Assure me it'll be OK

[myndflyte]

Last Saturday on Jan 5th, I brewed up the following saison:

3.3 lb Wheat LME
3.3 lb Rye LME
1 lb Belgain Candi Sugar

2 oz Mandarina Bavaria @ 15 min

Wyeast 3711 and Wyeast 3724

OG: 1.055; IBU: 31

I pitched at 65F (and at that time, tasted pretty good) and over probably 4 days brought it up to 80F. I took a gravity sample a week later (FG: 1.008) but the taste was just over the top bitter. After 35 batches, I know I need to just give it time but the bitterness should mellow out, right?

I guess the only different thing worth noting was it was the first time I used my new Hydra immersion chiller. I washed it before using it but should I have boiled it in water first? I'm hoping something didn't come off of that. But like I said, the OG sample tasted really good.

 

[Pappers_]

If it is really bitterness from hops you're tasting, then it will not dissipate over time. Have you brewed this recipe before, and if so, does it taste more bitter than the previous batch and/or the projected 31 IBUs? What alpha acid level were the Mandarina Bavaria hops? Did you use brewing software to estimate the IBUs or is that from a recipe? And why add all the hops at 15 instead of using a much smaller bittering addition at 60?

Another possibility is that you are tasting something harsh that reminds you of bitterness but is something else, like tannins.

As for your new immersion chiller, yes, you need to sanitize it before using it every time. The easiest way perhaps is, towards the end of your boil, put the clean chiller into your brew kettle, in the boiling wort. Let it boil for at least a couple of minutes and just leave it there until the boil is done, turn off the flame and start to chill.

 

[AJinJacksonville]

It'll be okay. Bottle it and give it away to hopheads

 

[myndflyte]

If it is really bitterness from hops you're tasting, then it will not dissipate over time. Have you brewed this recipe before, and if so, does it taste more bitter than the previous batch and/or the projected 31 IBUs? What alpha acid level were the Mandarina Bavaria hops? Did you use brewing software to estimate the IBUs or is that from a recipe? And why add all the hops at 15 instead of using a much smaller bittering addition at 60?

Never brewed this recipe before. The AA were 8.5%, used brewing software to calculate the IBUs, and I only boiled it for 15 min because that was the extent of the boil (see 15 min Saison in my signature below).

Another possibility is that you are tasting something harsh that reminds you of bitterness but is something else, like tannins.

Where would the tannins come from though? It was only malt extract and hops. Maybe the rye LME? I've never used rye before but do like rye beers.

As for your new immersion chiller, yes, you need to sanitize it before using it every time. The easiest way perhaps is, towards the end of your boil, put the clean chiller into your brew kettle, in the boiling wort. Let it boil for at least a couple of minutes and just leave it there until the boil is done, turn off the flame and start to chill.

Well I obviously sanitized it by boiling it for those 15 min, but I guess I was asking should I have just boiled it in water first to get anything that might be in there out. I can't imagine copper has much it's holding onto that could be leached out.

 

[myndflyte]

It'll be okay. Bottle it and give it away to hopheads

I don't mind hoppy beer but I was aiming for something more saison-y and not so hoppy.

 

[Pappers_]

Never brewed this recipe before. The AA were 8.5%, used brewing software to calculate the IBUs, and I only boiled it for 15 min because that was the extent of the boil (see 15 min Saison in my signature below).


Where would the tannins come from though? It was only malt extract and hops. Maybe the rye LME? I've never used rye before but do like rye beers.


Well I obviously sanitized it by boiling it for those 15 min, but I guess I was asking should I have just boiled it in water first to get anything that might be in there out. I can't imagine copper has much it's holding onto that could be leached out.

If you left the chiller in the boil for 15 minutes, you're fine, I think - your flavor issue isn't about a sanitation issue arising from your chiller. FWIW, I never left my chiller in the boil for that long, but i don't think that would matter.

So I think we're left with a couple of possibilities:

1. The beer turned out the way the recipe designer intended, but you don't like it. The projected IBUs for this recipe are right in the middle for the style, but you prefer a Saison that is more balanced toward malt.

2. For some reason we're not identifying, your beer did not turn out the way the recipe designer intended and your IBUs are way higher than the projection.

3. You're perceiving something harsh that reminds you of bitterness but is caused by something else.

An idea that occurs to me is that you might have another brewer give it taste and see what they think. If you have a homebrew club near by that would be excellent. Or if you have a craft brewery near, you might ask the brewer there for his/her opinion. Or you could send it into a competition and get some anonymous feedback from two credentialed judges. Just get some opinions about it.

 

[myndflyte]

@Pappers_ Thanks for the feedback. The recipe comes from Basic Brewing Radio. Here's the video of the beer:

That was what I modeled my recipe after. Now they used Goldpils Vienna LME which I substituted for rye LME because I was hoping to get more saison-y spice and the homebrew store didn't have Goldpils.

They describe the hops as tangerine but maybe it's the spiciness of the yeast that I'm tasting? Like I said, it's only been fermenting a week so I'll give it some more time and see if it mellows out a bit.

 

[Pappers_]

Like I said, it's only been fermenting a week so I'll give it some more time and see if it mellows out a bit.[/USER]

Oh I missed that. Fermentation might not be finished, it could be any number of yeast derived flavors - yeast continue to clean up and process after visible fermentation is done. Definitely give it another week or two before declaring defeat.

 

[madscientist451]

My first Saison was extremely bitter when I tasted it after it carbed up. I thought it was a failure and I pushed it to the back of my beer closet. I kept trying it every month or so and eventually the bitterness dropped off and when I got to the last 6 pack I wished I had brewed a double batch.
So go ahead and bottle it when its done and let it age a while.

 

[WFox93]

I think this lies with the only one week of fermentation. My first AG batch was a Mosaic hopped pale ale and I sampled it after a week. It was so bitter I actually threw up (a bit too much info I know, Sorry). Anyway, I soldiered on and even dry hopped to schedule. This beer ended up being my favorite yet, the first recipe I've decided to make again and want to continue making and has been my friend's favorite as well. So its either too early .... Oooorrr the amount of rye.

I'm not too familiar with extracts (outside of good ole Mr.Beer) but that seems like an awfully lot of rye compared to base malt. Unless of course the rye LME has base malts in it as well. If it's 3.3 lbs of pure rye then I imagine that would be your bitterness as sometimes even rye bread is over the top bitter, or so strong it comes off as bitter.

 

[myndflyte]

I think this lies with the only one week of fermentation. My first AG batch was a Mosaic hopped pale ale and I sampled it after a week. It was so bitter I actually threw up (a bit too much info I know, Sorry). Anyway, I soldiered on and even dry hopped to schedule. This beer ended up being my favorite yet, the first recipe I've decided to make again and want to continue making and has been my friend's favorite as well. So its either too early .... Oooorrr the amount of rye.

I'm not too familiar with extracts (outside of good ole Mr.Beer) but that seems like an awfully lot of rye compared to base malt. Unless of course the rye LME has base malts in it as well. If it's 3.3 lbs of pure rye then I imagine that would be your bitterness as sometimes even rye bread is over the top bitter, or so strong it comes off as bitter.

Well this makes me feel better. The rye LME is only 20% rye with 70% being base malt and 10% being caramel 40. So the total rye in the "grain bill" only comes out to about 10%. But yeah, I figured it was just early and I'll let it ride and see how it turns out.

 

[myndflyte]

Just kegged this over the weekend. The harsh bitterness has faded and after a night of burst carbing, I just had to try it. It's dry with a nice spiciness to it with good yeast character coming through. Give it a few more weeks of conditioning and I think this will have to be a regular on tap.