Cheap compact wort pump

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Rys06Tbss

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Sorry don't mix home brew and edworts apfelwein. I ment hour did you just order it? I want a pump but at this point in Time can't justify spending 140 dollars on a chugger
 

Jmarsh544

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I order it about a week ago but the Chinese New Year has caused a slight shipping delay. Worst case I will use it to pump hot water, but if it turns out food grade like its listed, ill use it to whirlpool and chill. Either way, can't really go wrong for the price.
 

johns

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Interesting thread:

So I wonder if this little pump would be powerful enough to pump water through 50 feet of half inch copper tubing like in my IC? And then pump water through another 25 feet of 3/8 inch copper tubing for me CFC? I seriously doubt it. I have the IC made, but I am thinking of going with a CFC and using the IC as a pre-chiller. Also I can’t help wonder if a previous poster had thier question answered, about a HERMS system and if it would be strong enough to handle such configurations.

On the other hand thinking about how to provide a solution to this problem (if there really is a problem), what about having two or more of these type of pumps running in parallel. Would the head double as well as the flow rate? To my way of thinking it would, but then I am no engineer. Twice or thrice as many pumps would still be cheaper than a chugger, or even still than a march pump.
Just would like to throw that out there to see what other people think about this idea.
 

fafrd

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Interesting thread:

So I wonder if this little pump would be powerful enough to pump water through 50 feet of half inch copper tubing like in my IC? And then pump water through another 25 feet of 3/8 inch copper tubing for me CFC? I seriously doubt it. I have the IC made, but I am thinking of going with a CFC and using the IC as a pre-chiller. Also I can’t help wonder if a previous poster had thier question answered, about a HERMS system and if it would be strong enough to handle such configurations.

On the other hand thinking about how to provide a solution to this problem (if there really is a problem), what about having two or more of these type of pumps running in parallel. Would the head double as well as the flow rate? To my way of thinking it would, but then I am no engineer. Twice or thrice as many pumps would still be cheaper than a chugger, or even still than a march pump.
Just would like to throw that out there to see what other people think about this idea.
Parallel configuration should increase the flow rate (close to double) at the expense of a little more plumbing (these things are so inexpensive that the cost of the fittings will end up being a significant portion of the overall cost).

Can't wait to hear the first performance review on these...

-fafrd
 

Monster Mash

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Because these are 12vdc it would be simple to use a voltage regulator to control the speed of the pump. Since they are not magnetic drive I probably wouldn't adjust the flow with a ball valve.
 

Merzeone

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Ordered mine should be here soon I plan to run it through its paces. I already have a March 809 I would like to do a comparison (prob not much of one) but at least its a low cost option for some people.
 
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ColonelPanic

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Because these are 12vdc it would be simple to use a voltage regulator to control the speed of the pump. Since they are not magnetic drive I probably wouldn't adjust the flow with a ball valve.
Great idea! A simple inline potentiometer like the ones used on the diy stir plates might do the trick.
 
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ColonelPanic

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Ordered mine should be here soon I plan to run it through its paces. I already have a March 809 I would like to do a comparison (prob not much of one) but at least its a low cost option for some people.
I'm sure these two pumps aren't in the same league, but it will be nice to see your comparison so we know how many leagues apart they are.

I would guess that the low pump head spec will be the biggest limiting factor when compared to a March or Chugger for some brewing configurations.
 

Monster Mash

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For most people doing 5 gallon batches and want a pump to recirculate and transfer this looks like a cost effective solution.
 

ilikeguns

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just picked one up.. this would make a nice addition to circulate the water around my bucket heater. I don't have the funds for a march pump right now so this seems like a fun little cost effective solution.
 

fafrd

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Not knowing what 'm talking about, but would a PWM be another solution to controlling the pump output?

thanks

tom
Pulse Width Modulation (PWM) controls by changing duty cycle between full-on and full-off states. It s the best solution to control something like a heating element which is difficult to put into a controllable intermediary state.

Using PWM with a pump would mean having the pump start and stop for varying lengths of time (for example, on for one second and then off for 9 seconds out of a 10 second period).

If these motors have a flow rate proportional to voltage applied, that would be a better way to control them - this way you could have a variable and continuous flow rate rather than the repeated on-and-off interrupted flow you would get with PWM.

For anyone who has one of these pump, the easy way to check if they will support variable speed would be to put a potentiometer (variable resistor) in the circuit and check if the pump flow decreased as the potentiometer is dialed to higher resistance (less voltage to the pump). You could also just hook it up to a single 1.5V battery (or 2 1.5s in series to make 3V) and see if it pumps but at a lower flow rate...

