Can you Brew It recipe for Lagunitas Little Sumpin Sumpin

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EricCSU

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All recipes are (unless otherwise specified): 6 gallons post-boil, 70% efficiency, Morey for color, 15% evaporation, 7.27 gallons preboil, Rager IBU, and most hops are in grams not ounces. Most, if not all recipes are primary only (no secondary).

If you brew this, please reply with your results for discussion.

OG 1070
FG ?
IBUs 34.7
SRM 4.8

3.68kg US 2-row 50%
2.77kg wheat malt 37.6%
90g home toasted wheat malt 1.2%
830g torrified wheat 11.2%

Boil for 90min

11g Nugget 9%AA at 90min
2g Horizon 12%AA at 90min
2g Summit 17.5%AA at 90min
8g Willamete 5.2%AA at 45min
27g Santiam 5.6%AA at 15min
9g Willamete at 15min

24g Cascade dry hop
24g Centennial dry hop
24g Simcoe dry hop
24g Chinook dry hop
18g Amarillo dry hop
15g Columbus dry hop

WLP002

Mash at 150F

Pitch at 62F, raise to 68 after 36', then raise to 70F after another 36'.

Discussion notes:
The wheat is toasted to approximately 14lov.
 

samc

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Going to brew this in the next few days with some changes. Will go with all Magnum for bittering as 2g each of Horizon-Summit is pointless. Also going to can the Willamette/Santiam and sub in something like Simcoe/Citra. Finally going to use WLP530.

My goal is to get closer to Sumpin Wild since I've had that and not had the Sumpin Sumpin. If it works I'll proudly post back, if you don't hear from me consider it a bust.

btw - not bothering with that small amount of home toasted wheat, subbing Caramel Wheat from MFB.
 
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EricCSU

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Going to brew this in the next few days with some changes. Will go with all Magnum for bittering as 2g each of Horizon-Summit is pointless. Also going to can the Willamette/Santiam and sub in something like Simcoe/Citra. Finally going to use WLP530.

My goal is to get closer to Sumpin Wild since I've had that and not had the Sumpin Sumpin. If it works I'll proudly post back, if you don't hear from me consider it a bust.

btw - not bothering with that small amount of home toasted wheat, subbing Caramel Wheat from MFB.

I agree with you about the Magnum, I would do the same thing. I think Simcoe/Citra would go very well with wheat. And the WLP530 idea is very interesting. Good luck!

Eric
 

mariahman

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OK maybe a rookie question bu whu grams, i've never seen them way at my humble homebrew shop.
 
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EricCSU

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mariahman said:
OK maybe a rookie question bu whu grams, i've never seen them way at my humble homebrew shop.

Are you asking "why grams?"

If so, grams are using because they are a more precise measurement. Especially when cloning a recipe, it is much easier to use grams than ounces.

Eric
 

calpyro

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Going to brew this in the next few days with some changes. Will go with all Magnum for bittering as 2g each of Horizon-Summit is pointless. Also going to can the Willamette/Santiam and sub in something like Simcoe/Citra. Finally going to use WLP530.

My goal is to get closer to Sumpin Wild since I've had that and not had the Sumpin Sumpin. If it works I'll proudly post back, if you don't hear from me consider it a bust.

btw - not bothering with that small amount of home toasted wheat, subbing Caramel Wheat from MFB.

I made it as LSW with a lower gravity. Turned out really nice.

BeerSmith Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Little Sumpin Wild
Brewer:
Asst Brewer:
Style: American Wheat or Rye Beer
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 12.00 gal
Boil Size: 12.54 gal
Estimated OG: 1.071 SG
Estimated Color: 5.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 33.1 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
2.00 lb Rice Hulls (0.0 SRM) Adjunct 5.80 %
16.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 46.38 %
13.00 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 37.68 %
3.00 lb Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) Grain 8.70 %
0.50 lb Wheat, Roasted (22.0 SRM) Grain 1.45 %
0.18 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] (90 min) Hops 4.2 IBU
0.71 oz Nugget [13.00 %] (90 min) Hops 15.5 IBU
0.52 oz Williamette [5.50 %] (45 min) Hops 4.4 IBU
2.00 oz Liberty [4.30 %] (15 min) Hops 3.9 IBU
0.59 oz Williamette [5.50 %] (15 min) Hops 1.5 IBU
0.18 oz Horizon [12.00 %] (90 min) Hops 3.6 IBU
1.70 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (0 min) Hops -
1.70 oz Cascade [5.50 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
1.70 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
1.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 Hops -
1.70 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Primary 3.0 days) Misc
2.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
2 Pkgs Abbey Ale (White Labs #WLP530) Yeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Temperature Mash, 1 Step, Light Body
Total Grain Weight: 34.50 lb
----------------------------
Temperature Mash, 1 Step, Light Body
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
75 min Saccharification Add 10.78 gal of water at 161.4 F 150.0 F
10 min Mash Out Heat to 168.0 F over 10 min 168.0 F


