Atlanta, GA folks I could use some advice!

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TheMadKing

Western Yankee Southerner and Brew Science Nerd
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I have a potential job offer in Atlanta that might be too good to turn down. I have grown up in the pacific northwest and lived around here my whole life. I've traveled some, but I've never been to Atlanta and now I'm considering moving down there.

They are flying me down for a job interview in Feb and they are paying for me to "scout the area" and see how I like it, so I would love to hear what people think of living in Atlanta, especially as a northerner, but all comments and advice are appreciated.

I'm a pretty outdoorsy guy too, hiking, mountaineering, rock climbing, backpacking. How is that scene down there?

And most importantly, what does the craft beer scene look like?
 
ATL is a very short hop from N GA mountains, the App Trail, Lake Lanier, and countless good rivers. Some very good brews here, even though the laws are achaic .. Sweetwater, Terrapin, Red Brick, Three Taverns.

Traffic sucks !!

If you are downtown for dinner try Max Lagers .. a good example of an ATL brew pub. Good food and beer but not the best in the whole world. The oatmeal stout is good.

Georgia has more intact barrier islands than any Atlantic state. A couple of good beaches but more salt marsh than anything .. the ocean's nursery. Get a kayak.

Get used to more diversity than you probably knew in PNW .. which means more redneck misogeny in reaction to it. I'm pretty sure GA beats the pants off PNW for corruption in politics. We teach it here.
 
ATL is a very short hop from N GA mountains, the App Trail, Lake Lanier, and countless good rivers. Some very good brews here, even though the laws are achaic .. Sweetwater, Terrapin, Red Brick, Three Taverns.

Traffic sucks !!

If you are downtown for dinner try Max Lagers .. a good example of an ATL brew pub. Good food and beer but not the best in the whole world. The oatmeal stout is good.

Georgia has more intact barrier islands than any Atlantic state. A couple of good beaches but more salt marsh than anything .. the ocean's nursery. Get a kayak.

Get used to more diversity than you probably knew in PNW .. which means more redneck misogeny in reaction to it. I'm pretty sure GA beats the pants off PNW for corruption in politics. We teach it here.

Thanks, great tips! I'll probably make a stop at Max Lagers while I'm there then!

I don't know about the redneck-ness though. I'm from small town eastern washington. Population 10, been hit on by a 1 armed woman in a wheelchair at a bar because I was the only guy there she wasn't related to... my nephew's first words were "yee-yee!"...rednecks I can handle :)

Can you elaborate on the archaic laws? Is there anything ridiculously prohibitive that I should know about?
 
Just stupid beer laws from prohibition. 3 tier system. Bud and Miller both brew in GA and put tens of thousands into campaign war chests of corrupt politicians to keep craft beer from competing.

Gun laws are opening up though. You can carry in church. You could have stood your ground against the wheelchair lady in GA.
 
Atlanta residents tends to be divided along geographical lines... OTP and ITP... Outside the Perimeter and Inside... there's a big 'bypass', I-285 ("the perimeter"), that surrounds the city and basically everything outside that bypass is considered suburbia... I live in the 'burbs and while we do have some good breweries (Reformation, Burnt Hickory, Jekyll Island are a stones' throw from me) and brewpubs (Hop Alley is awesome), the ITPers have a gold-mine of breweries (Wild Heaven, Orpheus, Monday Night, Three Taverns just to name a few) and some awesome brewpubs (Wrecking Bar anybody!!!) and bars (The Porter, Brick Store for instance). If you're young and like the social life, then living ITP is definitely the place to be... if you're settled and have a family, then the suburbs certainly aren't bad and you can always take trips into the city anytime anyway... but as the guy above said, traffic sucks and outside the perimeter, mass transit is basically non-existent!
 
The job is in the northeastern area in Buford if that helps.

I'm not really a city person, so the burbs sound more appealing than urban life to me.

How's public transit? And how safe is it?
 
Buford is well outside the city. It's a 30-40 minute drive without traffic. I live just a few miles from there, and it's a beautiful town.

No public transit in Buford, but you have I-85, I-985, and just about all the restaurants and shopping you could want right there.
 
Buford is well outside the city. It's a 30-40 minute drive without traffic. I live just a few miles from there, and it's a beautiful town.

No public transit in Buford, but you have I-85, I-985, and just about all the restaurants and shopping you could want right there.

