Bru'n Water Sparge Calculation?

[-CHRIS-]

I am getting ready to brew an IPA and am using RO/DI water which I will build back up using Bru'n Water. I am using a 3 kettle eHERMS system and I fly sparge.

The mash additions make total sense to me, I am adding 4 gallons of water to the mash tun and am adding the correct amount of minerals to create the water profile I want.

Where I am really confused is the sparge calculation. I will likely have 8 gallons of water in my HLT, Beersmith suggests fly sparging with 6.5 gallons, and I only want to end up with an 8.4 gallon preboil volume.

What volume do I add into Bru'n Water to get the right profile? Right now, I am thinking about adding enough minerals into the HLT to create the right profile for the 8 gallons of sparge water.

Bru'n Water also suggests adding the sparge minerals directly into the boil kettle. How do I calculate the proper amount of minerals to add? What is the water volume?

Chris

 

[Natdavis777]

Are you wondering how much water to sparge with? If so, use whatever amount Beersmith tells you to use and just input that value (6.5gal) into the Bru'n Water sparge amount.

Since you are using RO/DI water, treat your mash water volume in your MLT with your "Mash Addition" suggestions per Bru'n Water. You do not need to treat the Sparge water while sparging with any minerals since you are using RO/DI water. You can drop the pH of the sparge water too much due to the lack of buffers in the water. Instead, add your "Sparge Addition" minerals to the Boil Kettle after you have collected all of your wort. This way, you still get the desired water profile.

I do for all beers. If I am brewing a dark beer and I have enough dark malt to get me to my desired mash pH before mineral additions, then I just save my "Mash Addition" and add both mash and sparge additions to the BK after all the wort is collected.

 

[-CHRIS-]

Are you wondering how much water to sparge with? If so, use whatever amount Beersmith tells you to use and just input that value (6.5gal) into the Bru'n Water sparge amount.

I can't do that since I always have water left in the MLT when I am done sparging. I will add too many minerals if I enter that number from beersmith.

Make sense?

Chris

 

[Natdavis777]

I can't do that since I always have water left in the MLT when I am done sparging. I will add too many minerals if I enter that number from beersmith.

Make sense?

Chris

Im not really following I guess. Im not sure why there is water left in the MLT.

I too, use a 3 vessel system and fly sparge. I add my heated mash water volume to the MLT and perform my mash, add minerals, etc. While I am mashing, I am heating my sparge water volume (which I calculate using Brew365.com) in my HLT. After the mash rest, the wort (mineral treated with mash addition) from the MLT is pumped to the BK, while water (untreated RO) from the HLT is trickled from the HLT through the top of the MLT. Once I collect 13 gal in my BK, I am done, and the rest of the wort that is left is pumped and discarded. I then add my sparge mineral additions to the BK to achieve the desired mineral profile.

So regardless if there is anything left in the MLT, the values you put in Bru'n Water (Mash/Sparge Vol) are what the minerals are calculated for, even if you have extra sparge water left over (because you are only sparging to hit the desired pre-boil volume)

 

[303Dan]

I am getting ready to brew an IPA and am using RO/DI water which I will build back up using Bru'n Water. I am using a 3 kettle eHERMS system and I fly sparge.

The mash additions make total sense to me, I am adding 4 gallons of water to the mash tun and am adding the correct amount of minerals to create the water profile I want.

Where I am really confused is the sparge calculation. I will likely have 8 gallons of water in my HLT, Beersmith suggests fly sparging with 6.5 gallons, and I only want to end up with an 8.4 gallon preboil volume.

What volume do I add into Bru'n Water to get the right profile? Right now, I am thinking about adding enough minerals into the HLT to create the right profile for the 8 gallons of sparge water.

Bru'n Water also suggests adding the sparge minerals directly into the boil kettle. How do I calculate the proper amount of minerals to add? What is the water volume?

Chris

For what it's worth, I use Bru'n water and fly sparge and I don't add anything directly to the boil kettle. I decide how much sparge water I need and use that amount on both the Sparge Water Adjustment tab (for acidifying) and also the sparge water amount field on the Water Adjustment tab (for mineral additions). Then I just sparge until I hit my boil volume. Works great for me.

 

[-CHRIS-]

Im not really following I guess. Im not sure why there is water left in the MLT.

I think I have figured out an issue with my equipment profile in Beersmith. I am using a keggle with false bottom that has a ton of space, which isn't deadspace, under the false bottom due to the dished bottom.

Thanks,
Chris

 

[OdeCloner]

I fly sparge with my HERMS system using my HLT water as well. My coil placement requires the HLT to be nearly full, so I always have leftover water in the HLT after I'm done sparging. You should make your mineral/acid additions based on the volume of water in the HLT, regardless of how much you actually take from it. It's about concentration.

For me, I leave sparge water volume in Bru'N Water at 15.5gal at all times, and make all additions based on that volume. In reality I only take perhaps 5-6gal from it depending on the beer. I use the rest of the water for cleanup.

I'd really like a kettle that didn't require it to be full to use the coil!

 

[-CHRIS-]

For me, I leave sparge water volume in Bru'N Water at 15.5gal at all times, and make all additions based on that volume. In reality I only take perhaps 5-6gal from it depending on the beer. I use the rest of the water for cleanup.

I'd really like a kettle that didn't require it to be full to use the coil!

That was my original thought as well. What do you do about chemicals that they don't suggest adding post mash such as chalk?

Chris

 

[OdeCloner]

That was my original thought as well. What do you do about chemicals that they don't suggest adding post mash such as chalk?