Notes:
------
Roasted Wheat Malt is home toasted malted wheat in oven until toasted 300 degrees to color of C40
Mash in @ 08:30 hrs temp dropped to 148
90 min boil and hops added @1100hrs
45 min hops added @1145
15 min hops added @1215

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 

wildbeers

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Going to brew this in the next few days with some changes. Will go with all Magnum for bittering as 2g each of Horizon-Summit is pointless. Also going to can the Willamette/Santiam and sub in something like Simcoe/Citra. Finally going to use WLP530.

My goal is to get closer to Sumpin Wild since I've had that and not had the Sumpin Sumpin. If it works I'll proudly post back, if you don't hear from me consider it a bust.

btw - not bothering with that small amount of home toasted wheat, subbing Caramel Wheat from MFB.

any word on how your Wild clone came out?
 

samc

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any word on how your Wild clone came out?

Tasted it yesterday, ready for cold crashing. It is excellent at this point, but I can't tell how close it will be to Wild. Doesn't matter as long as it is good. The dry hopping completely knocked out the clove taste from the yeast, or just the extra 2 weeks in the primary.
 

samc

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My 34 day old Wild attempt is kegged and partially carbed at this point. I will have to do a side by side in a few weeks, but it is an excellent beer even if it turns out to be far off the original. Normally on this kind of beer I'd not consider drinking it for another 3 weeks but I used a 1 micron filter for my first successful filtering job and it is crystal clear and seemingly ready to go.
 

nobita

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So I just bought all the ingredients for this beer and am planning to brew it tomorrow, but Beersmith says the IBUs are around 30 (as listed above) but the actual beer is 64 IBUs according to Lagunitas.

I'm using the recipe listed on this post. which I thought was accurate based on the "can you brew it" show.

Can anyone help clear this up for me? TIA
 
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EricCSU

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nobita said:
So I just bought all the ingredients for this beer and am planning to brew it tomorrow, but Beersmith says the IBUs are around 30 (as listed above) but the actual beer is 64 IBUs according to Lagunitas.

I'm using the recipe listed on this post. which I thought was accurate based on the "can you brew it" show.

Can anyone help clear this up for me? TIA

Did you use Rager?

Eric
 

nobita

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doh!...i actually had no idea about rager vs. tinseth was until you just posted, and I did a quick google search. I have a lot to learn! I switched to rager under beersmith options and it upped the IBUs from ~34 to 40 but that is still way less than the 64 IBUs listed on the label. what else am i missing?
 

calpyro

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doh!...i actually had no idea about rager vs. tinseth was until you just posted, and I did a quick google search. I have a lot to learn! I switched to rager under beersmith options and it upped the IBUs from ~34 to 40 but that is still way less than the 64 IBUs listed on the label. what else am i missing?

I am going to brew this recipe again on Monday as Little Sumpin Wild with 3787 Wyeast Belgian yeast. My Beersmith hit 33 IBU and came out great. I entered it in a competition and got 40.3 points in Belgian Specialty category with a third place. I am really happy with this beer and would not make it more bitter. This beer will be a regular for me.
 

nobita

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Thanks that is great to know! I went ahead and brewed this yesterday as is...it was my first all grain, and obviously I will have to work on my efficiency as my OG was only 1.058 compared to the target of 1.071 but hopefully it will still taste good!
 

BrewThruYou

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Anyone sub US-04 or Nottingham for WLP002? I have a lot of US04, US05, and Notty on hand...reallydon't feel like spending $7 on a vial of WLP002.

Also, my LHBS didn't have Santiam. Beersmith says subs are Tettnang and Spalt.

I have Cascade, Centennial, Chinook, Citra, Northern Brewer, Nugget, Fuggles, EK Goldings, Warrior, etc. on hand. I'm thinking that none of these are appropriate subs. Really don't feel like driving all the way to the LHBS again.
 

nobita

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I couldn't find Santiam either, even here in Portland, aka Beervana. I used Tettnang instead.
 

AstroBrew

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I'm going to give this a go tomorrow. Did anybody actually home-toast some wheat? I'm thinking I'll give it a try today and see if it's worth using. Also, how does the bittering come out? Should I up the hopping to get closer to the real thing?
 

Ravenshead

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I made it a month or so ago and I did toast the wheat. It was really easy, just follow what Jamil did-I think it took me 30 Min. I don't have a mill so just used the rolling pin/zip lock bag method to crack the grain. It also makes the house smell really good.

I followed the recipe exactly except for the Santiam I thought it came out spot-on. I wouldn't change a thing.

