Black Barleywine?

[drainbamage]

So, I've been playing around with a recipe for a black barleywine. Not an imperial stout, mind you, I want to skip the roasted/burnt character and go for a smoother maltiness. Here's what I'm thinking as a 1-gal AG test batch:

78% 3.75 lb. 2-row
3% 3 oz. Carafa I
2% 2 oz. Caramel 60L
2% 2 oz. Caramel 120L
1% 1 oz. Special B
10% 8 oz. Molasses

Mash @ 150* for 60 min.

0.25 oz. Nugget 14.3 - 60 min.
0.33 oz. Chinook 12.0 - 30 min.
0.67 oz. Chinook 12.0 - 5 min.

WLP001 California Ale yeast

Thoughts? Is the Carafa I good as a darkening agent, or should I go for something else like Midnight Wheat or Blackprinz?

 

[Psylocide]

Can't you just brew a regular Barleywine and tell people that it identifies as black?

 

[Brettomomyces]

Can't you just brew a regular Barleywine and tell people that it identifies as black?

If you add some sinnamar when you serve it maybe? Gotta replicate the bronzing somehow...

But about beer...maybe some of the dehusked carafe 3? And then add during vorlauf to keep the acridity down. Ground fine would probably give a lot of color.

 

[drainbamage]

Can't you just brew a regular Barleywine and tell people that it identifies as black?

Well I could, but then I couldn't print a bunch of copies of this (changed to A Bigger Blacker Ale) as labels.

View attachment 1434739948480.jpg

 

[hanuswalrus]

From what I've read/heard, Midnight wheat and Carafa Special III Dehusked are good options for darkening without adding too much roastiness.

 

[drainbamage]

Is there a big difference between Carafa I and III? I used III a few years ago on a black IPA and it seemed to lend some raisin-y notes, especially after it had sat for a while.

 

[m00ps]

yeah, and Blackprinz from Briess works very well. Both it and midnight wheat are my go-tos. They are a bit darker than carafa III and have less bitterness. Midnight wheat is my personal fav. theres also a newer dehusked roasted malt called Perla Negra, but its not as dark as carafa III

Theres a pretty big difference from carafa I to III. Carafa I is much less kilned so less color, less roast flavor. Like crystal 60 to crystal 120. It would take a bunch more carafa I to get a black colored beer than you would need carafa III

 

[TAK]

Sounds cool. I'd definitely recommend 2 things.

- using a huskless roasted grain will help give you color without as much roast flavor. As mentioned, I think midnight wheat and special carafa are good options, and I've used both for black IPAs.

- Grinding the roasted grain to a powder will help you get the most color from the least amount. I use my coffee mill.

 

[poptarts]

Sounds like you want a baltic porter
http://www.boomchugalug.com/product/ya-dats-gude-baltic-porter/


http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style12.php

 

[drainbamage]

yeah, and Blackprinz from Briess works very well. Both it and midnight wheat are my go-tos. They are a bit darker than carafa III and have less bitterness. Midnight wheat is my personal fav. theres also a newer dehusked roasted malt called Perla Negra, but its not as dark as carafa III

Theres a pretty big difference from carafa I to III. Carafa I is much less kilned so less color, less roast flavor. Like crystal 60 to crystal 120. It would take a bunch more carafa I to get a black colored beer than you would need carafa III

Cool, I think I might switch to Blackprinz. I haven't used it yet, but whenever I hear it mentioned around here it sounds pretty mild.

Sounds like you want a baltic porter
http://www.boomchugalug.com/product/ya-dats-gude-baltic-porter/


http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style12.php

Kinda, maybe somewhere between that and an imperial black IPA. I do still plan on keeping the hops pretty prominent. I know Baltic porter usually uses a lager yeast and I'm planning on aging for a while anyway, so I could see that working.

 

[feinbera]

Seems like a lot of molasses?

Take this with a grain of salt (hmmm... that and a bit of kettle souring, and you've got a black barleywine gose... sorry ) as I've never brewed with the stuff, but I read up on it in planning an imperial stout, and from what I can tell, folks were using 4-8oz per five-gallon batch, and even then, some found it a little overwhelming flavor-wise.

 

[JKaranka]

Invert #4, sinamar or brewer's caramel might help:-D

 

[drainbamage]

Seems like a lot of molasses?

Take this with a grain of salt (hmmm... that and a bit of kettle souring, and you've got a black barleywine gose... sorry ) as I've never brewed with the stuff, but I read up on it in planning an imperial stout, and from what I can tell, folks were using 4-8oz per five-gallon batch, and even then, some found it a little overwhelming flavor-wise.

Looking back through my brew log, I used 8 oz. in a brown ale once. That was 5 gallons, and it didn't have a huge presence flavor-wise, but it did thin the body out a bit more than I liked. I'd like little bit of rum-like character without it taking over. I'll try cutting the molasses back to 4 oz.

That now puts me at:

83% 3.75 lb. 2-row
4% 3 oz. Blackprinz
2% 2 oz. Caramel 60L
2% 2 oz. Caramel 120L
1% 1 oz. Special B
5% 4 oz. Molasses

Mash @ 150* for 60 min.

0.25 oz. Nugget 14.3 - 60 min.
0.33 oz. Chinook 12.0 - 30 min.
0.67 oz. Chinook 12.0 - 5 min.

WLP001 California Ale yeast

 

[drainbamage]

I went to the LHBS today...turns out they were out of Blackprinz so I went back to Carafa I and a fine grind. I'm hoping to brew later this week.