I didn't realize it was that far, but that suits me.

Any highlights in the immediate area? Is Lake Lanier pretty nice?

And what are rent prices like in the area?
 
Buford is definitely north of ATL, but it is a pretty area.

I lived in S CA for the first 30 years of my life, the next 10 in ATL (Dunwoody, then Roswell), and now in Denver.

I did like Atlanta, reasonable cost of living (I had a ridonculous house there), it's hot / humid, but you do get used to that quickly. Lots of recreation, food, good beer, proximity to great places (N GA mountains, Savannah, Charleston).

The South is a bit of a closed community if you didn't go to Bama or UGA, we made lots of good friends though our church, but mostly friends from outside of GA. You do need to work to develop friends.

After living in Denver (which to me is paradise) I wouldn't go back, but we lived very happily there, I must say.
 
The South is a bit of a closed community if you didn't go to Bama or UGA, we made lots of good friends though our church, but mostly friends from outside of GA. You do need to work to develop friends.

After living in Denver (which to me is paradise) I wouldn't go back, but we lived very happily there, I must say.

I've heard that before. You always hear about southern hospitality, but (no offense, and I'm sure this isn't universally true) every southerner I've met has been standoffish and made me feel like I wasn't part of the super secret awesome club.

I'm also likely biased because my current boss is from Tennessee and I strongly dislike him.

It's certainly not a factor in my job decision, but it's good to know ahead of time. I'm used to being in a universally welcoming small town where everyone you drive by gives you a wave. It's going to be a culture shift for sure.
 
My fiance is in Atlanta right now finishing med school so I go down there at least once a month since it is only a 4 hour drive from NE Tennessee. I am originilly from Upstate, New York and then Jacksonville, FL before my current 2 year TN residency for my job. I believe this would make me quite unbiased...

OVERALL. At first I really disliked Atlanta due to the INSANE traffic. It would take 45 minutes to get like 4 miles consistently during heavy traffic. As someone else said it is very diverse which isn't a problem to me, but for some that aren't used to that it could be. The amount of places to eat, drink, and things to do especially outdoors are above my expectations in Atlanta. Due to all these reasons, after gaining a bit of interest and experience in the area as an "outsider" I had to really TRY to dislike it to prevent me and my fiance from settling there permanently after she graduates. I don't want to deal with that traffic the rest of my life, but I love the city now! I would love to try and go back later in my career.

OUTDOORS. The parks and outdoor stuff are great in my opinion, and that's coming from someone in the heart of the tallest points of the Appalachians in NE Tennessee with endless hiking, rafting, kayaking, etc. I think the urban parks in Atlanta are great and the amount of festivals and such will keep anyone busy. Sweetwater Park is awesome (no the brewery is not there)

TRAVEL. With Delta's main hub, you can pretty much fly ALMOST anywhere you want direct if it is a larger airport, if not you can connect to there easily and prices aren't bad in my experience. I always drive down to ATL to fly anywhere instead of flying out of NE TN.

BEER. My fiance lives close to a craft brewery called Wild Heaven Craft Beers. I like it a lot, she has started working there part time which is great because I get free bottles that they pour when they're out on tap. I like the craft beer scene from what I have seen, but unfortunately I haven't seen much of it as I am not there enough as I want to be. I always stop in at Hop City to pick up some hard to find beers I can't get in TN and they have a great selection as well as some home brew stuff.

HOUSING. What really attracted me the most was the visual aspect of the city. It is a very big city, but combined with the terrain and greenery in the area I think it is beautiful. This is also probably because Jacksonville, where I spent most of my life is flat....boring. There are some gorgeous homes in the Atlanta city limits and suburbs, and they aren't cookie cutter development houses. They have big yards, terrain, huge trees. I can't even describe them without you driving around a bit in areas like Decatur. I'm sure people from Atlanta may disagree with me, I'm not sure.
 
@arnobg great detailed response. Thank you!

No problem! Since you are getting some time to look around and check things out, this is my advice since I didn't care for Atlanta at first...

Don't just drive around the city areas like downtown, midtown, etc. where all you are going to see is high rise buildings, traffic, and the negative things mostly. Make sure you drive around some suburbs, city neighborhoods like I am speaking of to get the feel of the living situation/daily life too. It wasn't until I started seeing some of those areas that I started really liking Atlanta because it had a different feel to it. Make sure you eat at some local places and no chains! You could eat at a different place every day the rest of your life there.

