Beer of the Week #15: USA ESB vs English ESB?

[Brewpastor]

What about a side by side comparison of a US ESB and an English ESB maybe Fullers vs Redhook?

 

[Glibbidy]

I like Fullers ESB, but personally don't think the redhook product is even close enough to compare to Fullers.
How about Rogues Brutal Bitter Ale?

 

[cweston]

I like Fullers ESB, but personally don't think the redhook product is even close enough to compare to Fullers.
How about Rogues Brutal Bitter Ale?

Agree, mostly: I have a soft spot in my heart for Redhook, from my Seattle days, but I don't think it's really even the same product now as it was then.

But is there any other American ESB that's widely-enough distributed for this to work?

 

[Brewpastor]

The availability concern was the reason for the Redhook suggestion.. I agree that there are some much better choices. Part of what I am interested in looking at in this comparison is the variation between the interpretations of the styles. I like Roque, but often their beers are way over the top (in terms of style). But I am completely open on this one and have some excellent stores with huge varieties.

 

[Dude]

If you have more suggestions for an American ESB--name them. I don't think Rogue's is a very good example.

I know I can get Redhook but if we can come to a conclusion on what everyone else can get--maybe we can find a good example. I'm not real familiar with any others, off hand.

This is a good idea though.

Or we could just do Fullers. That would make me happy.

 

[SwAMi75]

I think Rogue's Younger's Special Bitter would stack up well against Fullers. Their Brutal Bitter is pretty much an IPA, so it's not a good comparison.

Not that I've found a place around here to buy either.

 

[Brewsmith]

I say go with Fullers only and keep it a one beer tasting. I agree that Red Hook is relatively easy to find, but I've had that before in quantities. I've never tried Fullers before and think it would be a great choice, especially to demonstrate the style.

I was going to suggest a different beer for the BOTW, but I'll share that on the weekend.

 

[Brewpastor]

I say go with Fullers only and keep it a one beer tasting. I agree that Red Hook is relatively easy to find, but I've had that before in quantities. I've never tried Fullers before and think it would be a great choice, especially to demonstrate the style.

I was going to suggest a different beer for the BOTW, but I'll share that on the weekend.

Perhaps what you suggest would be best, just keep this track clear and sample single brews. That being said, perhaps there might be a second thread that is not so much a sampling exercise as it would be a comparing one.

The comparison idea came from the recent discussion on ESBs, American and English, and a general sense of uncertainty about the style guidelines. I have found/heard the same discussions about other styles, such as the Munich Helles/Pilsner and Porter/Stout conversations.

I think it is very instructive to do side-by-side comparisons. I think it really helps in understanding styles and the result of various ingredients and processes. The various HBCs I have been connected with over the years have all done a great deal of this.

What thoughts do all of you have on this approach: 2 different focuses on seperate threads (although it would be simple to overlap the two and do the comparing with the Beer of the week).

 

[cweston]

Great Divide makes an ESB--I'm not sure how widely distributed Great Divide is.

I've never had their ESB, but the beers of theirs that I have tasted have all been very good.

 

[Ivan Lendl]

bridgeport
deschuttes
victory
otter creek
bear republic
russian river
pyramid
ballards
full sail
wychwood

just a few...i think just about EVERY brewery makes an esb, they might call it something else, like an ESA...

 

[Rhoobarb]

The most widely available examples are going to be Fullers ESB, Samuel Smith's Old Brewery Pale Ale, Bass Ale or Redhook ESB. Fullers sounds good to me.

 

[Brewsmith]

I like the idea of a comparison tasting as well. As was mentioned in a thread here today, we should start keeping all of this in the Sampling and Critiquing section. Then we could have threads on single beers like the BOTW, as well as doing side-by-side comparisons in another thread. Taking this even further, maybe we could swap brews with each other and do a homebrew/commercial side by side comparison. I keep telling my wife that all the beer I buy is "research"

 

[Brewpastor]

So... where are we here?

Shall we simply have Fullers and screw the comparison?

Sounds fine with me, unless somebody wants to twist my arm and convince me otherwise...

 

[Brewpastor]

A recipe for ESB:

Pack a Mac ESB

A ProMash Recipe Report
AHA Style and Style Guidelines
-------------------------------
07-C English Bitter, English Extra Special Bitter
Min OG: 1.046 Max OG: 1.060
Min IBU: 30 Max IBU: 55
Min Clr: 12 Max Clr: 14 Color in SRM, Lovibond

Recipe Specifics
----------------
Batch Size (Gal): 10.00 Wort Size (Gal): 10.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 19.43
Anticipated OG: 1.05453 Plato: 13.458
Anticipated SRM: 16.7
Anticipated IBU: 36.2
Brewhouse Efficiency: 73 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes
Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------
Evaporation Rate: 5.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 10.81 Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.05044 SG 12.49 Plato

Grain/Extract/Sugar
% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
77.2 15.00 lbs. Pale Malt(2-row) Great Britain 1.03600 4
7.7 1.50 lbs. Crystal 55L Great Britian 1.03400 55
10.3 2.00 lbs. Invert Sugar Great Britian 1.04600 0
1.3 0.25 lbs. Roasted Barley Belgium 1.03000 575
3.5 0.68 lbs. CaraMunich Malt Belgium 1.03300 70
Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.