The only bad thing I can say about this beer is it doesn't last long enough. My friends and I killed a full corny in about an hour and a half.
 

BrewThruYou

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I purchased Tettnang too. Going to brew this within the next week.

I'll use some Warrior to sub for the massive 0.07 oz of each Summit and Horizon and I'm subbing for Willamette (probably either Fuggles or EK Goldings). I'll probably cheat on the dryhopping too. I don't think I have Columbus.

I decided to bite the bullet and purchase WLP002.
 

AstroBrew

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Brewed this up yesterday. Came out real nice. I used all Nugget for the 90 min addition and replaced the Santiam with Hallertau. Tettnang would have been better I guess, but I won't be heart-broken if it's not a dead-on clone. Also, I think I toasted my wheat a little too dark. I was going for the 60 lov that the brewer mentioned, but after listening to the podcast again, Jamil says it should be closer to 14 lov. Oh well, the color of the wort looked spot-on Little Sumpin' Sumpin'. And the smell of the toasted wheat is amazing!
 

samc

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Cracked open a bottle of LS Wild last night to compare to my off the cuff clone. Color was the same, not really the same beer mainly due to the clove notes in the Lagunitas version, whereas mine originally had clove but it aged out rather quickly. I couldn't get past that clove aroma to compare the hop aroma.

I don't like clove so I was pretty happy with my beer. Dumped the rest of the bottle and drank my beer.

All in all I really like what I brewed, next time I'd probably just stick with US-05 or similar yeast and bypass the Belgian thoughts as it makes for a very smooth IPA.
 

BrewThruYou

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Brewed this up yesterday. Came out real nice. I used all Nugget for the 90 min addition and replaced the Santiam with Hallertau. Tettnang would have been better I guess, but I won't be heart-broken if it's not a dead-on clone. Also, I think I toasted my wheat a little too dark. I was going for the 60 lov that the brewer mentioned, but after listening to the podcast again, Jamil says it should be closer to 14 lov. Oh well, the color of the wort looked spot-on Little Sumpin' Sumpin'. And the smell of the toasted wheat is amazing!

I just bottled my batch last weekend and tried one tonight. Surprisingly, it carbed early. My negatives were that I missed the OG by a decent amount and the color. I'm chalking the OG miss to not tightening up the gap on my mill for crushing the wheat. Also, my color is a tad light...probably should've toasted the wheat longer. Mine is also real cloudy...I'm sure Lag filters theirs.

Taste is really good. I still have a bottle of the real stuff and will do a side by side taste test this weekend.

For dry-hopping, I used a sanitized 1gal paint strainer bag sealed with sanitized zip tie. This thing was huge when I pulled it out of the fermenter...crazy amount of dryhops.
 

Kult0007

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I brewed the Little Sumpin Sumpin recipe this weekend and I've been pleased with it so far. I actually found Santium hops for this batch...thanks Northern Brewer! I'm glad I got extra unmilled wheat to experiment with toasting because I burned my first attempt. It smelled great cooking at 350 F, but after about 15 min the smell abruptly changed to a burnt popcorn odor. Third time was a charm. I'd recommend slowly incrementing the oven temp until you get it dialed in...and it's totally worth trying though for how great it smells!

I was low on gravity, but that's not surprising because I'm brewing on a new system so I'll have to learn it's quirks. I don't have temp control capability to maintain the fermentation temps suggested, it's been at 70 F the whole time. I can't wait to bomb this thing with dry hops. I'll be back to give tasting notes.
 

Acoma

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For those that have attemptd this clone, how long did you dry hop for?
 

bovinejony

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Hey Eric,

I've never roasted malt before, what exactly is 140lov? This recipe looks great. I'd love to scale it down to 5gallons post-boil total volume since my brew pot is only 30quarts. Can I just do a linear scaling down of all ingredients or will I lose some components of the recipe? Also, what could I substitute Horizon/Summit for, due to no LHBS having them in stock?

Thanks!
 
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EricCSU

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Hey Eric,

I've never roasted malt before, what exactly is 140lov? This recipe looks great. I'd love to scale it down to 5gallons post-boil total volume since my brew pot is only 30quarts. Can I just do a linear scaling down of all ingredients or will I lose some components of the recipe? Also, what could I substitute Horizon/Summit for, due to no LHBS having them in stock?

Thanks!

I have never roasted malt either. You should search the forums for "roasting malt" and if that does not answer your question, start a thread in the appropriate forum.

If I had a 7.5 gallon brewpot, I would use the same amount of grain but only run off 6.5 gallons. Then use fermcap-S to reduce the chance of boilover (and add hops slowly). If your final volume into your carboy is less than 5.5 gallons, top up with boiled and cooled water. If you use Beersmith (which I recommend), you can enter in your equipment and boil volume and it will adjust the hop utilization rate, which changes with a concentrated boil.