Some folks from Atlanta can chime in but I mean neighborhoods like Virginia Highlands, Druid Hills, Decatur, Piedmont Heights, Lenox Park. I don't have any experience on other sides of the city.

EDIT sorry I see now you said you weren't a big city person, so if these neighborhoods are too close to the city sorry, but I would give them a chance.

Look into Roswell, a suburb in North Atlanta that has a lot going on if you want to do something. I have heard housing is great there too.
 
No problem! Since you are getting some time to look around and check things out, this is my advice since I didn't care for Atlanta at first...

Don't just drive around the city areas like downtown, midtown, etc. where all you are going to see is high rise buildings, traffic, and the negative things mostly. Make sure you drive around some suburbs, city neighborhoods like I am speaking of to get the feel of the living situation/daily life too. It wasn't until I started seeing some of those areas that I started really liking Atlanta because it had a different feel to it. Make sure you eat at some local places and no chains! You could eat at a different place every day the rest of your life there.

Some folks from Atlanta can chime in but I mean neighborhoods like Virginia Highlands, Druid Hills, Decatur, Piedmont Heights, Lenox Park. I don't have any experience on other sides of the city.

EDIT sorry I see now you said you weren't a big city person, so if these neighborhoods are too close to the city sorry, but I would give them a chance.

Look into Roswell, a suburb in North Atlanta that has a lot going on if you want to do something. I have heard housing is great there too.

I'll certainly take a look at them, as well as the housing situation around Buford too. I also make it a point not to eat at chain restaurants when I'm somewhere new, so that won't be a problem.

I really appreciate all the advice, thank you.
 
Our craft beer scene here is booming. I moderate a forum for Georgia beer at reddit.com/r/atlbeer and I also host a weekly radio show on the craft beer scene, Beer Guys Radio.

The laws here are messed up, but despite the challenges we still have a great scene with awesome breweries, brewpubs, and beer people. Tons of events (this weekend alone we have Atlanta Cask Ale Tasting, Nuit Belge, a brewery opening a tasting room, and a can launch), meetups, bottle shares, beer dinners, etc.

Max Lager's is a great brewpub and the owner/brewmaster is very cool and extremely active in the fight for better beer laws. My personal favorite brewpub here is Wrecking Bar, the food and beer are stellar, it's also walking distance from The Porter, one of Atlanta's best beer bars . It's been awarded best beer bar in the country before. Fair warning, the area around The Porter (Little 5 Points/L5P) is a bit shady late at night. I've been threatened with murder there by the vagrants but I've never once actually been murdered. Oh yeah, closer to Buford is Cherry Street Brewing Co-op (brewpub) and it is one of the best in the state, it doesn't get as much mention as it's quite far out for city dwellers.

Breweries to search out... Burnt Hickory (personal favorite), Creature Comforts, Red Brick, Wild Heaven, Three Taverns, Orpheus. Some of my personal favorites but to be honest most of our breweries have some good offerings.

Check out beerguysradio.com and reddit.com/r/atlbeer... both sites have maps, brewery listing, beer reviews, release info, event calendars, and more. And listen to Beer Guys Radio! :)
 
Our craft beer scene here is booming. I moderate a forum for Georgia beer at reddit.com/r/atlbeer and I also host a weekly radio show on the craft beer scene, Beer Guys Radio.

The laws here are messed up, but despite the challenges we still have a great scene with awesome breweries, brewpubs, and beer people. Tons of events (this weekend alone we have Atlanta Cask Ale Tasting, Nuit Belge, a brewery opening a tasting room, and a can launch), meetups, bottle shares, beer dinners, etc.

Max Lager's is a great brewpub and the owner/brewmaster is very cool and extremely active in the fight for better beer laws. My personal favorite brewpub here is Wrecking Bar, the food and beer are stellar, it's also walking distance from The Porter, one of Atlanta's best beer bars . It's been awarded best beer bar in the country before. Fair warning, the area around The Porter (Little 5 Points/L5P) is a bit shady late at night. I've been threatened with murder there by the vagrants but I've never once actually been murdered. Oh yeah, closer to Buford is Cherry Street Brewing Co-op (brewpub) and it is one of the best in the state, it doesn't get as much mention as it's quite far out for city dwellers.

