Argentine Cascade Hops

[JMD87]

Hey Guys

I just made an American Hefe using Argentine Cascades (In lieu of Tettnang because my LHBS didn't have any). Apparently the A.Cascades are a good substitute for Tettneg as per the writing directly on the package.

Anyway, after transferring to secondary I tasted a sample and Woah, was it bitter. I only used a total of .75oz of it, and my IBU's should be around 18-20%, but it really has a bite to it, finishes clean but that initial taste really packs a punch.

Has anyone had any experience with the Argentine Cascade? Does the bitterness mellow out with conditioning? This is supposed to be a Raspberry Wheat for SWMBO and I know she won't like the bitterness. I don't have the recipe as I'm at work, if it'll help I'll post tonight.

Thanks!

 

[Revvy]

I picked up a bunch of packets of them at prehop shortage prices, from a liquor store with a an aisle of homebrew supplies, and no idea about anything having to do with homebrewing. I just brewed a batch with some, but won't know for ahile what I got.

 

[FSR402]

IIRC those are really low AA hops (like 3 something %) if so I doubt you're tasting any "hop bite".

 

[JMD87]

IIRC those are really low AA hops (like 3 something %) if so I doubt you're tasting any "hop bite".

I thought that as well, but I tasted a little piece of a raw pellet (I'm not crazy just curious), and the bitterness was definitely there. I've tasted American Cascade, which has higer AA's, and it was not nearly as "bitter".

 

[Revvy]

THere's still very little info on the web about them, after all these months.

These Argentinian-grown Cascades are not like American Cascade - they have a very mellow and sweet character that reminds us of lemon grass, with herbal, peppery, and spicy undertones. A versatile hop to use for ales and lagers - strangely, with its sweet/spicy aroma this hop would make a good substitute for Hallertau-type and Goldings-type hops, but not a good substitute for American Cascade!

~3.2% Alpha Acid content. Argentine-grown Cascade is a mild flavor and aroma hop with traces of spicy, peppery, and herbal lemon grass flavors. This is a good hop for use in Summer beers, Light ales and lagers, Kölsch-style beer and Pilsners. For aroma, recommended to boil for the last 15 minutes. Substitutes: Spalt, Goldings, or Hallertau.

I have to go through my notes...I can't even recall which brew I put them in.....

 

[JMD87]

THere's still very little info on the web about them, after all these months.



I have to go through my notes...I can't even recall which brew I put them in.....

I've seen about the same information as you just posted. These hops have anything but a mellow character. I've also tasted the same style hops from a fellow Homebrewer that just recently used it, and again it was pucker city.

I was hoping this would be a quick turn-around brew, because it's a Hefe... but it looks like I might have to age it for a while until the bitterness subsides.

Still curious if anyone else has had the same results with Argentine Cascades

 

[Revvy]

Methinks, due to the number of responses on this thread, thay you an I are the only one's who have used them so far on here. So I gues we are S.O.L.....

 

[FSR402]

Methinks, due to the number of responses on this thread, thay you an I are the only one's who have used them so far on here. So I gues we are S.O.L.....

I've looked at them in the LHBS but that's about it. I never got any because of the low AAU's. lol

 

[hammacks]

I used them in a Amber Ale I just bottled. I'm not positive but I think I used 2 oz total for bittering and flavor. I'll check my notes and update. Yes it has a decent bite for such low AA, but I think it has more to do with the spicy character of the hops.

I only tried a little bit during bottling, so my judgement is pretty weak. I want to wait at least a few more days for a green sampling, but I'll let you know.

EDIT: It was 3 oz total.

 

[JMD87]

I used them in a Amber Ale I just bottled. I'm not positive but I think I used 2 oz total for bittering and flavor. I'll check my notes and update. Yes it has a decent bite for such low AA, but I think it has more to do with the spicy character of the hops.

I only tried a little bit during bottling, so my judgement is pretty weak. I want to wait at least a few more days for a green sampling, but I'll let you know.

EDIT: It was 3 oz total.

Wow 3 oz? That must have some kick. I only used .65oz of Argentine Cascade for bittering, and .5oz of American Cascade for aroma. I'm very curious to know how yours came out, please follow up!

 

[Revvy]

Just got home and looked at my notes....I used 1/2 ounce of AC's @ 5 minutes in my 2.5 gallon AG Cream ale w/lime experiment (the one I fermented in my old mr beer.)

I used 1/4 ounce of perle for bittering at 60....

I bottled it a week ago, so I will let you all know in 2 more weeks....My hydro sample tasted good if I recall....

 

[DeathBrewer]

a friend used some for a Koelsch...it was wonderful.

 

[FishinDave07]

Not sure if this helps but, when i took hydro samples of my hefe it tasted really bitter. It ended up perfect though after 2 1/2 weeks bottled.

