Iceman2197
Well-Known Member
No, I believe this was it.
https://shop.brewcraftusa.com/en/di...ngs/top-shelf/top-shelf-chocolate-cream-35144
https://shop.brewcraftusa.com/en/di...ngs/top-shelf/top-shelf-chocolate-cream-35144
Boulder "Shake" Chocolate Porter
- Thread starter MetallHed
- Start date
Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:
seagondollar
Well-Known Member
The legwork on this beer has been amazing! Well done to all!
Is the *final* version of your recipe what's on the prior pages? Or did you tweak it slightly with the nestle syrup (that is what you used, correct?).
Do you mind reposting the final version, please (assuming it changed)?
didn't change it from what I posted.
Copy, but did you or did you not add a syrup of some sort (I think that's where my confusion lies...?)
seagondollar
Well-Known Member
I did, added 2 oz nesquick syrup. I did have to clear it with gelatin in the keg though.
You're going to lose all the flavour in fermentation...add it to secondary or at bottling...
Let it be known this has inspired me to try the Nestle syrup in an Andes mint stout. Base stout was usually pretty chocolatey in the past but due to a brewer's assistant mishap, my starter got tossed at pitching, so we had to use S-04. Not sure if it was that, but even with Nielsen-Massey chocolate extract, not very chocolatey (sweet or otherwise). The Nestle is definitely helping (2.5oz syrup by weight). Still pretty green overall so we'll see how it fares.
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2016
- Messages
- 335
- Reaction score
- 129
How'd this one end up?
I've brewed this recipe 7 times in the past year trying different variations. I dumped Nesquik syrup in my keg on the last batch and it was really really close of flavor. But adding chocolate syrup to my keg with all the extra sugars just weirded me out.
So I tried this extract. My brew recipe is damn close to identical to Seagondollar's post. I aged 8oz of roasted cocoa nibs for a week after fermentation completed. I used only 1/2 a bottle of this extract at kegging time. It's not 100% boulder shake flavor, but it's extremely similar. This extract added just the right amount of sweetness to compliment the flavor depth of the cocoa nibs. Only thing I might work on is thickening the mouthfeel a little bit.
I absolutely love this brew. I'm pretty stoked. Thanks for posting this link.
seagondollar
Well-Known Member
Awesome. I still have this beer with the Nesquick on tap, but I'm like you, next time I don't want to add it. Think I'll try this instead.
It's been another week and I still really like the flavor of this brew. Another week on the carbonation and the flavor seems to have settled in.
Always trying to improve on my favorite beer (chocolate porters), I think this is what I'm going to try on the next brew...
1) The roasted cocoa nibs add a bakers chocolate bitter taste. I like it, but I think 8oz might be a bit much. I'm probably going to cut this in half.
2) I unscientifically poured half of this extract into the keg and siphoned the beer onto it. I think I'd like just a bit more of this extract flavor in the beer on the next batch. It's a 50ml bottle. I might go 35ml or screw it and put the whole thing in.
3) Not sure what I want to add to increase the mouthfeel. 8oz of lactose seems like enough. Anyone have a suggestion?
Based on this thread and a few others that I found talking about Boulder Shake, I put together this extract version:
Giving that I have only started brewing this year, I'd be interested in any comments.
Code:
Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 2.30 gal
Post Boil Volume: 2.08 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal
Bottling Volume: 4.75 gal
Estimated OG: 1.062 SG
Estimated Color: 35.1 SRM
Estimated IBU: 23.7 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 0.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes
Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
18.00 oz Caramel Malt - 60L (Briess) (60.0 SRM) Grain 1 10.6 %
8.00 oz Carafoam (2.0 SRM) Grain 2 4.7 %
6.00 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3 3.5 %
4.00 oz Black Malt - 2-Row (Briess) (500.0 SRM) Grain 4 2.4 %
4.00 oz Chocolate Wheat (Weyermann) (415.0 SRM) Grain 5 2.4 %
16.00 oz Dark Dry Extract (17.5 SRM) Dry Extract 6 9.4 %
105.82 oz Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract 7 62.3 %
8.00 oz Milk Sugar (Lactose) (0.0 SRM) Sugar 8 4.7 %
0.75 oz Nugget [15.90 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 9 21.1 IBUs
0.50 oz Tettnang [5.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 10 2.7 IBUs
1.0 pkg American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [124.21 Yeast 11 -
4.00 oz Cocoa Nibs (Secondary 5.0 days) Spice 12 -
50.00 ml Chocolate Cream Extract (Bottling 0.0 mi Flavor 13 -Giving that I have only started brewing this year, I'd be interested in any comments.