Breweries to search out... Burnt Hickory (personal favorite), Creature Comforts, Red Brick, Wild Heaven, Three Taverns, Orpheus. Some of my personal favorites but to be honest most of our breweries have some good offerings.

Check out beerguysradio.com and reddit.com/r/atlbeer... both sites have maps, brewery listing, beer reviews, release info, event calendars, and more. And listen to Beer Guys Radio! :)

Awesome info thank you! I might just become a regular follower of your radio show here soon
 
All the advice above is spot on, IMO. Where to live depends a lot upon your age, social style, and personal preference. I think you'll like ITP much better if you are in your 20's and like to go out until 4am every weekend. Clubbing in Midtown and living in the burbs just doesn't mix well together (who wants to drive 45 mins home in the wee hours of the morning?)

SPORTS – I think Atlanta is the best hub for college sports in the country. It is a great blend of SEC and ACC schools and alums so you get a ton of active interest, TV coverage, chatter, and passion for those schools. Football is king.

WEATHER - It is hot and humid. You can get 90F and humid anytime between May 1 and Oct 1. I always find the nights to be the worst actually. So while it looks like you get relief at night when the temp drops to 60F or 70F, the humidity climbs north of 80-90%. It just becomes thick and miserable. Some tolerate it better than others, but I suspect you coming from the PacNW could be a bit more sensitive to it than local natives.

POLLEN – Atlanta is notorious for having terrible, terrible pollen. If you have outdoor allergies you’ll be miserable the months of March and April. It is the price you pay for being surrounded by so many beautiful flowering trees and shrubs.

PEOPLE – There are a lot of transplants in Atl. It is the largest major city in the SE so it attracts a lot of folks from the surrounding states. A lot of Midwesterners and Northeasteners relo down to Atl as well –for them hot and humid is a welcome relief from the cold and snow. You get a nicely diverse population because of this.

One place to check out is TacoMac. There’s one in Buford by the Mall of Georgia. It is kind of like a local version of BW3 but with 100 beers on tap. You’ll find a good blend of your old favorites (this month they are actually featuring Rogue brewery) and plenty of new ones.

It would take 45 minutes to get like 4 miles consistently during heavy traffic. ....

Traffic sucks !!
AGREE. The traffic can be brutally painful during rush hour. You ever heard of “sunshine delays?” Yeah, that’s a thing in Atlanta. It refers to the slowdowns that are caused from driving due east/west into the rising/setting sun. Crazy, huh?
Public transit is really only viable for a very small portion of the city. Plan to drive everywhere, especially if you'll be working in Buford.
Spend some time with Google maps and see how far a 30min, 45min, etc drive from your office at rush hour gets you. That will help you rule in/out home locations.
...Don't just drive around the city areas like downtown, midtown, etc. where all you are going to see is high rise buildings, traffic, and the negative things mostly. Make sure you drive around some suburbs, city neighborhoods like I am speaking of to get the feel of the living situation/daily life too. It wasn't until I started seeing some of those areas that I started really liking Atlanta because it had a different feel to it. ....
Look into Roswell, a suburb in North Atlanta that has a lot going on if you want to do something. I have heard housing is great there too.

ATL is a very short hop from N GA mountains, the App Trail, Lake Lanier, and countless good rivers.

Agree with this advice. Roswell, Alpharetta are nice areas semi-close to Buford. Johns Creek is equally nice. Cumming is going to be closer to Lake Lanier, a bit more rural (i.e. - bigger lots, cheaper cost, less dense), and a shorter drive to the mountains. The North Georgia mountains (really hills compared to what you're used to) and lakes (Blue Ridge, Notelly, Chatuge) are great places to visit, hike, camp, swim, etc. They are also spectacular in the fall.
And what are rent prices like in the area?
I reco using Zillow.com to scout out some houses that are in your specs & price range then drive to those areas to get a true sense for the feel. I've relo'd a few times in my life and have found this to be a really helpful and eye-opening approach. In general, you’ll find home prices are pretty affordable in Atlanta, I believe about 15% below national average.
Can you elaborate on the archaic laws? Is there anything ridiculously prohibitive that I should know about?
I can’t think of anything ridiculously prohibitive. But for perspective, it was illegal to sell packaged alcohol on Sundays until just about 5 years ago.
 