 

[Revvy]

Not sure if this helps but, when i took hydro samples of my hefe it tasted really bitter. It ended up perfect though after 2 1/2 weeks bottled.

Good point...time is beers friend...

In fact I wrote something up about one of my beers on that very subject.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=73254

 

[Bearcat Brewmeister]

Sorry to go OT a bit, but I just used New Zealand Kent Goldings for the first time as a sub for EKG, so I am in a similar boat trying to figure out if this is a good substitute.

 

[Brian S]

I just finished up a Helles that employed A.C's. The hop flavor is defiantly not as refined as a true German, but it does have that earthy, spicy flavor reminiscent of the German nobles. This hop seems to be one that need plenty of time to mellow, which is a shame in your case cuz heffes are oh so yummy young!

 

[DeathBrewer]

Sorry to go OT a bit, but I just used New Zealand Kent Goldings for the first time as a sub for EKG, so I am in a similar boat trying to figure out if this is a good substitute.

well, here's one place that says they are pretty similar:

http://www.mountainhomebrew.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=4295

4.1% Alpha Acid. New Zealand Goldings are a good representative of the Original East Kent Golding with some additional flowery notes.

 

[JMD87]

Not sure if this helps but, when i took hydro samples of my hefe it tasted really bitter. It ended up perfect though after 2 1/2 weeks bottled.

What hops did you use?

That's reassuring at least... however I was planning on using it at a party Aug. 2nd. I planned on bottling on Wed the 23rd which leaves almost a week and a half. Probably not enough time but we'll see.

 

[Chriso]

Well, no, 7/23 - 8/2 isn't enough time, but not because of the hops... but because of the bottling. Always 21 @ 70F.

That's why I started kegging instead.

I'm voting "trust your beer", the bitterness should mellow faster than you think, especially if you're planning on putting fruit flavor in before bottling.

 

[hammacks]

So far the 3 oz AC's are expressed mostly as a piney bitterness. Not much else really. It does seem like there is some lighter spice notes masked by bitterness. A little bit of a peppy herbal taste too. No citrus/fruit to them. They will probably come out as it mellows out. It's only a few days old right now.

Now..to not waste anymore bottles until mature...

 

[Brett0424]

I've used them for flavor and aroma additions in a rye pale ale. Came out great, really went well with the rye, and I definitely agree they have a peppery/herbal taste.

 

[JMD87]

So I just bottled the hefe last night, and to my delight the bitterness was nearly gone. I'm shocked of the difference from a few days ago. Now I'm excited for this to condition, I'm sure it will be even better.

 

[hammacks]

Update on my Amber (bottled 1 1/2 weeks; 1 oz ArgCas bittering; 2 oz flavor and aroma)

Not much aroma. Still got some bitterness but mellowed to be quite enjoyable. I know it isn't characterized as piney, but I think it is a spicy, pine-like bitterness. Not much else.

 

[Magics5rip]

Old post, but thought I would bump it since I encountered some Argentine Cascades just recently.

Here is Harrisburg, PA the local homebrew shop had lots of these in stock so I purchased 2oz for my semi-hoppy ale brew (3.2 alpha was a good number for my initial hop addition). I will concur with what I have read in other posts; tasting some raw hop pellet had some bitterness to it. Not as much as the typical cascade, but a good bit of citrisy bite.

I had 2oz of lublin and 1 oz of liberty left over from other brews, so we'll see how this brew turns out with these argentines on the forefront!

 

[TexLaw]

Definitely report in, Magic. I intend on keeping these hops around, and I am eager to hear how everyone is using them. I am thinking about using them as a bender on a Bo Pils sometime soon. It certainly won't be authentic, but I bet it's good.


TL

 

[The Pol]

I used the Argentine Cascade in my Oktoberfest this year and that beer turned out awesome! I believe it spent 12 days in the primary and 2 weeks in the keg and it has been easy drinking ever since. I was happy with them as a substitute for Tettnang.

 

[jsullivan02130]

I used a couple of ounces in a Cream Ale (JZ recipe) as a substitute for Liberty. It is sitting in the primary and once I bottle and taste it I'll have to remember to report back.

I bought these by mistake thinking that they were American Cascade despite the warning on the bag (which I didn't notice at the store).

 

[Revvy]

I still have 3-4 ounces in my freezer, I'd like to come up with some use for them...

I guess to let the spiciness come through it wiuld have to be something relitively uncomplex in flavor.

 

[Kelsch]

I used the Argentine Cascade in my Oktoberfest this year and that beer turned out awesome! I believe it spent 12 days in the primary and 2 weeks in the keg and it has been easy drinking ever since. I was happy with them as a substitute for Tettnang.

