-Coopers Sparkling Ale Yeast-

[Siman]

Hi!
Im thinking of doing coopers sparkling ale from provided kit, with coopers own recipe on site ( 1.7kg sparkling ale kit + 1.5kg light malt extract, 500g light dry malt, 300g dextrose ) and top up to 21L. I have 3x12g cascade finishing hops, was thinking of adding 1 pack start of fermentation (boil?) and then dry hop 2x12g week before bottling. I did read on forums that kit comes with yeast that is half lager / half coopers ale yeast, would it be good idea to add some extra yeast and what would be good dried yeast for sparkling ale expecially ( cant get liquid yeasts in my hands only dried) ? Fermentation temp would be either 13.5C or 17-18C .. 2 sections in my cellar which would be best?

thx in advance

 

[rodwha]

I'm not so sure that extra yeast is a good idea, but swapping it for Fermentis US-05 might be good to do.

I'm stuck on an iPad and is I'll not try to convert the temps, but mid 50s to low 60s ought to be good if you are using ambient temperature. You want the beer temp to stay in the 60s, and the lower the better.

You can also use a plastic storage bin with water to help.

It's typically a little better to use malt extract over sugar unless you are intending on thinning it out a little. And not to say that using sugars is a bad thing.

I'm curious what the instructions say about the hop schedule. Or are those extra hops you purchased?

Directions are often vague, and so, in case you haven't read it yet, it's best to ferment and condition for three or even four weeks, and then three to seven days in the fridge.

 

[Siman]

Hey!
Thx for advice! I will try Safale US-05, since kits yeast (50% lager/50% ale yeast) sounds so odd. Can i still toss kits yeast in or would be too much? Basically i can keep temperature either 57 F or 63 F dont know how much each yeasts fermentation takes beer temp up.
I used too much sugar and brew enchancer on my coopers lager and fermented it too high temperature taste was really off, so maybe i could just add 800g dry malt extract and 1.5kg light malt extract and leave sugar out, i want more flavour and less thinnier beer.
I never used hops before and dont know what method should i use (dry hopping etc), my seller sold me these 3x12g bags of cascade... should of bought 100g instead its same prize almost

 

[BigJack]

I think the Cooper's yeast gets a bad rap. Back in the bad old days, dry yeast under a can lid was often in a sad state by the time you bought it and brought it home. Those horror stories of unhealthy yeast and the off flavors that came with it have made home brewers gun shy.

Yet in my experience, fresh packets of Cooper's yeast can make a fine beer. If you like Cooper's commercial beers, don't be afraid to use their yeast. (I personally would way rather use their yeast than their can kits- but that's just me.)

That said, changing out the yeast to something you are more comfortable or familiar with or that gives you a certain flavor profile you are after isn't a bad thing at all.

 

[rodwha]

Do not add extra yeast. You would likely over pitch which would create flavors undesirable.

If you omit the sugar it may leave it rather low ABV. Maybe that's ok though. I'd likely use sugar or add DME.

I'm not familiar with your kit and what it delivers so it's hard to say how you should use additional hops, but, were it me, I'd use some for 20 mins, some at 5, and possibly a dry hop too to really add flavor.

What do you want from this beer?

 

[rodwha]

Oh, and I'd set it in the area that's 57*.

 

[Siman]

I bought US-05 yeast 11.5g today, and was thinking of doing 1k light DME and 1.5kg light LME and leave sugar out completely first time ever, would like ABV to stay around 4.5-6% after carbonation. Cause i never used any hops before didnt really know what to buy, seller said cascade is neutral on acids 5-6% and used on pale ales / ipas (close to this one?). Basically i just want more flavour and aroma, little bittering. Will 36g cascade be too much to use as first time hopper, if i add 24g to boil and 12g as dry hop?
Also last time i used DME i didnt boil it at all just tossed it in boiled water, it dissolved pretty good, did i make mistake and should of boiled it? With LME im going to read kits instructions and boil.
Rodwha you said 3-7 days in fridge at the end, you mean moving fermenter after fermentation is complete to cold or bottles which are already carbonated to fridge before drinking?

