Dark Candi sugar, how much is too much ?

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HectorJ

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I'm looking to brew a Tripel and would be using dark (425 EBC) Candi sugar for the first time.

I am currently looking at using a total of 1kg of candi sugar for a 42 litre brew. Would a 50%/50% split between dark and clear candi sugar be too much in terms of the dark candi sugar ?

Thanks for any input!
 

VikeMan

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Do you mean color-wise? Most people would use 0 dark sugar in a Tripel. What does your grain bill look like?
 
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HectorJ

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Somewhat for the colour, but also I am trying to avoid a cloyingly-sweet caramelized flavour.

Grain bill is 9.5kg of pale malt, 1.5 of CaraRed, 1.5 CaraMünch Typ 1 and 1kg of wheat malt.
 

Holden Caulfield

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I am currently looking at using a total of 1kg of candi sugar for a 42 litre brew. Would a 50%/50% split between dark and clear candi sugar be too much in terms of the dark candi sugar ?

"Grain bill is 9.5kg of pale malt, 1.5 of CaraRed, 1.5 CaraMünch Typ 1 and 1kg of wheat malt."

Westmalle Tripel, the benchmark for all Tripels (in my opinion), image below - note the color. Use the lightest candi-syrup or sugar. Alternatively, table sugar will provide good results too. Dubbels are dark, Tripels are not. Also, that is a lot of crystal-caramalt, for any beer, which you may want to consider completely eliminating from your recipe - Tripels are dry and simple in recipe, it's the fermentation temp control that will make or break the beer. Below is my recipe for a Westmalle Tripel clone - turned out great.

1636994888153.png

1636995432989.png
 
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MaxStout

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In Brew Like a Monk, this was discussed, and it appears many breweries use simple beet sugar, instead of the more expensive candi sugar. The author states that Belgian brewers would use the cheapest sugar available (p 171). Ommegang switched to beet sugar and then dextrose, without any change of flavors. (p133)

If you're brewing a Tripel, you don't need or want dark sugars. Use table sugar, unless you like spending money on candi sugar.
 
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HectorJ

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Thanks guys, well I guess I am trying to replicate Kwak, rather than a Tripel.

I have made a light Tripel using beet sugar. It works fine, I just don't want to overdose the dark candi sugar (which I purchased a long time ago and am looking to get rid of).

Thanks,
H
 

VikeMan

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I'm pretty sure Kwak isn't brewed with any dark sugars. So the real answer is still... don't use any dark sugars. But if you want to use them just to get rid of them, I don't think anyone can tell you how much to use.

Maybe pick a color target, and use software to figure out how much to use to hit that target. But the carared and caramunich are going to make this fairly dark anyway.
 
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HectorJ

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I'm pretty sure Kwak isn't brewed with any dark sugars. So the real answer is still... don't use any dark sugars. But if you want to use them just to get rid of them, I don't think anyone can tell you how much to use.

Maybe pick a color target, and use software to figure out how much to use to hit that target. But the carared and caramunich are going to make this fairly dark anyway.

Thanks, I have already done that, it seems 250g in a 40 liter batch will give something not too dark. I guess I will be experimenting.
 

Miraculix

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How about brewing a nice English bitter? 10% crystal, 10% dark Candi, rest pale ale. Single infusion @65C, 30ibus from a noble hop of your choice with one 30min addition, fermentation at 18c or room temperature with verdant IPA. Go for about 4,2% abv.
 

Komodo

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First off, unless you are brewing for a competition then brew whatever you want. I brew almost all Belgians and Tripel is my fav. Usually I’ll use turbinado up to 20%.

For my recent Tripel, I went down the same road as you, looking for something slightly amber with some darker fruit or caramel flavors on top. It’s probably more of a lighter Belgian dark strong, but it sits exactly in Tripel land in every category except color. I used one D45 and one D180 just to see what would happen. It’s certainly not going to suck.

Belgian pils 75%
Munich 9L 12%
Torrified wheat 6%
D45 4%
D180 4%
Magnum - Saaz w/1oz Amarillo on flameout 33IBU
WLP530
 

Miraculix

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First off, unless you are brewing for a competition then brew whatever you want. I brew almost all Belgians and Tripel is my fav. Usually I’ll use turbinado up to 20%.

For my recent Tripel, I went down the same road as you, looking for something slightly amber with some darker fruit or caramel flavors on top. It’s probably more of a lighter Belgian dark strong, but it sits exactly in Tripel land in every category except color. I used one D45 and one D180 just to see what would happen. It’s certainly not going to suck.

Belgian pils 75%
Munich 9L 12%
Torrified wheat 6%
D45 4%
D180 4%
Magnum - Saaz w/1oz Amarillo on flameout 33IBU
WLP530
That's the spirit!
 
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HectorJ

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First off, unless you are brewing for a competition then brew whatever you want. I brew almost all Belgians and Tripel is my fav. Usually I’ll use turbinado up to 20%.

For my recent Tripel, I went down the same road as you, looking for something slightly amber with some darker fruit or caramel flavors on top. It’s probably more of a lighter Belgian dark strong, but it sits exactly in Tripel land in every category except color. I used one D45 and one D180 just to see what would happen. It’s certainly not going to suck.

Belgian pils 75%
Munich 9L 12%
Torrified wheat 6%
D45 4%
D180 4%
Magnum - Saaz w/1oz Amarillo on flameout 33IBU
WLP530

Thanks! I'll give my recipe a try!

Interesting to hear you use Magnum with it, I have some in stock (left over from my Christmas beer). I'll use that for bittering, and something else in the nose (have tons of things in stock)

Thanks again for your inspiration!
 
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HectorJ

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How about brewing a nice English bitter? 10% crystal, 10% dark Candi, rest pale ale. Single infusion @65C, 30ibus from a noble hop of your choice with one 30min addition, fermentation at 18c or room temperature with verdant IPA. Go for about 4,2% abv.

I've built a recipe to make a good English bitter, looking for 3.8% ABV, a good tasting session beer... I have all the ingredients, will be brewing that soon / for the summer.
 

Komodo

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Interesting to hear you use Magnum with it, I have some in stock (left over from my Christmas beer). I'll use that for bittering, and something else in the nose (have tons of things in stock)

My thinking with Magnum is to get in the bittering with less vegetative matter.
I've since sampled the above recipe from the primary, and the flameout Amarillo is coming through right now as an orange. My thought was to use the Amarillo in place of orange zest or dried peel, to have a slightly brighter citrus pop. It's not bad, but pretty fruity right now. It'll be interesting to see how these flavors change and meld as it conditions.
 
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