For hop substitution, check the link in my signature.

Eric
 

samc

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Just use all Nugget hops, you can't possibly detect the difference in the beer. 14 Lovibond (not 140) is the color of the malt you are aiming for. I just used Caramel Wheat from the LHBS and didn't bother roasting such a small amount of malt.
 

bovinejony

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I'm coming to the realization that the BIAB that I am capable of doing might not work with 16lb's of grain =(. Definitely going to invest in Brewsmith and formulate a recipe that will work on a smaller scale so that I don't kill my poor arms lifting that bag or making my SWMBO go into ape rage over the mess I make by spilling that thing. Thanks for the awesome links Eric, and for the advice sam. I look so forward to brewing this.
 

clark123456

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I go for this tomorrow. I'll report my outcome once I keg or bottle and age for a bit. Any guidance will be appreciated if you've done this recipe and noticed something that should be adjusted.
 

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I go for this tomorrow. I'll report my outcome once I keg or bottle and age for a bit. Any guidance will be appreciated if you've done this recipe and noticed something that should be adjusted.

If you bottle it, put a strainer bag or something over your autosiphon. Don't let any chunks of WLP002 get into the bottling bucket. Even if a bottle has been in the fridge for a while, the yeast still gets into the glass and being WLP002, it's very flocculent and clumps together.

I usually run my autosiphon over the bottom on wheat beers to pull up some yeast...bad idea here. Now I have yeast chunks riding up and down the glass. I'm starting to hate WLP002 now.
 

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My recommendation is to let this beer age, off the yeast, for at least a week before you dry/keg hop it. But as always, YMMV.
 

clark123456

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Thanks guys for the feedback. This is my first time with WLP002, so I'll take your words of wisdom to heart and follow the advice.

NEVER MIND THE ORIGINAL QUESTION...I figured it out!
 

samc

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Thanks guys for the feedback. This is my first time with WLP002, so I'll take your words of wisdom to heart and follow the advice.

I was curious about the hop schedule and possibly going to secondary. I doubt the fermentation will be complete before I'm supposed to do the 3rd day hop addition. I'm wondering if I should go from primary to secondary on the 3rd day (still actively fermenting) and then dry hop immediately OR whether I should leave it in primary and dry hop on the 3rd day and then go to secondary after the fermentation is complete. What should I do?

Sounds like you are confusing things a bit. Not sure where the 3rd day DH comes from? Let the beer primary for 10-14 days, check with hydrometer until you get a steady reading for a few days and then start your dry hopping. I only dry hop when the beer is still winding down the fermentation if I am in some kind of RUSH to get it done, otherwise I wait. Usually I DH for 5-10 days or just bag the leaf hops and do so in the serving keg for as long as it takes to finish the keg.
 
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I have a BOAT LOAD of people that come into the store and buy this clone recipe. I have tasted (not brewed) it and am blown away at how close this is to the real deal!

We sub the Horizon with Magnum and like others say its so little, in such a big beer who would know.

Thanks for posting it up Eric

Cheers
Jay
 

clark123456

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Sounds like you are confusing things a bit. Not sure where the 3rd day DH comes from? Let the beer primary for 10-14 days, check with hydrometer until you get a steady reading for a few days and then start your dry hopping. I only dry hop when the beer is still winding down the fermentation if I am in some kind of RUSH to get it done, otherwise I wait. Usually I DH for 5-10 days or just bag the leaf hops and do so in the serving keg for as long as it takes to finish the keg.

Yep, it was a novice brewer issue. :)

I figured it out this morning while sitting on the crapper and thinking about it. All is well now. I'm going to wait until the fermentation stops, go to secondary, then 3 days before I'm ready to bottle/keg I'll do the DH.
 

clark123456

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I have a BOAT LOAD of people that come into the store and buy this clone recipe. I have tasted (not brewed) it and am blown away at how close this is to the real deal!

We sub the Horizon with Magnum and like others say its so little, in such a big beer who would know.

Thanks for posting it up Eric

Cheers
Jay

I'm really anxious to taste it! The wort was awesome, so I fully expect the final product to rock.

Due to the cost of hops, this beer isn't one you brew to save a lot of money :) My direct cost per beer is almost the same as buying it at the store, but it sure will be much better knowing I brewed it and since it was my first AG.
 

samc

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Yep, it was a novice brewer issue. :)

I figured it out this morning while sitting on the crapper and thinking about it. All is well now. I'm going to wait until the fermentation stops, go to secondary, then 3 days before I'm ready to bottle/keg I'll do the DH.

No.... 3 days for DH is not enough for this beer. 7 days is better.

As to your costs, it should be a lot less than store bought. It cost me $49 to brew 11 gallons, which is in the $.40/12 oz bottle range.
 
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