Update on my previous comment.
I think I was enamored with chocolate flavor of the extract. After I got past the excitement of the rich chocolate flavor, I don't know if there was some sort of settling going on in the keg, the flavor really started to become overpowering.
So I brewed another batch (used a different yeast, WLP002) and wanted to try a different extract. So I tried: Top Shelf Creme de Cacao. To be clear, the Chocolate Creme extract is a much closer flavor to Boulder Shake than this one. But the flavor of this extract was very good. A darker chocolate taste with a very very minor tint of vanilla flavor. Anyhow, the reason I'm bringing this batch up is because I only put 15ml of the extract in and I still think the flavor was VERY strong.
My next batch is going to be using the Chocolate Creme and only 10ml of the extract. I could imagine how sickening 50ml would taste.
seagondollar
Well-Known Member
So honestly, what would you say tasted the best? Nesquick, chocolate cream, or the chocolate cream and creme de cacao combo? Next batch I don't want to use the nesquick, as i have to clear the keg wasting a few pints.
seagondollar
Well-Known Member
You might be close. Problem is, at least for me, extract tastes so much different. There was always a sort of off taste with my extract beers, and I think it had a lot to do with the malt. Oh well though, something to motivate you into All Grain.
Nesquick had good flavor. Was a mess in the keg and I get weirded out imagining crazy things that the sugars are doing.
I like the chocolate cream the most if you are going for similar to Boulder Shake. I'm going to use this extract again on my next batch, without dry nibbing any cacao nibs. Besides using too much 25-30ML flavor extract on the previous batch, I also think the dry nibbed cacao flavor wasn't right for a Boulder Shake clone.
I found out on the 9 versions of cocoa porters I've brewed in the past 2 years that I really like the added flavor of dry nibbing cacao nibs, but I'm not convinced that's the right flavor for a Boulder Shake clone. Dry nibbing creates a bitter chocolate flavor. I'm starting to think maybe they are using some cacao nibs in the boil like this recipe: Founders Breakfast Stout
Definitely a different flavor than Boulder, but I like the Creme De Cacao extract flavor. I'm going to go through a whole bunch of batches mixing extracts with and without boiling cacao nibs to see what I come up with.
Looks completely reasonable.
I started brewing my Boulder Shake as an extract beer. I always tweaking and fidgeting with recipes. The only minor thoughts that come to mind when I look at your recipe are:
1) Less Caramel Malt, more Chocolate Wheat. I'm in love with Chocolate Wheat. I think the extra SRM will help you on the final color being an extract beer.
2) Consider a debittered Black Malt. Not a critical change. I really think this grain is more in here for color, not flavor.
seagondollar
Well-Known Member
Interesting. I agree, the cacao nibs is not the flavor of shake, or at least not that he "dry nibbed" flavor. I'll have to try the creme de cacao flavoring. I'll be curious to see what you find out.
So I am not necessarily trying to replicate Boulder Shake but get close in the style. If anything I want the recipe to tilt a little toward sweet chocolate than bitter. Not sweet like "dessert", but more "neutral" to a touch of sweetness if that makes sense.
The big variables for me are the nibs and the extract. I dropped the nibs down to 4 oz but upped the extract in order to up the chocolate while lessening the bitter. Will 50ml be too much? I don't want the chocolate to be overpowering, but want to leave no doubt that it is there.
IMO, 25-30ml was WAY too much when I made my first batch with this Top Shelf extract. I don't know how to describe it, but it was overpoweringly flavored. At first I loved it because the milk chocolate flavor was so much better/closer than anything I had tried.
I'm seriously going to do 7.5ml to 10ml on my next batch.
Brewed another batch where I tossed in 2 oz of roasted cocoa nibs in the boil for the last 15 minutes. I added 7.5ml of the chocolate creme extract.
Good:
- The amount of flavoring added was finally not to overpowering. Good amount.