 

[unionrdr]

He meant when the bottles have carbed & conditioned for 3-4 weeks at 70F or a bit more first. then a week in the fridge to allow any chill haze to form & settle out while co2 gets into solution. US-05 yeast has a cleaner ester profile than the Cooper's yeast. Fermented @ 60F (15.56C),it'll brew cleaner,similar to the lager/ale yeast mix in the kit. Works a little better rehydrated,as you'll loose fewer yeast cells then rehydrating the dry yeast in the fermenter with the wort.
Rehydrating dry yeast gives more healthy cells at pitch time with shorter lag times.

 

[Siman]

If i start fermenting at 13.5C / 56.5F with US-05 is there any possibility it will be too low and start stalling? I guess beer temperature is still bit more than ambient temperature.
Also what temperature i should pitch the yeast in wort, i rehydrated my coopers yeast last time to 0.1Liters of 27C sterilized water, stirred abit for few hours. But my wort didnt cool fast enough and i decided to pitch it when wort temp was 26C was this too high pitching temp?

Some say wort aeration shouldnt be done in high temperature.. so should i wait JUST before i pitch yeast in and aerate it by shaking and stirring heavily?

thx in advance!

 

[unionrdr]

56F is a bit low for US-05. 60F would be better as a minimum ferment temp. That's internal temp,not ambient temp. Pitching dry yeast directly into wort can cause as much as 50% of the cells to go belly up. Rehydrating makes for a healthier pitch. I rehydrate in my Erlenmeyer flask. 400mL of spring water nuked to about 83-90F. Sprinkle yeast in & cover for 15 minutes. Then sanitize a skewer or other stiring device that'll fit in it & stir the yeast in. Wait another 15 minutes,then check it's temp to get it within 10 degrees of wort temp before pitching into wort. It should take off in a couple hours if done right.

 

[unionrdr]

I had to edit that last post. The amount of water heated for rehydration is 400mL,not 800mL! Oops...

 

[Siman]

Thx for fast answer!
What is the right temperature for wort to pitch yeast in after rehydrating? is below 20C / 68F OK? And can it affect flavour if wort has too high temperature .. above 25C example? took so long to get my last wort to cooldown and i started fearing that it could get contaminated if i didnt pitch yeast in fast.. added too much boiling water at start.

 

[unionrdr]

68F would be ok,but chilling it lower if you can would be better. That is to say,chilling your top off water in the fridge a day or two before brew day. Chill the hot wort down to 75F or so,then strain into fermenter. Top off to recipe volume with the now very cold water. It gets mine down to 65F or so so fast I get a nice cold break as well.
If wort temps are too high at pitch time it can cause off flavors to develop. Most off flavors develop during initial fermentation,so pitch temps are important to getting good beer right from the start. And of course,maintaining good ferment temps at least through initial fermentation...

 

[rodwha]

I store 2-3 gal jugs of tap water in the fridge for cooling down the wort, as well as fill some larger bowls with ice.

I begin by using just cold tap water in the sink to help bring it down enough, and then use the chilled water and ice.

I also fill 2 gal jugs with cold filtered water for my tap off, and add what I think will be about 2/3 of what I need first, and then pour the wort on that. I figure, like with priming sugar, it helps to mix it well. Then I stir it like crazy and use a whisk to aerate, which seems so much easier and quick than just using the spoon.

I'm not familiar with your beer kit, but you could easily bring a gal or two to boil, add your DME, and then split a one ounce pack of those hops at 20 and 5 mins. Then you can add the kit ingredients. And if you still want to dry hop you can do that at the last 3-7 days prior to bottling with another ounce.

I accidentally allowed my IPA using US-05 to drop down to 57*, and it didn't stall on my me. But I aim for keeping it 60-62*.