Chris

My starting water profile is pretty decent. I've only ever needed to add Kosher Salt (non-iodized salt), Gypsum and Lactic Acid to reach a broad number of profiles, so I don't have any experience with chalk, lime etc. I add my Gypsum and Salt directly to the HLT and mash water while they're heating up, stirring enough to make sure they're mixed in. When I hit my strike temps, I mash in and fire up the HERMS.

 

[Natdavis777]

I understand your question now. I was thrown off when you said you had water left over in the MLT. I think you meant to put HLT (of course I should have put that together though since that's where the coil is)

Glad you got things figured out for the most part

 

[303Dan]

I fly sparge with my HERMS system using my HLT water as well. My coil placement requires the HLT to be nearly full, so I always have leftover water in the HLT after I'm done sparging. You should make your mineral/acid additions based on the volume of water in the HLT, regardless of how much you actually take from it. It's about concentration.

For me, I leave sparge water volume in Bru'N Water at 15.5gal at all times, and make all additions based on that volume. In reality I only take perhaps 5-6gal from it depending on the beer. I use the rest of the water for cleanup.

I'd really like a kettle that didn't require it to be full to use the coil!

This exactly ^

This is what I was getting at, but he said it much better. And this is also exactly what I do with my HERMS system. I need 14.5 gallons of water to cover my HERMS coil, but usually only use 4-6 gallons of that for sparging.

 

[normonster]

This exactly ^



This is what I was getting at, but he said it much better. And this is also exactly what I do with my HERMS system. I need 14.5 gallons of water to cover my HERMS coil, but usually only use 4-6 gallons of that for sparging.

X2. Same here minus the HERMES...I just have some dead space in the HLT and want the water I use to be in range of the sight glass.

 

[StYak]

I am getting ready to brew an IPA and am using RO/DI water which I will build back up using Bru'n Water. I am using a 3 kettle eHERMS system and I fly sparge.

The mash additions make total sense to me, I am adding 4 gallons of water to the mash tun and am adding the correct amount of minerals to create the water profile I want.

Where I am really confused is the sparge calculation. I will likely have 8 gallons of water in my HLT, Beersmith suggests fly sparging with 6.5 gallons, and I only want to end up with an 8.4 gallon preboil volume.

What volume do I add into Bru'n Water to get the right profile? Right now, I am thinking about adding enough minerals into the HLT to create the right profile for the 8 gallons of sparge water.

Bru'n Water also suggests adding the sparge minerals directly into the boil kettle. How do I calculate the proper amount of minerals to add? What is the water volume?

Chris

I am trying to figure this out as well and still haven't figured it out after reading through all the posts in this thread. Please clarify if you have figured it out.

I am starting with 5 gallons of distilled in the mash tun and am using bru'n water for adjustments. I am fly sparging and will add remaining minerals into boil kettle. I will have 7 gal distilled in HLT, but need to figure out how much will go into boil kettle more specifically how to calculate boil mineral additions.

Should I estimate the grain will hold 1/2 qt/lb of grain (per John Palmer) resulting in 3.2 gallons "first runnings" in the kettle? Then figure running sparge to add the remaining 3.3 gallons to get to my desired 6.5 gallon starting boil volume. Hence adding mineral additions based on 3.3 gallons sparge volume into the bru'n water spreadsheet. Am I way off in this thinking?

If I calculate boil/sparge mineral additions based on the 7 gallons in the HLT, but I only run 5 gallons to reach my final boil volume, won't the boil mineral additions be too high because the spreadsheet was set to 7 gallons sparge?

Any help clarifying is greatly appreciated!

 

[acidrain]

I am trying to figure this out as well and still haven't figured it out after reading through all the posts in this thread. Please clarify if you have figured it out.

I am starting with 5 gallons of distilled in the mash tun and am using bru'n water for adjustments. I am fly sparging and will add remaining minerals into boil kettle. I will have 7 gal distilled in HLT, but need to figure out how much will go into boil kettle more specifically how to calculate boil mineral additions.

Should I estimate the grain will hold 1/2 qt/lb of grain (per John Palmer) resulting in 3.2 gallons "first runnings" in the kettle? Then figure running sparge to add the remaining 3.3 gallons to get to my desired 6.5 gallon starting boil volume. Hence adding mineral additions based on 3.3 gallons sparge volume into the bru'n water spreadsheet. Am I way off in this thinking?

If I calculate boil/sparge mineral additions based on the 7 gallons in the HLT, but I only run 5 gallons to reach my final boil volume, won't the boil mineral additions be too high because the spreadsheet was set to 7 gallons sparge?

Any help clarifying is greatly appreciated!

You should add minerals to the hot liqueur prior to sparging. The point is to treat the water so that the mash and sparge are within PH.

Threat all the hot liqueur, mash in and do your mash rest, then fly sparge to reach pre-boil volume.

 

[StYak]

You should add minerals to the hot liqueur prior to sparging. The point is to treat the water so that the mash and sparge are within PH.

Threat all the hot liqueur, mash in and do your mash rest, then fly sparge to reach pre-boil volume.

I have read that we should not treat the sparge but treat the boil. Am I wrong in this belief?

 

[jmark]

As long as you keep an eye on pH, not letting it get above 6.0, you can add the remainder of your salts to the BK. Presumably you've calculated the sparge water volume needed for your batch, so you can just throw in all the calculated salts into the BK... the grain has already absorbed all the water it's going to, so all of the calculated sparge water is going to end up in the kettle, if that makes sense?

 

[StYak]

As long as you keep an eye on pH, not letting it get above 6.0, you can add the remainder of your salts to the BK. Presumably you've calculated the sparge water volume needed for your batch, so you can just throw in all the calculated salts into the BK... the grain has already absorbed all the water it's going to, so all of the calculated sparge water is going to end up in the kettle, if that makes sense?

I see. Thanks for the clarification!