@tagillis whew! Tons of info thank you.

I'm not a club/stay out late person, but we are in our 20's. I'm definitely more of an introverted homebody with the occasional desire to watch a football game in a bar.

It sounds like I'm going to be a rare pac12 fan down south haha. WSU alumni, so I'm a Coug for life.

Humidity is definitely not my thing. In fact I hate it. But I'll adapt.

No allergies up here, but new plants might fix that.

Cumming sounds promising if I can get past the name *snort*.

If there's anywhere I can get away from crowds, stop hearing city noise, and spend the night out in the woods I'll be happy so all of your suggestions sound good.

I was actually looking at Zillow today at a few homes around Buford, but I'll do a more extensive look this weekend.

Thanks again!
 
Sup fellow coug! I wanted to chime in here as perhaps the only other person ever to make the move from outside of Pullman (Palouse) to Atlanta. A few comments:

1. The beer scene is growing, but of course isnt Washington. The breweries mentioned up thread are all pretty good, I'd add Creature Comforts and Jeykell to the list. The issue isnt necessarily the breweries though, its the lack of beer knowledge of the beer stores. Freshness isnt a high priority, I've found many IPAs that have been on shelves for over a year at times. You'll need to search out beer you want.

2. Theres a small WSU Alumni association in the area, they typically meet in Northwest atlanta to watch games and such. You'll also have plenty of opportunities to wave the flag, I've been able to do it 5 times over the last 3 years and probably could have done it 10 if I wanted to.

3. I live on the east side of town in Snellville, if I had to do it again I would look at the Tucker area (good growler store, nice downtown, less strip malls/traffic), but if you're working in buford proper (not along buford highway which runs from atlanta to buford) you're going to want to be further out of town. Luckily, thats pushing you right towards North Georgia, my personal favorite part of Georgia.

4. Camping in North Georgia is pretty great. Nice hiking, "mountains", and the weather is cooler. You will not be prepared for the summers here, its brutally hot and humid. Definitely need air conditioning.

Let me know if you have any other questions, I'd be happy to answer them.

Go Cougs!
 
Sup fellow coug! I wanted to chime in here as perhaps the only other person ever to make the move from outside of Pullman (Palouse) to Atlanta. A few comments:

1. The beer scene is growing, but of course isnt Washington. The breweries mentioned up thread are all pretty good, I'd add Creature Comforts and Jeykell to the list. The issue isnt necessarily the breweries though, its the lack of beer knowledge of the beer stores. Freshness isnt a high priority, I've found many IPAs that have been on shelves for over a year at times. You'll need to search out beer you want.

2. Theres a small WSU Alumni association in the area, they typically meet in Northwest atlanta to watch games and such. You'll also have plenty of opportunities to wave the flag, I've been able to do it 5 times over the last 3 years and probably could have done it 10 if I wanted to.

3. I live on the east side of town in Snellville, if I had to do it again I would look at the Tucker area (good growler store, nice downtown, less strip malls/traffic), but if you're working in buford proper (not along buford highway which runs from atlanta to buford) you're going to want to be further out of town. Luckily, thats pushing you right towards North Georgia, my personal favorite part of Georgia.

4. Camping in North Georgia is pretty great. Nice hiking, "mountains", and the weather is cooler. You will not be prepared for the summers here, its brutally hot and humid. Definitely need air conditioning.

Let me know if you have any other questions, I'd be happy to answer them.

Go Cougs!

Hey glad to see another Washington native!

Thanks for the input, that's all really helpful. I would be working in Buford proper so north GA sounds a lot nicer to me.

Do most homes come with AC already installed? Or is it fairly uncommon just like up here?

I'd definitely have to wave the flag a few times if I come down. Out of curiosity, when did you leave Palouse? I have a lot of friends there.

Go Cougs!
 
Hey glad to see another Washington native!

Thanks for the input, that's all really helpful. I would be working in Buford proper so north GA sounds a lot nicer to me.

Do most homes come with AC already installed? Or is it fairly uncommon just like up here?

I'd definitely have to wave the flag a few times if I come down. Out of curiosity, when did you leave Palouse? I have a lot of friends there.

Go Cougs!

You'll find most places have AC, but its something to verify and that its been serviced lately.

