Corn from scratch

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StevieB

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So I use a corn adjunct for a couple of my lager recipes. I'm just wondering, why continue to use corn flake? I mean, there must be a way to work from raw corn right? If you took raw corn and ground it up fine and threw it into the grain bill, wouldn't you end up in the same place for less money? Anyone try this before? Any reason this would not work that someone knows of?
 

JLem

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Ramitt said:
Pretty sure you would need to do a cereal mash

+1

For the starch granules to be accessible to the mash enzymes, they need to be gelatinized. For barley, gelatinization temperatures are within normal mash temperatures, but for corn, gelatinization temps are higher. So, you need to run a cereal/adjunct mash first before you throw the corn into the main mash. Flakes grain have been pregelatinized so they can go right in the main mash.
 

Ramitt

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I knew someone would come along and describe it better than I could.
 

rcsoccer

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Like everyone else said, you definitely have to cook things like corn grits to pre-gelatinize them before adding them to the mash. It explodes the starch granules, making them available to the enzymes in the mash. Flaked corn has already had this done to it, to a certain extent in the flaking process.
 

RobertRGeorge

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Polenta from the supermarket works very well to make classic American pilsner. Already ground to the right degree. You need to simmer it about 45 min to an hour before adding it to the mash. Some types are fortified with B vitamins, which I am sure makes the yeast very happy.
 

JLem

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alecoholic said:
I've dried corn on the cob, and then malted it. Added it to the mash like normal.

Without gelatinization the corn probably contributed little sugar to the wort.
 

Malticulous

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It is supposed to be degerminated too. I have used raw corn (fresh off the cob) once and the beer was fine. I've used popped corn a lot, even got a second place ribbon from the last HBT west comp with one. Most any more I just use cornmeal from walmart. It's like $2.40 for a five pound sack. I always cereal mash. I've never even used flaked corn. Well, I have used quick grits without a cereal mash but even that yields higher extract by cereal mashing.

Malted corn does not need to be gelatinized.

I've never seen malted corn. It is mentioned in the American handy-book of the brewing. It said that it dosen't taste as good. That's a good book to read if your interested in per-prohibition styles.
 
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JPFuller

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When you use cornmeal do you substitute for flaked maize 1:1? I love my CAP and it sounds like you cant beat cornmeal for the price.
 

alecoholic

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I've never seen malted corn. It is mentioned in the American handy-book of the brewing. It said that it dosen't taste as good. That's a good book to read if your interested in per-prohibition styles.

I've never seen it before I malted it either. I malted it, per the instructions in the homebrewers garden. It took longer to malt than barley does. Flavor was fine, I used a pound in 5 gallons of preprohibition style pilsner and you could taste it in there.
 

Malticulous

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When you use cornmeal do you substitute for flaked maize 1:1? I love my CAP and it sounds like you cant beat cornmeal for the price.

Basically I do. I put it in with 1/3 6-row (or 2-row if I don't have the six on hand) give it a 20 minute rest at 160 then boil it for 20 minutes. I use the cereal mash to raise the temp of the main mash to the next step. I probably get (85% of) 39-40 ppg from it. Pressure cooking it can even get higher extract. There are still some starches that don't gelitinize at regular boiling temps. I'd like to get a pressure cooker and try that out.
 

JPFuller

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Basically I do. I put it in with 1/3 6-row (or 2-row if I don't have the six on hand) give it a 20 minute rest at 160 then boil it for 20 minutes. I use the cereal mash to raise the temp of the main mash to the next step. I probably get (85% of) 39-40 ppg from it. Pressure cooking it can even get higher extract. There are still some starches that don't gelitinize at regular boiling temps. I'd like to get a pressure cooker and try that out.

No problem doing a cereal mash, I've done them before, I was just wondering about the substitution rate before I brew my next CAP. One more Q for you, does cornmeal lend a grainer taste than flaked maize? Maize seems pretty neutral when I use it. Thanks for the response
 

Malticulous

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I've never used flaked maize before so I can' really comment about it. I can say the walmart stuff is nearly as good as Bob's red mill organic polenta that is the best flavored that I have used. It will dough up if you start the mash at conversion temps. It's not a problem if I dough in at 100F or so.
 

RVB

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It is supposed to be degerminated too. I have used raw corn (fresh off the cob) once and the beer was fine. I've used popped corn a lot, even got a second place ribbon from the last HBT west comp with one. Most any more I just use cornmeal from walmart. It's like $2.40 for a five pound sack. I always cereal mash. I've never even used flaked corn. Well, I have used quick grits without a cereal mash but even that yields higher extract by cereal mashing.



I've never seen malted corn. It is mentioned in the American handy-book of the brewing. It said that it dosen't taste as good. That's a good book to read if your interested in per-prohibition styles.

Good find Malticulous. What a fascinating read!! Thanks for the link.
RVB
 
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