I used 3 oz in my Oktoberfest as well. I just transferred to secondary last weekend, so I won't know how everything turns out for a while, but it's good to hear success stories. It had quite a bite during transfer, but I figured it would mellow out by the time I bottled. Good to know.

 

[The Pol]

I used 3 oz in my Oktoberfest as well. I just transferred to secondary last weekend, so I won't know how everything turns out for a while, but it's good to hear success stories. It had quite a bite during transfer, but I figured it would mellow out by the time I bottled. Good to know.

I used 2oz of 3.2AA in mine, your will be a little hoppier

 

[Kelsch]

I used 2oz of 3.2AA in mine, your will be a little hoppier

To be fair, it was a 10 gallon batch, and those were just my aroma hops. I don't mind a little extra hop kick, either.

 

[JMD87]

These hops are pretty unique IMO. I'm not sure if I'll use them again anytime soon, but it was fun to try. I don't think it was a good sub for Tettnag as the label claimed.

It was pretty interesting to see the difference one week made as far as bitterness. At two weeks it was almost undrinkable, and at three it was balanced perfectly. Ever since then I've been more like a 2-2-4 person as opposed to 1-2-3

 

[Magics5rip]

Definitely report in, Magic. I intend on keeping these hops around, and I am eager to hear how everyone is using them. I am thinking about using them as a bender on a Bo Pils sometime soon. It certainly won't be authentic, but I bet it's good.

Im using them in, what I classify as, american ale. Not quite IPA because of the ABV.

Anyway, grain bill was 37% light munich, 25% vienna, 25% bohemian pils, and the remain split between 1lb caramunich and 1lb carapils. I don't sparge too heavily because of equipment restrictions, but it did come in at 1.054 OG and using good ol California Ale yeast.

The fermentation smells spicy through the bubbler. I'll transfer to the carboy this weekend and dry hop with some normal cascades.

 

[climateboy]

They came as part of the Northern Brewer "La Saison Noire" kit. 2oz at 60 minutes. Spicy and complex when it went in the bottle a month ago...I'll give updated tasting notes this weekend.

 

[jsullivan02130]

OK, tasted my cream ale and my verdict on the Argentine Cascades is that I will not buy them again.

Not much positive in terms of flavor or aroma. I had a feeling what they would be like when I smelled/tasted some out of the bag, and that was pretty much what the end result came out -- a pretty blah hop, in my opinion. Of course, YMMV.

Part of this may be my first experience with cream ale, which is a pretty low-flavor brew by design. But compared to, say, American Cascade, the Argentine hops don't have much to recommend them. I'll probably use up what I have left as a later bittering addition and will definitely combine them with something else.

I used a couple of ounces in a Cream Ale (JZ recipe) as a substitute for Liberty. It is sitting in the primary and once I bottle and taste it I'll have to remember to report back.

I bought these by mistake thinking that they were American Cascade despite the warning on the bag (which I didn't notice at the store).

 

[Revvy]

I'm doing a SMaSh experiment with AC's and Marris Otter...We'll see.

 

[Magics5rip]

Im using them in, what I classify as, american ale. Not quite IPA because of the ABV.

Anyway, grain bill was 37% light munich, 25% vienna, 25% bohemian pils, and the remain split between 1lb caramunich and 1lb carapils. I don't sparge too heavily because of equipment restrictions, but it did come in at 1.054 OG and using good ol California Ale yeast.

The fermentation smells spicy through the bubbler. I'll transfer to the carboy this weekend and dry hop with some normal cascades.

As a follow up, this beer has a different personality as different drinking temps. When its ice cold, the hops come on very sharply to almost an unlikable harshness. However, when at room temp this beer is GOLDEN! Full body, moderate smooth hop profile and has a wonderful crisp aftertaste.

I'd like to make a beer that is straight argentine, drink it cold/warm and see if the same kind of pattern emerges. Single decoctoion worked really well for this beer, too.

 

[DeathBrewer]

you want to taste some argentine cascade in a commercial beer?? try some anchor liberty ale.

my friend proved it to me the other day. the bag of hops and the beer smell the same. i was astonished. they always advertise that it uses "cascade hops"...those evil tricksters. i actually had a few bottles that were too grassy during the hop shortage...i think they switched back to regular cascade or something for a while.

he said he thinks negra modelo also uses them.

 

[Malticulous]

I used over a QP in a amber. 1 oz FWH, 1 oz 60 min, 1 oz 30 min and 1 oz sprinkled in form 15 min to 5 min. Then I dry hopped it with a half oz. The brew had a harsh bitterness that mellowed quite a bit after 60 days. I grew to really like it and I'm going to make it again soon. I've had many commercial beers that are more harsh but it's probably not best as a bittering hop. Then again I've used it in many other brews and not gotten any thing harsh out of it with just one once or so total.