Blue Moon Clone

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ChiknNutz

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What yeast to most of you use, or is that too general of a question? Also, may I assume it is a standard 60 minute mash and boil? When I attempt this, I plan to go BIAB.
 

rtstrider

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What yeast to most of you use, or is that too general of a question? Also, may I assume it is a standard 60 minute mash and boil? When I attempt this, I plan to go BIAB.

Honestly I use 3944 fermented at 69F for the first 3 days or so then bump it up to 72F till it's done. US-05 is extremely bland and doesn't play well with a wit. I've tried US-05, Lallemand Belle Saison (VERY tart/dry), WB-06 (tart/dry crummy yeast all the way around imo), and Wyeast 3944. 3944 is where the buck stopped because that yeast was where it is at. As far as pitching goes I'll get a 1.5 liter 1.040 starter going on the stir plate, save 500ml for another batch and pitch the liter of yeast. That has darn fine esters! Other modifications I've made are I do a 20 min dough in at 122F (yes even when I was BIAB) then raise the temp up to 154F for 60 min or so. If you can sneak in some chamomile (use a full box of Bigelow Chamomile tea) at flameout even better! That makes a nice tasty wit :)

P.S. I got to taste test a flight of the White Lab wheat strains at the Asheville, NC location a few years ago. They were way too subdued and left a good bit to be desired. YMMV
 

Wayne1

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Any chance you can tell us which spice shop? I'm in Centennial and think I want to do this next.
The company was Italco, a wholesaler to the restaurant trade. Keep in mind the time I described was 25 years ago. I have no idea if the company is still around or what stock they carry now.

As was suggested in an earlier post, I believe the distinctive flavor of Blue Moon owes more to the coriander than the orange peel.


US-05 is extremely bland and doesn't play well with a wit.
Blue Moon is NOT a witbier. It is what I call an American Style WHITE Ale. It was specifically designed NOT to have that distinctive, spicy, estery, yeast character. If you want to make Blue Moon, you will NOT use anything other than a CLEAN yeast, such as US-05.
 

balrog

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THe spicy pheonlic "clove" yeast is typical with a Witbier.
I personally do not like that phenolic at all.
I use WY1007 fermented at 60F
I have tried using Mighty Axe Julius hops to accentuate orange, with mixed results.
I am intrigued at the thought of the Voss Kveik orangey esters but have not tried it yet.
 

ChiknNutz

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The company was Italco, a wholesaler to the restaurant trade. Keep in mind the time I described was 25 years ago. I have no idea if the company is still around or what stock they carry now.

As was suggested in an earlier post, I believe the distinctive flavor of Blue Moon owes more to the coriander than the orange peel.



Blue Moon is NOT a witbier. It is what I call an American Style WHITE Ale. It was specifically designed NOT to have that distinctive, spicy, estery, yeast character. If you want to make Blue Moon, you will NOT use anything other than a CLEAN yeast, such as US-05.

I am about to embark on a batch and back in your oft-quoted post #429 you suggest using SafAle S-04 or [LalBrew] Windsor as opposed to US-05 or Wyeast 1056 as the latter two might be too dry. Do you still recommend S-04 or Windsor?
 

Wayne1

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That looks just like the recipe I posted on here, many years ago. The addition of the Munich will give a bit of body and small amount of color.
 

ChiknNutz

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I don't have any of the Hallertau Mittelfruh hops, are there other good alternatives?

Here's what I have on hand:

Hops - Amarillo
Hops - Cascade
Hops - Citra
Hops - Galaxy
Hops - Hallertau Blanc
Hops - Mosaic
Hops - Magnum
Hops - Warrior
 

Wayne1

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If you are looking to make a faithful recreation of Blue Moon Belgium White, then you should minimize hop flavor. You only want a small amount of hop bitterness to balance the sweetness of the malts. Let the spices be the major flavor element.
 

hamachi

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Wayne1, I want to offer my personal thanks for your 13 year(!) contribution to this thread. Your advice has been very helpful to a guy who only started homebrewing last August. Using the info you provided back on page 1, I have already made one Blue Moon clone which was popular with the wife and neighbors.