Bad:
- I have my kegs at a pretty cold temp because I'm lagering another beer at the same time. When I pour a pint and taste it at 35-40 degrees, the flavoring extract almost has a metallic flavor. Not very tasty. When the beer warms up to about 55-60 degrees, it has a much stronger "chocolate creme" taste, but in the back of my mind I still taste this subtle metallic flavor. I also noticed this with the batch I made with the creme de cacao flavoring. None of my other brews have this flavor issue, so I'm associating this with the flavoring extract.
Conclusion:
These flavor extracts are powerfully concentrated and initially I was really excited because it made a chocolate like flavor really "pop" out of this brew. Now that I've done several batches, I've learned the right concentration level to use, but I'm not really sure either taste that close to a Boulder. The Nesquick was miles closer. I'm kind of up in the air what to try next to get the chocolate flavor.
PS: I really struggled to notice what flavor contribution the cocoa nibs in the boil brought.
Good:
- The amount of flavoring added was finally not to overpowering. Good amount.
Bad:
- I have my kegs at a pretty cold temp because I'm lagering another beer at the same time. When I pour a pint and taste it at 35-40 degrees, the flavoring extract almost has a metallic flavor. Not very tasty. When the beer warms up to about 55-60 degrees, it has a much stronger "chocolate creme" taste, but in the back of my mind I still taste this subtle metallic flavor. I also noticed this with the batch I made with the creme de cacao flavoring. None of my other brews have this flavor issue, so I'm associating this with the flavoring extract.
Conclusion:
These flavor extracts are powerfully concentrated and initially I was really excited because it made a chocolate like flavor really "pop" out of this brew. Now that I've done several batches, I've learned the right concentration level to use, but I'm not really sure either taste that close to a Boulder. The Nesquick was miles closer. I'm kind of up in the air what to try next to get the chocolate flavor.
PS: I really struggled to notice what flavor contribution the cocoa nibs in the boil brought.
seagondollar
Well-Known Member
I really wonder what their using. Really wish there was another flavoring that was exact to Nesquick.
Ordered some chocolate extract from beanilla. I'll brew another batch in the next two weeks or so and try that. Should be done around Thanksgiving.
I'm also going to not add the chocolate extract initially. I haven't tasted the base porter recipe without chocolate in so long, I want to remind myself of the core flavor.
I'm also going to not add the chocolate extract initially. I haven't tasted the base porter recipe without chocolate in so long, I want to remind myself of the core flavor.
I put 7.5 mL in my batch and I definitely get that metallic taste.
I think you might be on to something with the temperature. I compared two glasses before I kegged, one with and one without, both at fermentation temp (~65). At the time, the additional flavor was mild and pleasant. Now in the keg at keezer temp (38 F) there is that off-flavor.
I think you might be on to something with the temperature. I compared two glasses before I kegged, one with and one without, both at fermentation temp (~65). At the time, the additional flavor was mild and pleasant. Now in the keg at keezer temp (38 F) there is that off-flavor.
I figured it out. The strange taste is not metallic; it's plasticy.
For this spot in my keezer I picked up vinyl tubing from a different supplier. I was under a time-crunch; guests were coming for a party in a few hours and had to get it working. I noticed it had a really strong vinyl smell when I hooked it up. That keg got kicked in a matter of three hours, so no beer sat in the lines for very long.
During my recent trials I've been sampling about 2 oz every so often. This means that what I am tasting is almost completely from the tubing. To change it up today I poured two 3 oz glasses.
The second glass tasted wonderful; it might even be able to handle a little extra extract.
The first glass had that strong overpowering plasticy flavor.
So, problem solved! I am ordering tubing from my normal supplier to replace that line.
AkTom
Well-Known Member
Great recipe. My son and his father in law came to visit. They loved it. I am saving 4 botttles to try at 1 year intervals. Picked up supplies for a 10 gallon batch. I'll add a bit of coffee to one carboy. Abit of coffee and coconut to the other carboy. I can't wait to get it brewed.
Cheers
AkTom
Well-Known Member
@seagondollar This really needs to be in the recipe section. 10 gallons in the fermentation chamber. Can't wait. Thanks.
@seagondollar thinking of adding the syrup to a chocolate peanut butter milk stout i have going. You mentioned you had to clear this beer with gelatin after adding. Why is that? My milk stout is darker than most. Brewers friend has it at 50 SRM. Im wondering if clearing this will be necessary for mine...?
