Boilcoil with voltage regulator

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bloke

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Hi,

I was thinking about getting a voltage regulator from ebay to lower the voltage sp the effect would be about 3800W from 5000W. Will this be bad for the boilcoil element and evebtually break it?
Yes I know there is a 3750w version but the size of it is too small for my kettle

Cheers
 

dyqik

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No, it's just a big resistor. It will run quite happily using either an SSVR, or PWM via an SSR to reduce the average output power.
 
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bloke

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Ok thanks! I also got a positive answer from Blichmann, so I guess it's ok.

I checked out the stilldragon. I seecot uses a SSR. What I understand it uses he full effect off the heating coil but SSR regulate it by flicking it on and off, so when its on it runs the coil with its full effect under och short period and then swithing off and so on.
It doesnt work for my because running it even a short time will blow the breakers.

Am I on the right track here regarding the stilldragon?

The cheep ebay voltage regulator for about 8$ did the jobb forcthe short time i tried it on another heating element. The cheep regulator may not last as long maybe.

Thanks for you replies guys! Keep em coming[emoji6]
 

augiedoggy

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Ok thanks! I also got a positive answer from Blichmann, so I guess it's ok.

I checked out the stilldragon. I seecot uses a SSR. What I understand it uses he full effect off the heating coil but SSR regulate it by flicking it on and off, so when its on it runs the coil with its full effect under och short period and then swithing off and so on.
It doesnt work for my because running it even a short time will blow the breakers.

Am I on the right track here regarding the stilldragon?

The cheep ebay voltage regulator for about 8$ did the jobb forcthe short time i tried it on another heating element. The cheep regulator may not last as long maybe.

Thanks for you replies guys! Keep em coming[emoji6]
If your breaker is popping when powering your boil coil then you do not have the correct wiring for the coil...what size wiring and breaker are you trying to use? it would have to be a 20a or smaller and even a 20a would likely run for a while before popping (not that im advising this)

I see what your trying to do though... make the 5000w only draw around 3500w so you can get away with the weaker wiring/breaker... it should work with the right type of regulator.
 

dyqik

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Ok thanks! I also got a positive answer from Blichmann, so I guess it's ok.

I checked out the stilldragon. I seecot uses a SSR. What I understand it uses he full effect off the heating coil but SSR regulate it by flicking it on and off, so when its on it runs the coil with its full effect under och short period and then swithing off and so on.
It doesnt work for my because running it even a short time will blow the breakers.

Am I on the right track here regarding the stilldragon?
No. The Still Dragon controller uses an SSVR, not an SSR, which gives a continuous and steady adjustment of the current allowed through the heating element.

This is somewhat different to SSR based PWM like the manual mode on a PID controller (although technically there is some switching going on, within each AC half-cycle) and it does not pulse the power output from the heating element like the manual mode of a PID controller hooked up to an SSR would. Of course, if the PWM cycle time is set low enough, the pulsing from the manual mode of a PID controller doesn't really matter too much.
 

dyqik

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If your breaker is popping when powering your boil coil then you do not have the correct wiring for the coil...what size wiring and breaker are you trying to use? it would have to be a 20a or smaller and even a 20a would likely run for a while before popping (not that im advising this)

I see what your trying to do though... make the 5000w only draw around 3500w so you can get away with the weaker wiring/breaker... it should work with the right type of regulator.
It will work with a SSVR like the StillDragon controller, as SSVRs limit the current in each AC cycle, which will be faster than the breaker. However, one slip of turning the power up too high will trip the breaker.

There's also the issue that the time taken for a breaker to trip depends on the amount of overcurrent. Setting the current a bit over the breaker limit might take a while to trip out the breaker, but it eventually will.

With careful choice of the pot and circuit that controls the SSVR, I guess you could limit the current to be under the breaker limit regardless of the control setting. If I was trying to do this, I'd definitely be installing a current meter on the controller to keep an eye on things (I would want one anyway for repeatability when setting boil strength).

But it's infinitely preferable to be able to use the full power of the boil coil (faster heating times!) and to never be able to go over the limit of the breaker and circuit even if the SSVR fails short. If you are stuck with 20A, then stick to a 3750W or 4400W heating element. Go for something other than a boilcoil if you have to.
 

augiedoggy

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It will work with a SSVR like the StillDragon controller, as SSVRs limit the current in each AC cycle, which will be faster than the breaker. However, one slip of turning the power up too high will trip the breaker.

There's also the issue that the time taken for a breaker to trip depends on the amount of overcurrent. Setting the current a bit over the breaker limit might take a while to trip out the breaker, but it eventually will.

With careful choice of the pot and circuit that controls the SSVR, I guess you could limit the current to be under the breaker limit regardless of the control setting. If I was trying to do this, I'd definitely be installing a current meter on the controller to keep an eye on things (I would want one anyway for repeatability when setting boil strength).

But it's infinitely preferable to be able to use the full power of the boil coil (faster heating times!) and to never be able to go over the limit of the breaker and circuit even if the SSVR fails short. If you are stuck with 20A, then stick to a 3750W or 4400W heating element. Go for something other than a boilcoil if you have to.
I will add that I have 4 4500w elements and none of them draw more than 18.4 amps... some as little as 17.1a at full power... they are all rated at max possible but are usually less when measured.
 

Natdavis777

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I will add that I have 4 4500w elements and none of them draw more than 18.4 amps... some as little as 17.1a at full power... they are all rated at max possible but are usually less when measured.
Same here. I have the 4500w BoilCoil and have never pulled over 19 amps. However, I still installed a 30a system for it to run off of.
 
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bloke

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I only have 16a breakers. If we want to run things with higher effect like for example sauna heating elements(i have 6.8KW) we run them on 3-phase 3x16a. Boilcoil cant tun on 3-phase.

Yes they usually are a couple of 100w lower than what they are said to be.

When i did the test earlier i used a voltage meter to be able to adjust it to right effect. I need to look into the stilldragon. Thanks
 
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