 

[Siman]

I guess will start with amb 56.5F for few days and then move it to 63F ambient to see how it goes. Should i move it late fermentation to even room temperature for strong finish and clearing out (20/21C)?

thx Siman

 

[rodwha]

I used to keep mine around 66-68* for the entire time, but now I allow it to warm up to room temp for the last week, though I tend to give my beers 4 weeks to ferment.

Ultimately it matters what the beer's temp is, and not so much what the ambient temp is. I recommended the cooler part as I'm gathering that you are not using a swamp cooler, and I'd think the mid 50's would likely keep your beer in the low 60's.

Sometimes the warmer side of the yeast's happy zone is desirable. You may want those esters. I've not done such though, nor am I familiar with what does, though I do know there are many British styles that do.

I'm making my first British beer (ESB) using S-04 and kept it in the low 60's for the first week. It's in the mid to upper 60's now.

 

[Siman]

Thanks for info!
And no, im not using swamp cooler. I have few spots in my cellar which stay same temperature with only little changes. I had my first beer coopers lager only 10 days in fermenter with high temperature which changed quite alot 22-25C, made it taste very odd. Im thinking now after reading loads of threads and comments that 3 weeks in fermenter would be the way to go.
Im btw storing my dry yeasts in that temperature 13.5C, is that low enough to keep yeast well for few months up to 6 months storage?

 

[unionrdr]

I store my yeasts in the lil butter cubby on the fridge door. Keeps well that way.

 

[Siman]

THX everyone for helping alot!
Today i started and went for:

1.7KG coopers sparkling ale kit
1KG DME light
1.5Kg LME Light
( no sugar at all )

Boil schedule

+25min 1.5kg LME light
+20min Cascade pellets 12g
+15min DME light 1kg
+5min cascade pellets another 12g

Topped it up to 22Liters, got my wort temperature lower with colder water than last time ( was 35C last time now 25C )

I guess need to wait for few hours until it gets around 19-20C / 66-68F and then pitch my rehydrated US-05 in!
After boiling my LME and DME which i didnt do before, i see lot of sediment around my wort, i guess this will drop down after fermenting?

OG is 1.055 so looking good

thx siman

 

[unionrdr]

The trub will drop out pretty quick. As in before the initial fermentation visibly starts.

 

[Siman]

My rehydrated yeast is at 21C / 70f and my wort has been chilling in cellar for 3 hours now (with lid on tightly ofcourse). I got my wort temperature to 25C by icecold water but with 2 gallons boil water it was still too high. Temperature of wort is now after 3hours at 22C / 72F and i was hoping to pitch when wort temp is 18-20C, should i pitch in rehydrated yeast right away or still wait for it to chill couple of hours... is there change of infection if i let it be for 6h before pitching?

Edit: no space in fridge but could chill the wort in freezer -20c good idea?

 

[unionrdr]

Likely not as long as it's sealed. But I'd pitch as soon as the temp got down.

 

[Siman]

Temperature gets down really slow, couple of hours per one celsius. Will pitch it at 6h mark no matter what temp is (still 22c).

 

[BigJack]

22c is fine for pitching. You're not making lager.

 

[Siman]

After 9 hours of cooling i pitched at 69f / 20.5C. Will boil with less than gallon next time and have more 4-6C cooled water in fridge.

 

[unionrdr]

I like keeping spring water chilling in the fridge a day or two before brew day to get the temps down where I want them. Easy & quick. Even gives a nice cold break.

 

[Siman]

Im using DIY coopers fermenter without airlock so didnt see start of fermentation that good, still i saw it start to take off already at 3-4h in REALLY FAST, and huge 5-8cm white foam and krausen.
My ambient temperature is 16 / 61F ... and beer temp seems to be around 63-63.5f / 17-17.5C. Didnt want it to stall it and this seems low temp enough for no extra esters.

thank you all

 

[rodwha]