Belgian dubbel with USO 5?

[geom44]

Brewing soon but I need help. Is it hopeless to brew a Belgian dubbel with USO 5 yeast? This is the current recipe, can it work with the yeast?

% or IBU
12.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 75.00 %
2.00 lb Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 12.50 %
0.50 lb Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 3.125 %
0.50 lb Chocolate Malt Grain 3.125 %
1.00 oz Czech Saaz (60 min) Hops 3.125 %
1/5 oz Orange peel (10min)
1/5 tsp Peppercorn (5-1min) Spice ?
0.50 oz Chinook (5 min) Hops ?
1.50 lb Candi Sugar, Light/Gold (0.5 SRM) Sugar 6.25 %
1 Pkgs USO 5 Yeast Yeast-Ale

 

[RM-MN]

I may be wrong but as I understand Belgian beers, you need the flavors that the Belgian yeasts produce to get the character. Used properly, US-05 makes a clean ferment so you would not be making a Belgian beer.

 

[HB_in_Subic]

Belgian yeasts tend to lend off some fruity estery type tastes. Also if my math is correct, you are looking at a Belgian with at least 9%ABV. You will need at least 2 packages of yeast whichever you choose. I prefer Mangrove Jack's M27 Belgian Ale Yeast. It operates at 78F-90F and tolerates up to 14% alcohol. It produces some nice fruity esters.

 

[porterpounder]

US-05 is not going to produce a Dubbel. Have to go with a Belgian Strain. What you have there is a very malt-forward spiced amber ale.

 

[beergolf]

Belgians are very yeast dependent for their flavors.

I agree with RM-MN and porterpounder. It is not going to be a Dubbel using US 05.

 

[balauru_327]

Maybe if you ferment at higher temp you will obtain some little esters. I don`t see your targeted gravity. Put a location to increase your chances of receiving a belgian strain from a "neighbor". I don`t know the Chinook, but the Saaz works great added to the end of boil for aroma, to make a good dubble.
And if you don`t have a choice, put some coriander, make it a minimum 8-9%ABV and you will have a pseudo-dubble.

 

[HumulusHead]

if you ferment us05 at high temps you will throw some esters for sure. like start fermenting around 74 and you will def get some esters. maybe even try higher like 76.

i just dont think the esters you will get will be likable. can't say they will even be comparable to belgian yeast style esters. ive only experienced us05 esters in pale ales though and in that type of beer is not where you want those types of esters. but who knows, it may work out for ya!

 

[HumulusHead]

i'd be really interseted to hear results if you do end up doing this though. i use us05 for all my beers if i can help it, but have never tried it in a belgian. you may be on to something here as far as im concerned, if it works out.

 

[sumbrewindude]

Try T-58 or Abbaye, both from Fermentis. Either will be more Belgian than US05 and are still dry yeast.

Spoiler - IMO, if you want to make anything Belgian, pony over the cash for liquid yeast immediately. Don't even fool around with dry yeast - and I love using dry yeast where ever I can.

 

[geom44]

Ok, because US05 is the only yeast I have on hand and today is the only day I can brew for a few weeks, I'm gonna go ahead and try this recipe and ferment around 75F. Ill try to remember to get back with some results in a few weeks. I messed with some spice and sugar proportions so let me know if I'm gonna go into a disaster here.

Dubbel Custom

12.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 75.00 %
2.00 lb Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 12.50 %
0.50 lb Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 3.125 %
0.50 lb Chocolate Malt Grain 3.125%
1.00 oz Czech Saaz (60min) Hops
10.00 g Coriander (10min) Spice
8.00 g Orange peel (10min) Spice
7.00 g Peppercorn (5-1min) Spice
0.50 oz Chinook (5 min) Hops
2.0 lb Candi Sugar, Light/Gold (0.5 SRM)Sugar 6.25 %
1 Pkgs USO 5 Yeast Yeast-Ale

 

[peterj]

I would not try to ferment it at 75F. You're just going to ruin the beer. You'll get off tasting esters and a ton of fusel alcohols. It's not going to taste like a Belgian, it will just have a hot alcohol and weird ester taste and will probably give you some nasty headaches.

If you're going to use US-05 ferment it in the proper range and just take what you get. I agree with the others that Belgian beers are highly dependent on the Belgian yeast flavors so you won't end up with a true Belgian dubbel. But, with the malt bill, spices, and candi sugar it may end up somewhat reminiscent of a dubbel.

But if you ferment it with US-05 too hot it's just going to be a bad beer.

 

[peterj]

Also, I might cut that 0.5 oz of Chinook at 5 minutes if you want it to be more towards a classic dubbel. Dubbels don't really need much late hopping and definitely not with American hops.

 

[ChillWill]

You'll get a reasonable flavour off the malt for a dubbel, but the yeast isn't ideal.

I'd drop the end of boil hops, or bitter with the chinook and use saaz at end of boil. I don't think the likes of Chinook have any place as an aroma hop in a Belgian dubbel, much as I like it.

 

[beergolf]

I would not try to ferment it at 75F. You're just going to ruin the beer. You'll get off tasting esters and a ton of fusel alcohols. It's not going to taste like a Belgian, it will just have a hot alcohol and weird ester taste and will probably give you some nasty headaches.

If you're going to use US-05 ferment it in the proper range and just take what you get. I agree with the others that Belgian beers are highly dependent on the Belgian yeast flavors so you won't end up with a true Belgian dubbel. But, with the malt bill, spices, and candi sugar it may end up somewhat reminiscent of a dubbel.

But if you ferment it with US-05 too hot it's just going to be a bad beer.

I agree. Fermenting that hot, especially during the the beginning of fermentation runs a big risk of fusels. Not Good.

If you are set on brewing, ferment it a the proper temps and take what you get.

 

[solbes]

Certainly start off the fermentation (first 2 days) at low temps with the US-05. If you want some esters, you can start to ramp from there (though I would not go for 75). Maybe slowly ramp it up to 70 or 71 over the next 4-5 days.

Or as others said, a better approach may be just to ferment in the mid 60's for most of the fermentation. Its not going to taste "Belgian" anyway you slice it with US-05. But it should make tasty beer nonetheless.

 

[geom44]

Well, she turned out as a really nice stout/porter. We went ahead and fermented in proper ale temps (she might have hit 80 F for a day or so) but we let it sit in the carboy for about 4-5 weeks before kegging which probably helped cause its one of our best beers yet. The quality could also be attributed to our ever evolving brewing skills but either way, its been getting great reviews and doesnt have that distinct homebrew taste. Thanks for the tips guys.

 

[socjiuyon]

you may be on to something here as far as im concerned, if it works out.

 

[geom44]

Here was the final cut just in case anyone wants to try:
12.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 75.00 %
2.00 lb Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 12.50 %
0.50 lb Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 3.125 %
0.50 lb Chocolate Malt
1.00 oz Czech Saaz (60 min)
10.00 g Coriander (10min)
8.00 g Orange peel (10 min)
7.00 g G. Peppercorn (5-1 min)
0.50 oz Chinook (5 min)
2.0 lb Candi Sugar, Light/Gold (0.5 SRM)
1 Pkgs USO 5 Yeast Yeast-Ale

 

[MrHopScotch]

If you're feeling curious, you should try brewing the same beer with a belgian strain just so you can compare for future batches. I did something like this where I used the same malt and hops for a red ale and did one with 1272 and one with wlp530. Extremely interesting comparison.