I will be attempting another this weekend. My wife loves Blue Moon but wants something lighter, so I'll be reducing the OG a bit. I'll be doing a split batch and throwing blueberries into one of the fermenters after a few days to create a "Blueberry Moon". (I've had one successful blueberry wit already, so I'm optimistic.)
 

bricks

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I just finished reading all 1,374 posts in this thread! Wow, what a lot of great information. Big thanks to Wayne1, Nilo, and a few others who have put forth such a wealth of knowledge and experience. I have been out of home brewing a few years, and am looking to get back into it. Did mostly extract with steeping grains, but I did do a couple of all grain batches. They didn't turn out all that great, and I blame that on using tap water without any kind of addition of anything. I feel like I might try Wayne1's first recipe or Nilo #12, as I really do like Blue Moon. If I decide to go ahead and give it a go, will keep posted on status!
 

Jhedrick83

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Wayne1, I want to offer my personal thanks for your 13 year(!) contribution to this thread. Your advice has been very helpful to a guy who only started homebrewing last August. Using the info you provided back on page 1, I have already made one Blue Moon clone which was popular with the wife and neighbors.

I will be attempting another this weekend. My wife loves Blue Moon but wants something lighter, so I'll be reducing the OG a bit. I'll be doing a split batch and throwing blueberries into one of the fermenters after a few days to create a "Blueberry Moon". (I've had one successful blueberry wit already, so I'm optimistic.)

I second that. Just brewed my first attempt at this recipe last night. Can’t wait to try it and neither can my wife.
 

Mark3885

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I’m brewing this as we speak 10 gallons
10 lbs Briess 2 row
10 lbs White Wheat
2 lbs flaked oats
1 lb rice hulls
2 oz Hallertau mittlefruher
2.5 oz ground coriander
1 oz Valencia sweet orange peel
Mash at 153 for 60 min
Ferment with S-05 at 66F 1 week
Cold crash gradually down to 38 for 1 week
All electric system
 

ChiknNutz

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FYI, I brewed this just over a month ago and found the overall flavor profile quite underwhelming (5G packaged). Although I used 1.5 oz of orange peel and 0.6 oz of coriander, neither of those flavors came thru. I used Hallertau Blanc and find it imparts an Earl Grey tea flavor...which is not bad but certainly different than Blue Moon.
 

ChiknNutz

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According to Wayne 1, the coriander to orange peel should be 3 to 1 ratio

Not if you go by the revised recipe in post #429 of this thread. I used Safale S-04 yeast.

1622246405857.png
 

Wayne1

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All of the suggestions made through out this thread, are just that, suggestions.

I do feel you need to make this recipe 3-4 times and adjust the spicing to fit the exact ingredients, your system and your tastes.

The 3 to 1 suggestion came when I was brewing 500 gallons of this beer at a time. The efficiency of those systems are quite a bit different than 5-6 gallons.

So play with it. Find out what works for you.

I just made a variant using lemongrass powder and whole toasted coriander, then fresh ground. It is not Blue Moon, but it might taste good.
 

balrog

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Is there a final recipe?

"Final"?

Hard to say. Your system and your spices will be slightly different than what's used by big batch and their spices. You really do have to try it a couple times to tweak it, but that's why this is a "hobby" <slash obsession>. For instance, I bought a 10oz coriander online, to bulk buy, and the stuff is insipid -- very little flavor. The amount I have to use is radically different than some McCormick seeds I used.

I say give it a go with #6, #429 or even try Nilo#12. See what you like best.
 

z-bob

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I've only read the first and last page, not the 33 pages in between. If you can get Schell's Hefeweizen beer, it is unfiltered and unpasteurized. (might have to wait until next year if it's seasonal) I don't know what yeast they use, but it brews clean except for a very slight clove phenolic. You can culture the yeast from the dregs of a can or two; I've done it. (and I should have saved some)
 

TBA

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Finally putting the BM clone on the short list. Read this thread a long time ago but just getting ‘round to it. I have used Omega Bonanza for a couple of milkshake IPAs and it is very good yeast. ICYDK, they removed the gene that produces the clove. I like to use a yeast for several brews in a row then move on to something else. What do you think of Bonanza for Blue Moon clone?


This is Lalemand Voss Kveik, pitched at half prescribed rate to stress the yeast, fermented at 95F, using the Nilo#12 recipe, orange/tangerine is pronounced,

I have also under pitched/high temp Voss Kveik on another ale. Definitely got the tangerine flavor. It faded by 3 weeks and the Kveik twang became present. Did that happen to you?
 

balrog

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I have also under pitched/high temp Voss Kveik on another ale. Definitely got the tangerine flavor. It faded by 3 weeks and the Kveik twang became present. Did that happen to you?

