Brewzilla 65L USA 220v to European 220v?
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DuncB
Well-Known Member
Yes I'd suggest cutting the plug off and wiring the local plug on. These can be found in DIY shops and is straightforward. I wouldn't want to use a travel adapter with the current load of a 220V brewzilla.
You will find that water is different it comes out of the tap by the litre and that it boils at 100 centigrade.
You will find that water is different it comes out of the tap by the litre and that it boils at 100 centigrade.
Thanks DuncB...
If you have any info on what wires go where, that will help a lot - there seem to be more wires involved with the USA setup as it is compared to the 3 wires there...they have only a live, neutral and earth. 220 here involves 2 lives, neutral, ground, etc, etc... As the old saying goes "don't let the smoke out', and I realllly want to stick to that, and I get only 1 chance at it!
If you have any info on what wires go where, that will help a lot - there seem to be more wires involved with the USA setup as it is compared to the 3 wires there...they have only a live, neutral and earth. 220 here involves 2 lives, neutral, ground, etc, etc... As the old saying goes "don't let the smoke out', and I realllly want to stick to that, and I get only 1 chance at it!
DuncB
Well-Known Member
So six wires go into your plug or do you mean at the socket?
It's because you are on 110V and so need a 3 phase supply to get 220V at the socket. In Europe as you know it's fresh running 220V from the Live neutral and earth supply. But it gets complicated if you want 3 phase in Europe just the same but that gives you 450V which is more industrial but becoming a routine install in new builds as useful for higher rated car chargers.
It's because you are on 110V and so need a 3 phase supply to get 220V at the socket. In Europe as you know it's fresh running 220V from the Live neutral and earth supply. But it gets complicated if you want 3 phase in Europe just the same but that gives you 450V which is more industrial but becoming a routine install in new builds as useful for higher rated car chargers.
Does the neutral wire actually connect to anything in the Brewzilla (i.e. is there anything that runs on 120V - perhaps the pump.) Since the Brewzilla is from a non-USA company, it's likely that the 220V version uses a 220V pump, and does not actually use the neutral wire on your plug/outlet for anything. If this is the case, you don't need a 4-wire plug when you convert.
Is your current plug molded onto the cord, or is it removable? If removable what are the colors of the wire insulation going into the plug? If they happen to be brown, blue, and green/yellow, then brown is hot, blue is neutral, and green/yellow is ground. Then you just need to know which blades are hot, neutral, and ground on the new plug you want to use.
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This is incorrect. In the USA, houses are fed from a transformer with a 240V secondary winding that is center tapped. The center tap wire is bonded to ground in the service panel for the structure and the neutral bus in the service panel is connected to ground. If you connect to both ends of the source transformer, you get single phase 240V. One wire is 120V relative to ground/neutral, the other wire is also 120V relative to ground/neutral, but of opposite phase. If you connect to one end of the source transformer and the center tap you get 120V relative to ground/neutral. There is no 3-phase involved in 240V service to residences. If you only use 240V in an appliance, you only need three wires - hot 1, hot 2, and ground. If you have both 240V and 120V loads in an appliance, then you need four wires - hot 1, hot 2, neutral, and ground.
In Europe, and places with only 230V (220 - 240V depending on country) power systems the feed transformer has a 230V secondary winding, but that winding is not center tapped. In the service panel, one wire from the feed secondary is connected to the hot bus, and the other is connected to the ground/neutral bus. So, there is no 115V available.
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One thing you do need to worry about is that the pump on a USA system is rated to run on 60Hz AC, but Europe operates on 50Hz AC. You need to be sure that the pump in your unit will run ok on 50Hz.
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Brew on
Doug293cz...
I was writing back to DuncB, saying pretty much what you did about the split phase in the USA - thanks for finishing it for me!
The plug on the Brewzilla is a three pole - this makes me think that the Brewzilla power intake relies on the recombining of the split 110's BEFORE it gets to the socket, which means it will give it a pretty much european type feed into the Brewzilla - a hot, a neutral, and a ground/earth...which means that DuncB's first reply saying just cut the USA plug off, and attach the next country's regular 220/240v plug to the Brewzilla wires is valid...
This should mean that the control electronics, and the pump are catered to somehow within the Brewzilla factory wiring to be fed by 220/240 volts, or have a transformer to drop it to the required voltage, and I don't have to be concerned about that...
I'm just terrified about letting the smoke out!
I have emailed kegkand in china, who develops and builds these things, a number of times, but they don't bother to reply...
Your observations, please, Sir!
I was writing back to DuncB, saying pretty much what you did about the split phase in the USA - thanks for finishing it for me!
The plug on the Brewzilla is a three pole - this makes me think that the Brewzilla power intake relies on the recombining of the split 110's BEFORE it gets to the socket, which means it will give it a pretty much european type feed into the Brewzilla - a hot, a neutral, and a ground/earth...which means that DuncB's first reply saying just cut the USA plug off, and attach the next country's regular 220/240v plug to the Brewzilla wires is valid...
This should mean that the control electronics, and the pump are catered to somehow within the Brewzilla factory wiring to be fed by 220/240 volts, or have a transformer to drop it to the required voltage, and I don't have to be concerned about that...
I'm just terrified about letting the smoke out!
I have emailed kegkand in china, who develops and builds these things, a number of times, but they don't bother to reply...
Your observations, please, Sir!
DuncB
Well-Known Member
It will be straightforward to wire the unit as the european plugs have connectors for Earth neutral and live these are indicated with letters by the connectors and on pictures.
I have put a question in the Kegland questions thread on the Aussie forum so should get an answer in a couple of hours re the pump. It's still only 0800 in Melbourne so they might not be at work yet.
Sorry for delay started typing then had a patient to see. They do get in the way of the job ( Forum activity).