-fafrd
 

fafrd

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just picked one up.. this would make a nice addition to circulate the water around my bucket heater. I don't have the funds for a march pump right now so this seems like a fun little cost effective solution.
'picked one up' sounds like you are still waiting for delivery, right?

-fafrd
 

ilikeguns

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'picked one up' sounds like you are still waiting for delivery, right?

-fafrd
sorry.. yeah.. just ordered today. I have very little knowledge about electric work, but I'm learning. I need to go through my wall warts and see what I have that will run this. I might mount it to a small project box with a potentiometer if that works.
 

Monster Mash

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ColonelPanic

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Here are some close-ups of the pump with my 1/2" camlocks from Bargain Fittings. Cleanup is really easy because I just flush it with hot tap water through both ends.

image-1215883223.jpg


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image-818821600.jpg


image-3959747944.jpg
 

whitehause

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These look like a nice option for my small scale. Might just have to get one of these on the way to play around with.

Thanks to everyone that posted info on them :mug:
 

movet22

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So I just picked one up myself (ordered it 5 min ago hahaha)

Did we confirm that this guy can handle what little trub would escape from my hop spider? Or should I just use it for hot water?
 

alien

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It can handle a bit of gunk. There is an internal impeller where tiny bits of grot can stick here and there but the usual cleaning routine is enough to deal with it.
 

z28tt

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Since these are DC (direct current) and not AC (alternating current) a simple speed controller will work. You cannot do this with AC motors because it changes the wavelength of the power and it throws the timing off in the motor.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-Dc-Moto...797?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27cff09fc5

http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-24V-36V...692?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337a7582fc
If these are brushless DC motors, you may need more than changing the voltage to reduce the rotor speed. Anyone try it yet?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brushless_DC_electric_motor

Code:
Brushless DC electric motor (BLDC motors, BL motors) also known as electronically commutated motors (ECMs, EC motors) are synchronous motors which are powered by a DC electric source via an integrated inverter/switching power supply, which produces an AC electric signal to drive the motor (AC, alternating current, does not imply a sinusoidal waveform but rather a bi-directional current with no restriction on waveform); additional sensors and electronics control the inverter output amplitude and waveform (and therefore percent of DC bus usage/efficiency) and frequency (i.e. rotor speed).
 

Monster Mash

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If these are brushless DC motors, you may need more than changing the voltage to reduce the rotor speed. Anyone try it yet?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brushless_DC_electric_motor

Code:
Brushless DC electric motor (BLDC motors, BL motors) also known as electronically commutated motors (ECMs, EC motors) are synchronous motors which are powered by a DC electric source via an integrated inverter/switching power supply, which produces an AC electric signal to drive the motor (AC, alternating current, does not imply a sinusoidal waveform but rather a bi-directional current with no restriction on waveform); additional sensors and electronics control the inverter output amplitude and waveform (and therefore percent of DC bus usage/efficiency) and frequency (i.e. rotor speed).
I noticed it said that but yet it only has two wires going to the motor, all of the brushless motors I use have 3 wires.
 

tre9er

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Colonel, you're controlling flow with ball valve...does this seem to be a viable option or has anyone installed a dimmer or potentiometer? I'd consider these even if just for transfer as it takes forever to move liquid via gravity.
 

alien

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These things must have their own internal brushless controller.

Here's the guts of one of the 12V solar pumps. My guess the controller is the stubby cylinder with the wires connected to it.

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=29605&start=5

People are controlling these things by PWM instead of diverting the flow. Whether that's the right thing to do, I don't really know, but it is not what is recommended for the March pump which is brushless.

By the way, it is my understanding that the impeller and other plastic parts are polysulfone same as the March and Chugger pumps.
 

tre9er

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I just wouldn't want to do anything that will drastically shorten the life of the pump, even if it is a $22 pump...we in a recession, yo
 

movet22

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Question on the fittings: are the threads NPT? If not how do you attach them to NPT fittings? Or do you not? :confused:
 

alien

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The pump I have from solarproject.co.uk has 1/2" male BSP threads. 1/2" NPT fittings screw on nicely, the thread pitch is compatible. The light brown colored eBay ones look identical. I don't know about the black eBay ones.
 