I take beer when I go play tennis. Having a keg last more than 2 to 2-1/2 weeks would be a momentous happening. Very few tennis players I know are picky free beer drinkers.

The tangerine does mute a little with time, I presume as the yeast settles out. The Kveik hoppy pale ales I've made have all been fermented in the keg, with a floating dip tube. Not sure I've ever, or would ever, notice a "twang", mostly because of the Citra/Mosaic/Galaxy/Bergamot/Azacca/Whatever hops.
 

GAMERBREWING

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Oh I have a clone for Blue Moon that improves on the original for you. Keg gets drained quick as heck by all my neighbors everytime I make it.

5 lbs Pale Malt
5 lbs White Wheat Malt
1 lbs Oats, Flaked
8.0 oz Carapils (Briess)
8.0 oz Munich 10L (Briess)

1.35 oz Hallertauer 60.0 min
0.40 oz Coriander Seed (Boil 10.0 mins)
0.50 oz Orange Peel, Sweet (Boil 5.0 mins)

Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05)

Mash at 153
 

dmaxweb

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I'm doing a blue moon clone tomorrow. I stopped by my friendly local craft brewery for some fresh US-05 slurry. They also had some fresh LalBrew New England Ale slurry. The brewmaster suggested trying 50/50 for the blue moon. I'm not shooting for the perfect blue moon. It just sounded pretty good to me. Any opinions on this?

Pint jars
20221111_140154.jpg

From the Lallemand website:
LALBREW NEW ENGLAND™
LalBrew New England™ is an ale strain selected specifically for its ability to produce a unique fruit forward ester profile desired in East Coast styles of beer. A typical fermentation with LalBrew New England™ will produce tropical and fruity esters, notably stone fruits like peach. Through expression of a β-glucosidase enzyme, LalBrew New England™ can promote hop biotransformation and accentuate hop flavor and aroma. LalBrew New England™ exhibits medium to high attenuation with medium flocculation, making it a perfect choice for East Coast style ale
 
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rtstrider

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I'm doing a blue moon clone tomorrow. I stopped by my friendly local craft brewery for some fresh US-05 slurry. They also had some fresh LalBrew New England Ale slurry. The brewmaster suggested trying 50/50 for the blue moon. Any opinions on this?

Pint jars
View attachment 786014

From the Lallemand website:
LALBREW NEW ENGLAND™
LalBrew New England™ is an ale strain selected specifically for its ability to produce a unique fruit forward ester profile desired in East Coast styles of beer. A typical fermentation with LalBrew New England™ will produce tropical and fruity esters, notably stone fruits like peach. Through expression of a β-glucosidase enzyme, LalBrew New England™ can promote hop biotransformation and accentuate hop flavor and aroma. LalBrew New England™ exhibits medium to high attenuation with medium flocculation, making it a perfect choice for East Coast style ale
It definitely shouldn't give any belgian-y flavors. If the New England strain is Conan as I suspect it may add a slickness and some really nice apricot esters. Try it and report back!
 

dmaxweb

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I'll report back on the progess.

Planned Ingredients for 11.25 gallons @ 83.5% efficiency
1.5 tsp 5.2 pH Stabilizer - added during mash
16.0 oz Rice Hulls - added during mash 60 m
5 lb (25.0%) Standard 2-Row; Rahr - added during mash 60 m
5 lb (25.0%) Pilsner Malt; Weyermann® - added during mash 60 m
7.5 lb (37.5%) White Wheat Malt; Briess - added during mash 60 m
2.0 lb (10.0%) Oats Flaked - added during mash 60 m
8 oz (2.5%) German CaraFoam - added during mash 60 m
2 oz (100.0%) Hallertauer Mittelfrüher (4.6%) - added during boil, boiled 90 m
1 oz Corriander ground (dried) - added during boil, boiled 10 m
2 oz Valencia Orange Peel (dried) - added during boil, boiled 5 m

Edit: Hops were Hallertauer Tradition
 
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dmaxweb

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Update
11/12/22 Brew Day
Original Gravity 1.052
Target Terminal Gravity 1.010
Ferment @ 68F

11/19/22 (1 week)
S.G. 1.019
Orange aroma has noticeably decreased.
PXL_20221119_202121072.jpg
 