I grew up in Palouse, went to Wazzu 2007-2010 and left after that. Family still lives there so I make it back now and again.
 
You'll find most places have AC, but its something to verify and that its been serviced lately.

I grew up in Palouse, went to Wazzu 2007-2010 and left after that. Family still lives there so I make it back now and again.

Small world, do you know the Pfaff family? Or the Bofenkamps? Or Garrett Parish?
 
Yes Yes and Yes. Played sports with the Pfaff's and Bofenkamps, knew Garrett but he was a few years ahead of me.

Very cool, I lived with Garrett for a year, and Matt Bofenkamp for 2 years in college and did my first homebrews with him.

Thanks again for your 2 cents, I think we probably will have similar outlooks so I appreciate hearing your views
 
So far as rock climbing goes, Stone Summit is a pretty incredible gym. 60 ft walls, a decent bouldering space, overall a very nice place.

Outdoor areas to check out are: Horse Pens 40 - in Steele, AL about 90 minutes WNW of ATL, they have a super convenient camping setup, 30 second approach to boulders, and some of the best bouldering in the south east.

Rock Town - North Georgia, maybe 45-60 minutes from ATL. Primitive camping, and the boulders are a bit more spaced, but also a very good place for bouldering.

Chattanooga is also just 2 hours away, and has about 5 different areas for sport climbing, and many more for trad.

The Dixie Cragger's Atlas is pretty complete on AL/GA climbing locations. http://www.amazon.com/dp/0966864026/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
(there is also a Dixie Cragger's Atlas for Tennessee, so get the right one.)

Chattanooga has Chatt Steel, or Chatt Trad guidebooks depending on your style of climbing, and both of these books are worth the purchase if you are planning to climb in that area.
 
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So far as rock climbing goes, Stone Summit is a pretty incredible gym. 60 ft walls, a decent bouldering space, overall a very nice place.

Outdoor areas to check out are: Horse Pens 40 - in Steele, AL about 90 minutes WNW of ATL, they have a super convenient camping setup, 30 second approach to boulders, and some of the best bouldering in the south east.

Rock Town - North Georgia, maybe 45-60 minutes from ATL. Primitive camping, and the boulders are a bit more spaced, but also a very good place for bouldering.

Chattanooga is also just 2 hours away, and has about 5 different areas for sport climbing, and many more for trad.

The Dixie Cragger's Atlas is pretty complete on AL/GA climbing locations. http://www.amazon.com/dp/0966864026/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
(there is also a Dixie Cragger's Atlas for Tennessee, so get the right one.)

Chattanooga has Chatt Steel, or Chatt Trad guidebooks depending on your style of climbing, and both of these books are worth the purchase if you are planning to climb in that area.

Awesome info, I wasn't finding much climbing around. I prefer real rock sport climbing, but I enjoy gyms and bouldering sometimes too. Sounds like there's at least as much there as there is here. Thanks!
 
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Just and update everyone. I have accepted the job in Buford and I'm looking at houses in the Buford/Flowery Branch/Sugar hill areas. I'm moving down there March 28th and SWMBO is coming down May 10th.

I really appreciate all the info from everyone, it's been helpful in make more informed decisions about everything.

Does anyone live right there in the Buford area? We don't have any friends in the area and a fellow homebrewer is always welcome at my place (wherever that may be).
 
Big congrats, man! Your moving down at one of the most beautiful times of the year.

Thanks! It wasn't bad in early Feb when I interviewed so I'm looking forward to seeing all the trees with leaves, and hopefully I don't have allergies to all the new plant species haha
 
Just and update everyone. I have accepted the job in Buford and I'm looking at houses in the Buford/Flowery Branch/Sugar hill areas. I'm moving down there March 28th and SWMBO is coming down May 10th.

I really appreciate all the info from everyone, it's been helpful in make more informed decisions about everything.

Does anyone live right there in the Buford area? We don't have any friends in the area and a fellow homebrewer is always welcome at my place (wherever that may be).

I go to church in Buford, but we live about half an hour away. A friend of mine (who got me into brewing) lives there.

There's also a small brew shop downtown.
 
I go to church in Buford, but we live about half an hour away. A friend of mine (who got me into brewing) lives there.

There's also a small brew shop downtown.

I actually went in there when I visited and met George, he's an awesome guy and gave me a real estate agent that he likes.
 
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