Converting AG recipe to PM

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Sarrsipius

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I'm new to brewing and have stuck to extract with steeped grains. I want to start doing partial mash. How do you determine how to convert an AG recipe into a PM recipe. I would like to do a partial mash version of the two hearted clone recipe below but have no idea what to remove from the grain bill or how much and what type of DME or LME to add in it's place. Is there a resource I can use to figure it out?

Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04)
Yeast Starter: none
Batch Size (Gallons): 5.5
Original Gravity: 1.055
Final Gravity: 1.014
IBU: 52.6
Boiling Time (Minutes): 60
Color: 5.6
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): at least 4 weeks at 65 F
Tasting Notes: Extremely drinkable. This clone is as perfect as I can tell.


The actual gravity for this beer is 1.064
The FG is 1.010
Nottingham works better for the yeast.


10 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 76.92 %
2 lbs Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM) Grain 15.38 %
8.0 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 3.85 %
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 3.85 %

*mash at 150 F

1.00 oz Centennial [9.50 %] (60 min) Hops 30.3 IBU
0.50 oz Centennial [9.50 %] (Dry Hop 5 days) Hops -
1.00 oz Centennial [9.50 %] (15 min) Hops 15.0 IBU
1.00 oz Centennial [9.50 %] (5 min) Hops 6.0 IBU
1.00 oz Centennial [9.50 %] (1 min) Hops 1.3 IBU

Nottingham Ale Yeast Dry
 

TheJadedDog

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Well, the first question you have to answer is how much grain you are able to mash. You determine this really by figuring out how much water you can boil.

From there, the trick it to retain the relative ratio of the various types of grain bearing in mind that your extract is really only replacing base malts so your base malts + extract should equal the same ratio as the base malts do in the original recipe.

Also, don't forget to adjust the hops based on the different boil volume as boil volume affects hop utilization.

I'd recommend downloading some brewing software to help you make the appropriate adjustments, but that's just me because my math skills are awful. I think ProMash has a free trial, not sure about BeerTools.
 
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Sarrsipius

Sarrsipius

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hmmm. my head hurts. I have a 7 gallon turky fryer style boil kettle and a 20 qt SS pot.
 

Yooper

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ok, so are you using a big grain bag to PM with? Or do you have a cooler MLT set up?

Once you decide how many pounds of grain to mash, the rest is easy. As JadedDog said, you can replace the base grain with extract, and keep the ratio of specialty grains the same. In this case, it's pretty easy, since you don't have many specialty grains in there, just mostly base malt.

For example, you could mash:

2 pounds Vienna malt
2 pounds 2-row
8 ounces carapils
8 ounces crystal

in 7.5 quarts of 153 degree water. Then sparge with up to 2.5 gallons. Then you can top up with water to your boil volume (I'm assuming 6 gallons-ish), and add:

4 pounds light DME

And start your boil. Add your hops per the recipe.

If you can mash more grain, then you would use more 2-row, and less DME.
 

fivehoursfree

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This is what i used to learn how to convert recipes:
link

It goes into detail about the different types of grains; base, specialty, steepable grains, which ones need mashing, and enzyme content.

But yea, the basic idea, is to take the specialty grains, and add an equal amount of base grains, and mash that. In your case, I think Vienna can act as a base grain, so you can really just mash that with the caarapils and crystal, then add ~7 lbs of extract.

As stated, if you are using a partial boil, then adjust hops. I also tend to add a little more grain in my mash, because I use a strainer bag, and apparently the efficiency if that method is mediocre.
 

syd138

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Can I make a suggestion?

buy Beer Smith.. the program is awsome and will convert AG to PM or to Extract.

Its only about $20. Ive definitely gotten my moneys worth.
 
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Sarrsipius

Sarrsipius

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my head doesn't hurt so much now! Thanks for the help. I'll look into beer smith.

Just out of curiosity, how much malt is equal to 1lb of DME? Is 1 lb of grain going to give the same amount of fermentable sugar as 1lb of DME? I suppose it would depend on the type of malted grain.

thanks again for helping a newb.
 

david_42

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A pound of 2-row is roughly the same as a pound of LME.

In the recipe you posted, the Vienna can convert itself, but you'll need a pound of 2-row to convert the dextrine malt and the crystal.
 
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Sarrsipius

Sarrsipius

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ok, so are you using a big grain bag to PM with? Or do you have a cooler MLT set up?

Once you decide how many pounds of grain to mash, the rest is easy. As JadedDog said, you can replace the base grain with extract, and keep the ratio of specialty grains the same. In this case, it's pretty easy, since you don't have many specialty grains in there, just mostly base malt.

For example, you could mash:

2 pounds Vienna malt
2 pounds 2-row
8 ounces carapils
8 ounces crystal

in 7.5 quarts of 153 degree water. Then sparge with up to 2.5 gallons. Then you can top up with water to your boil volume (I'm assuming 6 gallons-ish), and add:

4 pounds light DME

And start your boil. Add your hops per the recipe.

If you can mash more grain, then you would use more 2-row, and less DME.
I'm curious how you determined 4 pounds of DME. The article posted by fivehoursfree says 1lb grain=.75lb DME. This would indicate 6 pounds of DME to substitute for the 8lbs of 2 Row. I ran that through the recipie calculator at BeerTools Beer Making Resources and Home Brewing Recipe Calculator and Formulator and the ABV and OG ended up higher. I changed it to 5 pounds and it was closer. 4 would seem to be a bit short.

I'm sure it's like anything else, depends on who you ask.

Anyway, thanks again for your help. I'm going to try this as my first partial mash soon. It's a Two Hearted Ale clone so I'll let you know how it compares when it's done.
 
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Sarrsipius

Sarrsipius

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ok, so are you using a big grain bag to PM with? Or do you have a cooler MLT set up?
I plan to use a grain bag and mash in a 20qt ss pot. Same process that is described on the "easy pm" sticky under the beginners forum.
 
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