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dmaxweb

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Update
11/12/22 Brew Day
Original Gravity 1.052
Target Terminal Gravity 1.010
Ferment @ 68F

11/19/22 (1 week)
S.G. 1.019
Orange aroma has noticeably decreased.
Update
11/26/22 total of 2 weeks in the fermenter
Terminal gravity spot on at 1.010.
The taste and aroma are great right out of the fermenter.
Kegged and lagering on CO2 at 39F

Now a good problem. I have a bountiful yeast harvest. This is 1200 ml (500ml yeast) of
US-05/LalBrew New England blend. I plan on making another Blue Moon in about a month using some of this. Between now and then, I'd like to make something else using this yeast. Any suggestions?
PXL_20221127_114603890.jpg
 

CleanEmUpIves

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I'll report back on the progess.

Planned Ingredients for 11.25 gallons @ 83.5% efficiency
1.5 tsp 5.2 pH Stabilizer - added during mash
16.0 oz Rice Hulls - added during mash 60 m
5 lb (25.0%) Standard 2-Row; Rahr - added during mash 60 m
5 lb (25.0%) Pilsner Malt; Weyermann® - added during mash 60 m
7.5 lb (37.5%) White Wheat Malt; Briess - added during mash 60 m
2.0 lb (10.0%) Oats Flaked - added during mash 60 m
8 oz (2.5%) German CaraFoam - added during mash 60 m
2 oz (100.0%) Hallertauer Mittelfrüher (4.6%) - added during boil, boiled 90 m
1 oz Corriander ground (dried) - added during boil, boiled 10 m
2 oz Valencia Orange Peel (dried) - added during boil, boiled 5 m

Edit: Hops were Hallertauer Tradition

The 5.2 pH Stabilizer is most likely not helping (or hurting) your mash but it's certainly not performing the function you think it is.

It's best to use a brewing water calculator or spreadsheet to determine the necessary water additions to hit your mash pH target.

If using tap water get it tested (Ward Labs) to determine the makeup (Alkalinity, Calcium, Magnesium, Sodium, Chloride, Sulfate).

If using RO or Distilled then it's like starting with a blank slate.

If the recipe is correctly entered the spreadsheet below estimates a distilled water mash pH of 5.86. If using tap water, inputting those parameters into the spreadsheet would change that estimate depending on its makeup.

This would then be adjusted up or down (to your desired mash target pH) using the recommended acid/base and mineral additions.

1669561671530.png
 

dmaxweb

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The 5.2 pH Stabilizer is most likely not helping (or hurting) your mash but it's certainly not performing the function you think it is.

It's best to use a brewing water calculator or spreadsheet to determine the necessary water additions to hit your mash pH target.

If using tap water get it tested (Ward Labs) to determine the makeup (Alkalinity, Calcium, Magnesium, Sodium, Chloride, Sulfate).

If using RO or Distilled then it's like starting with a blank slate.

If the recipe is correctly entered the spreadsheet below estimates a distilled water mash pH of 5.86. If using tap water, inputting those parameters into the spreadsheet would change that estimate depending on its makeup.

This would then be adjusted up or down (to your desired mash target pH) using the recommended acid/base and mineral additions.

View attachment 792806
We have multiple water sources in James City County. Four treatment plants using aquifer wells, desalination plants (R.O), and reservoirs. It's tested for quality and contaminates of course but the make up varies by demand and is not consistent. I do use an activated carbon water filter.

I know I could use distilled and I may try that. But for now I have no complaints. Plus 15 gallons of distilled water for a 10 gallon batch is additional $15 plus the costs of chemicals.
 
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CleanEmUpIves

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We have multiple water sources in James City County. Four treatment plants using aquifer wells, desalination plants (R.O), and reservoirs. It's tested for quality and contaminates of course but the make up varies by demand and is not consistent. I do use an activated carbon water filter.

I know I could use distilled and I may try that. But for now I have no complaints. Plus 15 gallons of distilled water for a 10 gallon batch is additional $15 plus the costs of chemicals.

If you have no complaints that's great but you may be able to save some money by simply not using it.

At best it will keep your mash from rising above ~5.8 pH and at worst it will add too much sodium to your beer.


If you're at all interested in adjusting your tap water and own a pH meter or are even just willing to do a simple alkalinity test then this may be of interest to you:

 
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