I have put a question in the Kegland questions thread on the Aussie forum so should get an answer in a couple of hours re the pump. It's still only 0800 in Melbourne so they might not be at work yet.
Sorry for delay started typing then had a patient to see. They do get in the way of the job ( Forum activity).
DuncB
Well-Known Member
For your info this is the thread and they do respond very promptly via this. I have also had very good response direct from Kee at Kegland via his email, which I will use if no joy through the forum. But I fully expect an answer via that route.
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/kegland-questions-and-answers.98306/page-327#post-1577496
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/kegland-questions-and-answers.98306/page-327#post-1577496
DuncB
Well-Known Member
I have taken my guten 70 which is a similar size and just another copy of the brewzilla apart and fitted a smartPID controller in place of the standard controller and there certainly is no difference really between the electrics inside and that of the Brewzilla 65.
I watched a video where a US owner did the same conversion on their brewzilla 65 and the electrics are the same as for a UK / australia brewzilla. No sign of a transformer or different motherboard.
I watched a video where a US owner did the same conversion on their brewzilla 65 and the electrics are the same as for a UK / australia brewzilla. No sign of a transformer or different motherboard.
Correct (usually.) I'm not a motor expert, so I don't fully understand everything in the link below.
https://www.electriciantalk.com/threads/can-a-60-hz-motor-run-on-50-hz.39729/
Brew on
DuncB
Well-Known Member
Hi
I bought the cube version ( don't think they make the Din version now) this link takes you to the product, scroll down to the homebrew bit for more info.
https://smartpid.com/products/
Basically you remove the control panel and electronics in the brewzilla and then wire this in. It's pretty straightforward, I managed it and have remotely helped with a friend another brewer to fit one in their system.
Instead of using a thermostat for on off control of the elements or having to switch elements on and off this has a small computer in it with an algorithm for temperature control. As the temperature approaches your target temperature the power input to the elements is reduced using a Solid State relay rather than the 30 amp relays on the brewzilla. This stops overshoot and also then maintains a steady state. Multiple mash steps can be programmed in, also there is control of boil power so you can have a gentle boil and more control. This is important on my system as I use a steam hat and condenser, without significant power reduction the boil would be out of control. I usually boil at about 30% power.
The SmartPID also controls the pump so it can be cycled during the mash ie every ten minutes it will turn off for your prescribed time and then restart. This lets the grain bed drain. It also cuts off the pump at a set temperature so you don't boil with the pump on. Starts the whirlpool etc.
You can add another sensor to measure temperature from another area of the system, say the top of the mash bed or plug it in to get temperature out of the counterflow chiller.
It can also control and run a separate HLT again with the algorithm, a further 12 V controller is in place for running another thing such as a powered mash stirrer ( I haven't done that).
It has a separate app and also integrates with brewfather so you can build the recipe and mash profile, export via wifi and then start it via the app, get alerts for additions etc.
It really is good, no overshoots now control within 0.3 celsius, doesn't need watching all the time transformational really.
I've done a few other modifications to my Guten such as a whirlpool fitting and three way on the recirculation to allow whirlpool and over the top recirculation at the same time if needed. This helps during the mash as the whirlpool mixes the dead space liquor / wort caught between the malt pipe and kettle wall. This was pointed out to me as an efficiency issue to me by @doug293cz , the suggestion of lifting the malt pipe during the mash doesn't work with the brewzilla because when you do this the bottom grille in the malt pipe can get dislodged, grain escapes etc. The Anvil I understand has a fixed malt pipe bottom so not an issue with those. The whirlpool during mash improved my efficiency and has of course helped during the end of boil phase to isolate hops and trub before transfer.
DuncB
Well-Known Member
You order it off the website I linked above, Davide is very helpful when emailed as well. I'd order it for arrival in Europe rather than post to the USA.
More than happy to help with the install, quite a dossier of pictures in the collection.
DuncB
Well-Known Member
Tell him Duncan from NZ sent you his way.
DuncB
Well-Known Member
My modifications also in BYO magazine page 15 July august under readers projects with some pictures.
Just to let everyone know. the US 240V is two phase, not single phase. There are two 110V lines 180 degrees out of phase from each other.
If the pump and control panel run on only one of the 110 phases, you could get a step down transformer to knock the 220 down to 110. However, any timing functions will have to be calculated for 50 Hz.
I suggest you contact the manufacturer for the best info.
If the pump and control panel run on only one of the 110 phases, you could get a step down transformer to knock the 220 down to 110. However, any timing functions will have to be calculated for 50 Hz.
I suggest you contact the manufacturer for the best info.
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I'd like you to connect line 1 and line 2 up to the inputs of an oscilloscope, and take a picture of the two 240V phase traces. The 240V is single phase. Because of the grounded center tap feed transformer, the 240V can be split into two 120V supplies that are 180 deg out of phase with each other, so yes there are two different phase 120V sources available within the service panel. Any given 120V outlet only has a single phase available. The USA system is referred to as "split phase."
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mrveeno..
I've tried contacting the manufacturer several times, but they could care less to answer... I guess their philosophy is if I fry the one I have, I will buy another... Obviously very caring and supportive of their customers...
I've tried contacting the manufacturer several times, but they could care less to answer... I guess their philosophy is if I fry the one I have, I will buy another... Obviously very caring and supportive of their customers...
The pump has induction motor so the speed will vary depending on frequenzy. It will work on both 50 and 60 Hz and there is probably even label on the motor telling the performance difference.Correct (usually.) I'm not a motor expert, so I don't fully understand everything in the link below.
https://www.electriciantalk.com/threads/can-a-60-hz-motor-run-on-50-hz.39729/
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https://www.kaixinpump.com/product/mp_6r_magnetic_drive_pump
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