I brewed this a few weeks ago, and while it's been awhile since I tried the original (about a year) I would say that this got me close enough to keep brewing it. I am not a huge fan of chocolaty beer, but have always loved Shake. After some research here, there and everywhere, I finally arrived at this.
I scaled it to 5 gallons for this post, so the numbers are rough:
60 minute boil
OG ~ 1.061
FG ~ 1.016
ABV ~ 5.9
Efficiency ~ 72%
Mash @ 150
8 lb 14 oz 2 row
14 oz Caramel 60
6 oz Chocolate Malt
4 oz Black Malt
4 oz Chocolate Wheat
13 oz Lactose (10 minutes)
.75 oz Nugget (60 minutes)
.75 oz Willamette (30 minutes)
.50 oz Mt. Hood (1 minute)
I'm unsure of the hop schedule, but I am pretty sure that at some point they changed the hops slightly. All I know is that what I brewed tasted and smelled magnificent.
Primary - 7 days
10oz Cholaca - Secondary (7 days)
4oz Cacao Nibs - Secondary (7 days)
I used Safale S-05 and carbed at 2.4
The "trade secret" ingredient is most likely Cholaca, which, coincidentally, is made in Boulder. It's basically a liquid form of Cacao, but I think the combo of that and the cacao nibs in this recipe give the beer a good balance of up front chocolate flavor with some deeper chocolate flavor that lasts until the finish.
I bottle conditioned this batch, and impatience got the best of me. I chilled and opened a bottle almost a week early, and it tasted so good that I chilled and drank another. From memory, it's very close, but like I said, it's been awhile since I have had the original.
Cheers.
I scaled it to 5 gallons for this post, so the numbers are rough:
60 minute boil
OG ~ 1.061
FG ~ 1.016
ABV ~ 5.9
Efficiency ~ 72%
Mash @ 150
8 lb 14 oz 2 row
14 oz Caramel 60
6 oz Chocolate Malt
4 oz Black Malt
4 oz Chocolate Wheat
13 oz Lactose (10 minutes)
.75 oz Nugget (60 minutes)
.75 oz Willamette (30 minutes)
.50 oz Mt. Hood (1 minute)
I'm unsure of the hop schedule, but I am pretty sure that at some point they changed the hops slightly. All I know is that what I brewed tasted and smelled magnificent.
Primary - 7 days
10oz Cholaca - Secondary (7 days)
4oz Cacao Nibs - Secondary (7 days)
I used Safale S-05 and carbed at 2.4
The "trade secret" ingredient is most likely Cholaca, which, coincidentally, is made in Boulder. It's basically a liquid form of Cacao, but I think the combo of that and the cacao nibs in this recipe give the beer a good balance of up front chocolate flavor with some deeper chocolate flavor that lasts until the finish.
I bottle conditioned this batch, and impatience got the best of me. I chilled and opened a bottle almost a week early, and it tasted so good that I chilled and drank another. From memory, it's very close, but like I said, it's been awhile since I have had the original.
Cheers.
Last edited:
Toast those cacao nibs in the oven till they start to brown and smell like chocolate cake. The difference is astounding vs non-toasted nibs, with a much richer chocolate flavor and higher potency. 4 oz toasted nibs plus 10 oz Cholaca should get you a great flavor. I have noticed that cholaca imparts a "dryness" such as you would get from straight non-fat cacao powder, so ending on the high end of the gravity range for a porter helps balance the dryness.
I roasted the nibs at 300 for 12, 14, 15, 16 and 18 minutes. We found 12 to be the best. Try it for yourselves. The taste changes rapidly when roasted.
AkTom
Well-Known Member
I need to brew this again.
I found two bottles of my first batch from back in November stashed in the back of my fridge yesterday. I cracked one open and it really tasted great. I had all of the ingredients so I brewed up another batch last night. Great recipe!
Just tap'd this last night. Yummy. Still a little flat but its only been 24 hours. I only used 6 oz cholaca into the keg. Hope it mixes in there.
It's a very minor tweak, but the only thing I am going to change in my recipe the next time I brew it is change around the Willamette and Mt Hood additions.
AkTom
Well-Known Member
I just need to brew it again.
Similar threads
