Are dry hops a catalyst for clarifying ale?

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jim_anchower

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I didn't see any allusions to this in searching the forum, but it has now happened three straight times... Adding dry hops to three different batches of ale in the secondary coincided with the very rapid (24-36 hours) clarification of the beer. In each case the beer had been upwards of two weeks in the secondary and appeared to have done all of the clarifying it was going to do. The first time, I added loose plugs before I went to bed, and the batch was crystal clear above a definite horizontal striation in the middle of the carboy when I woke up, and perfectly clear down to the yeast cake that evening. The second time I added plugs in a nylon bag without enough marbles to make it sink. The hops (in the bag) floated on top and the beer clarified in much the same fashion. I'm now watching the same thing unfold a third time...this with plugs in a nylon bag with enough marbles to make it sink...there is clearly less visible suspended particulate matter in the area right around the bag, and the beer has begun the same sort of rapid top down clarification after maintaining basically the same level of gentle haze for the 15 days in secondary prior to dry hopping. I presume this is common and expected, but all of the posts re: dry hopping are techniques and straining/filtering/racking suggestions and I didn't see any reference to the phenomenon... Is this typical? What's the science?
 
Oddly enough, dry hopping often is associated wih promoting chill haze. However, I can see how just dropping the bag into the fermenter could lead to shaking things up a little to start some precipitation, but I couldn't so much tell you why. Also, after dropping the loose plugs, some hop bits could catch stuff on their way down.

Are you doing anything else that could promote the yeast dropping out (for example, dropping the temperature)?


TL
 
Oddly enough, dry hopping often is associated wih promoting chill haze. However, I can see how just dropping the bag into the fermenter could lead to shaking things up a little to start some precipitation, but I couldn't so much tell you why. Also, after dropping the loose plugs, some hop bits could catch stuff on their way down.

Are you doing anything else that could promote the yeast dropping out (for example, dropping the temperature)?


TL

temps constant, not agitating beyond dropping the loose or bagged hops... in each case the hop addition was made immediately following the first removal of the plug in the carboy, but that reduction in pressure didn't strike me as significant... still scratching my head... beer went from looking like a batch that i didn't really go out of my way to clarify, which it was, to something out of a bloody coors commercial (but for the 15 srm...)
 
Could the charge of the hops. The proteins in hops as well as the acids are all of different charge, whether it be + or -. These charges could attract the opposite charge proteins and flocculate in the colloid causing precipitation and clearing of the beer. At least it makes sense, chemically. Large proteins have areas throughout the AA chain that are of different charges as well as lipophilic and hydrophilic regioins...really promotes binding of different amphipathic binding.
-Jefe-
 
Could the charge of the hops. The proteins in hops as well as the acids are all of different charge, whether it be + or -. These charges could attract the opposite charge proteins and flocculate in the colloid causing precipitation and clearing of the beer. At least it makes sense, chemically. Large proteins have areas throughout the AA chain that are of different charges as well as lipophilic and hydrophilic regioins...really promotes binding of different amphipathic binding.
-Jefe-

interesting...something is definitely causing it to clump up... i'm shining a surefire flashlight through the carboy now and can actually see little globules coming together and falling out - there is a clearly distinguishable, clear field emanating out around the hop bag...
 
I am about to bottle my second batch of beer tomorrow morning. I did a DIPA. I dry hopped with 2oz of Cascade Hops in a muslin bag. Now, I may be completely wrong here as I am learning every day and still have a great deal to learn, but I think I am seeing the same clarification as you are which is by dry hopping it clears up the beer. however, I think dry hopping may just be giving the illusion on clearing the beer but not actually clearing it up.


Here is my theory:


Think about it this way. If you were not to dry hop the beer and you shinned a flashlight through the complete diameter of the glass carboy with the beer in it chances are it would be hard to see out the other end. Now, when you add a Nylon or Muslin bad into the center of the carboy your backdrop or end point of vision (target vision) into the carboy is roughly cut in half. (depending on the placement of the dry hop bag) With this being so, the distance or amount or volume of beer you need to look through is cut in half...Originally, looking in one end of the carboy and out the other may not be possible because of the accumulation of sediment the scatters light along the way. Now you are judging the clarity of the beer as clearer because you are only looking to the muslin or nylon bag which is in the center of the carboy and in result gives the impression that the beer is clearer from all angles since your vision target is in the center of the carboy not completely through the diameter.

Furthermore, the dry hop bag is white, which will actually reflect light back towards you, further illustrating the illusion that the beer is clearer.

Again, I may be completely wrong, but my theory is that the dry hopping bag is helping reflect light and acts as a backdrop when you look into the carboy giving the illusion of clearer beer because you are judging the clarity of the beer by sighting the white dry hopping bag where as originally before the "Dry Hopping Clarification" you where sighting all the way through the deep, dark beautiful abyss that is Unfiltered Beer!

My two cents. Open to disagreement!
 
yeah , I would say no to the clearing. I dryhopped my SNPA clone for a week, and it got this haze that never went away in the keg.
 
I am about to bottle my second batch of beer tomorrow morning. I did a DIPA. I dry hopped with 2oz of Cascade Hops in a muslin bag. Now, I may be completely wrong here as I am learning every day and still have a great deal to learn, but I think I am seeing the same clarification as you are which is by dry hopping it clears up the beer. however, I think dry hopping may just be giving the illusion on clearing the beer but not actually clearing it up.


Here is my theory:


Think about it this way. If you were not to dry hop the beer and you shinned a flashlight through the complete diameter of the glass carboy with the beer in it chances are it would be hard to see out the other end. Now, when you add a Nylon or Muslin bad into the center of the carboy your backdrop or end point of vision (target vision) into the carboy is roughly cut in half. (depending on the placement of the dry hop bag) With this being so, the distance or amount or volume of beer you need to look through is cut in half...Originally, looking in one end of the carboy and out the other may not be possible because of the accumulation of sediment the scatters light along the way. Now you are judging the clarity of the beer as clearer because you are only looking to the muslin or nylon bag which is in the center of the carboy and in result gives the impression that the beer is clearer from all angles since your vision target is in the center of the carboy not completely through the diameter.

Furthermore, the dry hop bag is white, which will actually reflect light back towards you, further illustrating the illusion that the beer is clearer.

Again, I may be completely wrong, but my theory is that the dry hopping bag is helping reflect light and acts as a backdrop when you look into the carboy giving the illusion of clearer beer because you are judging the clarity of the beer by sighting the white dry hopping bag where as originally before the "Dry Hopping Clarification" you where sighting all the way through the deep, dark beautiful abyss that is Unfiltered Beer!

My two cents. Open to disagreement!

I hear you, and certainly no offense taken at the suggestion, but the first instance where I noticed this I was using loose plugs that scattered and floated at the top of the carboy... I'll try to get better set up for pics next time in case the same thing occurs I can send before and after shots... The effect was dramatic...basically, the brew went from cloudy to clear...everything that was suspended crashed and crashed hard in the day following the dry hop addition... I was planning to dry hop in keg for the first time next batch but going to use the secondary instead to see if I can snare some photos...
 
Again, My explanation was based 100% on observation and what I assumed to be a logically explanation. It sounds like the clearing you are talking about its far more dramatic and my theory is probably not a reasonable answer.

I would be interested to see before and after pics next time you brew!
 
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