 5days at 48F(OG)1030 in fridge i took a gravity reading today(6day) and its at its predicted (FG) of 1006,so should i resume with D-Rest and bring temp up or just start lagering?
The reason i ask is cause will their be any yeast left to clean up?
Sample tasted ok.
Do i also need to rack to secondary bucket?
Thanks

 

[wailingguitar]

Wow! No D rest?!.
I thought it was a must for lagers.
So how long would you lager for?
Thanks

In 26 years, at home and commercially, I have never done a diacetyl rest or had need to do one. Pro colleagues I have spoken with are also of the general consensus that it is rarely necessary... perhaps dependent on yeast strains.

That being said, the standard method is minimum 4 weeks; 2 weeks at ferment temps then step down to lager temps and complete crash after a reasonable layering period

 

[wobdee]

I brew nothing but lagers in the 1.046- 1.055 range. They are all 2.5-3 gal and my fermentation schedule is 6 days at 48-50, 4 days at 60, 3 days at 39 then keg, carb and lager at 34 for 6 weeks. Never had a diacetyl beer since going this route.

Never went the bottle route but I would think a little more time at room temp should clean it up.

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Wow! No D rest?!.
I thought it was a must for lagers.
So how long would you lager for?
Thanks

Yeast will clean up diacetyl at any temperature but they do it much faster at warmer temperatures. So your options are a faster ferment including a diacetyl rest, or a longer ferment at cooler (46 to 50F) temps. Of course, the strain makes a difference as well. As does pitching cooler than you are going to ferment.