Hops
Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.50 oz. Fuggle Pellet 5.00 19.9 90 min.
1.50 oz. Fuggle Whole 5.00 12.5 40 min.
1.00 oz. Goldings - E.K. Pellet 4.75 3.9 20 min.
1.00 oz. Goldings - E.K. Pellet 4.75 0.0 0 min.
1.00 oz. Goldings - E.K. Whole 4.75 0.0 Dry Hop

Extras
Amount Name Type Time
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
0.25 Oz Irish Moss Fining 15 Min.(boil)

Yeast
-----
WYeast 1968 London Extra Special Bitter


Mash Schedule
-------------
Mash Type: Single Step
Grain Lbs: 17.43
Water Qts: 20.95 - Before Additional Infusions
Water Gal: 5.24 - Before Additional Infusions
Qts Water Per Lbs Grain: 1.20 - Before Additional Infusions
Saccharification Rest Temp : 153 Time: 90
Mash-out Rest Temp : 170 Time: 10
Sparge Temp : 170 Time: 60

Total Mash Volume Gal: 6.63 - Dough-In Infusion Only
All temperature measurements are degrees Fahrenheit.

 

[Baron von BeeGee]

I'll try to snag a Fuller's. Failing that, any port in a storm!

I brewed the Bitch Creek ESB out of BYO last year and it was excellent, though it's really more of a brown with an ESB hop profile. I'll probably crank it out again this Fall.

 

[Rhoobarb]

A recipe for ESB:
Pack a Mac ESB.

Cool, I'm squirreling that recipe away for future use! Thanks!

Yes, let's make it a Fullers ESB!

 

[Brewsmith]

Sounds like it's a go on the Fuller's ESB. I'll pick me up some on the way home from work.

 

[Ize]

Leavin to get some, and whatever other goodies I can find at my new favorite beverage store!!!



Ize

 

[Baron von BeeGee]

Well, I'm having mine now (Fuller's ESB). I picked up a single while SWMBO did the mall thing (on the most beautiful day of the year yet). By the time I got home it was probably ~55-60F.

It poured with a very alluring dark copper color and ample head, offwhite. Quite persistent head, but it did eventually evaporate before I finished.

The aroma is more malt to me than hops...a deep malty sweetness. There is very little evidence of any hop aroma. First few sips confirm this; a very strong malty backbone which is well balanced by hop bitterness, but no real hop flavor or aroma. Perhaps I'm comparing too strongly to an APA, but I really only get a pleasant hop bitterness, especially as the maltiness fades from the tastebuds.

The malt flavor is actually quite nice...I'm guessing a healthy dose of crystal?

In any case, I enjoyed this beer significantly more than the Chimay Red (I failed to participate in the Anchor Steam tasting). Seems to have more to write about, and furthermore is a beer I wouldn't hesitate to purchase in the future. I may even brew something to style once I get my recipe baffles cleared.

 

[Brewsmith]

Here's my review as I pour it right now

It pours an amber color, somewhere between red and orange. An off white head sits on top that has now reduced to a thin layer on the top of the beer. The aroma is malty with some hops present, a slight lemony citrus. The flavor confirms the malt aroma with a stong malt presence, but with plenty of hop bitterness to back it up. Hop flavor comes through next, cutting through the malty sweetness and the bittering hops. This beer has a thick mouthfeel that keeps the flavor lingering on my tongue. Also, the carbonation is definately less than a standard American brew. Without the huge amount of bubbles, the beer is very smooth.

Like BvB mentioned, this is a very malty but balanced beer. It is definately not in the same catagory as an APA. The bitterness is not harsh or dominating, but is strong enough to balance the malt. The flavor hops are there, but more subtle that an APA. They sneak their way in after the initial maltiness. I really enjoy this beer and would buy it again, recommend it, and will definately try to make something in this style.

 

[Ize]

The Baron's post is dead on. I really liked this beer. His description is absolutely right... I preferred it highly to the Arcadia Lake Superior ESB (Extra Special BItter) that I grabbed just to compare the styles... The american was far more hoppy, lighter in color, and not nearly as well rounded...


And yeah I didn't post on last week's Anchor Steam... As I've posted elsewhere, I LOVE that beer.... Still got and consumed the six last week tho, still love it....


Ize

 

[Baron von BeeGee]

So who else had a Fuller's? We may have to do PBR or something more accessible this week!

We went to Barnes & Noble yesterday for a few hours and I grabbed a copy of Zymurgy off the rack to read while taking a coffee. I once again confirmed my opinion that I vastly prefer BYO, but oddly enough Zymurgy has a feature article on Fuller's ESB as well as a clone this month. I didn't have a pen, but I did confirm my expectation of crystal...I believe it was 2-row, 70L and 26L (strange L's, British, I suppose). There were four different hops that I don't really remember (including one I didn't recognize), and what surprised me was that they dryhopped with a 1/2oz which I didn't pick up on at all in the tasting.

 

[Brewpastor]

I had a Fuller's tasting yesterday after all the morning activitiies had settled down. I had forgotten how nice that beer is. I like the malt/hop balance, more on the malt side but good hop background. The first beer had some stale characters, but not anything dramatic. The head was not very long lasting.

This tasting motivated us to go have one on draft (20 mile round trip!) and it was worth the effort. Much smoother, with a good deal more hop character, not really more bitterness but rather spritz. The malt was also rounder with a mellow crystal character. The head retention was much better on the draft, creamy white, tight foam. The carbonation was also really well done, nice small beads.

After a couple pints we had a Sierra Nevada and it was really rough by comparison.

 

[Rhoobarb]

Had mine over the weekend and I, too, had forgetten how good this stuff is. I really have nothing to add to the previous posts by Baron and Brewpastor - they both reflect my feelings as well. I'd like to try this on tap. And I've got to brew a clone of this for Summer consumption!

 

[Baron von BeeGee]

And I've got to brew a clone of this for Summer consumption!

Check out the current Zymurgy.