DrHops

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I just bought one of the topsflo eBay pumps for $75 with free shipping. The threads are NPT 1/2 inch stainless steel. I'm still piecing it all together but I will be using a ball valve after the pump to control the flow. The valve costs $12, I'm not sure why I'd spend more or have to make something that will in effect do the same exact thing as a ball valve will. I'm somewhat handy, but sometimes simple is just better.
 

alien

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This is a quote from an email from the solarprojects.co.uk rep:

Unless you need a higher flow rate then most brewers go for the 8 watt as it is the best value. So long as the PSU outputs DC and at least 750 milliamps then it will work well with the pump, allowing you to tweak the flow rate to suit. It is also fine to restrict the flow physically with a valve, you won't burn the pump out or strain it.
So you don't necesarily need a bypass valve to adjust the flow. Restricting the power (by PWM e.g. LED dimmer) or an inline valve will also work.
 

ameliabrewery

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DrHops said:
I just bought one of the topsflo eBay pumps for $75 with free shipping. The threads are NPT 1/2 inch stainless steel. I'm still piecing it all together but I will be using a ball valve after the pump to control the flow. The valve costs $12, I'm not sure why I'd spend more or have to make something that will in effect do the same exact thing as a ball valve will. I'm somewhat handy, but sometimes simple is just better.
Keep us informed on this pump, I am waiting on one of the China pumps for a small batch BIAB setup but would like to know how this pump works for you.
 

tre9er

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This is a quote from an email from the solarprojects.co.uk rep:



So you don't necesarily need a bypass valve to adjust the flow. Restricting the power (by PWM e.g. LED dimmer) or an inline valve will also work.
Excellent info. For me it would be much easier to just restrict flow with the existing ball valves on all of my equipment.

Has anyone used a pump to empty the mash tun? I would love to speed up various parts of my brew day and emptying the tun via gravity takes a long time.
 
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ColonelPanic

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tre9er said:
Colonel, you're controlling flow with ball valve...does this seem to be a viable option or has anyone installed a dimmer or potentiometer? I'd consider these even if just for transfer as it takes forever to move liquid via gravity.
Yes, the ball valve does a fine job of adjusting the flow. It does work the motor a bit harder when you restrict the flow, but so far I've had no problems.
 

wilserbrewer

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I would love to speed up various parts of my brew day and emptying the tun via gravity takes a long time.
Surprised it takes that long to empty using gravity? How much drop do you have to the exit tubing? I am always one to speed things along but never had this issue. Does your tubing from the MT extend all the way down to the wort level in the cooler?
 

tre9er

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Surprised it takes that long to empty using gravity? How much drop do you have to the exit tubing? I am always one to speed things along but never had this issue. Does your tubing from the MT extend all the way down to the wort level in the cooler?
3 tier setup, not too far down to bk, hose is all the way down in bottom of bk . Liquid seems to stay on top of grain bed and not find ideal path to bottom at times.
 

HDIr0n

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Man the wait is killing me, it has been 3 weeks since I ordered it. They must have put it on a row boat coming from China.

On another note has anybody secured these to their brew stand or some other fixture? I am thinking about using U-bolts to secure them to my stand. Also I think I am going to put a 3 way valve on them to be able to run my Brutus 20 setup.

-G
 

alien

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By the way, it is my understanding that the impeller and other plastic parts are polysulfone same as the March and Chugger pumps.
I just checked with Peter from solarprojects.co.uk and he said:

It is a plastic called Fortron as far as I know, which from a quick googling:- Polyphenylene Sulfide (i.e.; Techtron, Ryton, Fortron); seems to be another name for the same thing. It is fully food safe.
Well, I just looked up polysulfone and it is not identical to polyphenylene sulfide so my previous post was incorrect. But it is an equally suitable material.

According to the Wikipedia page, polyphenylene sulfide resists dyeing and is white to light tan in colour. So the black eBay pumps may be made of something else.
 

DrHops

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HDIr0n said:
Man the wait is killing me, it has been 3 weeks since I ordered it. They must have put it on a row boat coming from China.

On another note has anybody secured these to their brew stand or some other fixture? I am thinking about using U-bolts to secure them to my stand. Also I think I am going to put a 3 way valve on them to be able to run my Brutus 20 setup.

-G
I'm using a quick disconnect from Bobby M. to hook it directly to my brew kettle, then a ball valve hooked directly to the outlet side of the pump with another disconnect on that side. They are so small they really don't need any mounting as long as they are either at the same level or below the valve of the kettle.
 

tre9er

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I'm not pump-literate, so does the ball valve need to be on the OP side to regulate flow or can it be on the IP, or does it matter?
 

snaps10

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tre9er said:
I'm not pump-literate, so does the ball valve need to be on the OP side to regulate flow or can it be on the IP, or does it matter?
Ball valve needs to be on the outlet sife
 
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